Legion World Forums LEGION COMPANION Dr. Gym'll's Cultural Rarities A Look Back: Crisis on Infinite Earths #1-12

I think the scene where Jericho interrupts Batman touching The Flash is inspired from the Biblical account of Jesus telling Mary Magdalene not to touch him after he was crucified. We will be seeing the famous and often imitated "Pieta" cover, so I think Wolfman/Perez use Judeo-Christian imagery to connect with their audience.

Crisis #4

There’s a lovely perspective on the cover as we look form above down onto the Monitor’s body on a platform. Levitating above and to one side is his killer. It’s been hugely hinted at in the story, so it’s no spoiler. We’ve been told that The Monitor’s satellite is Tardis like, and this cover makes the most of it, reminding me a bit of the ancient city in Forbidden Planet. Pariah is shocked at the death and acting as a background to the cover is the destruction of multiple Earths.

Perez only (only! ) does the layouts this issue, with Mike DeCarlo finishing. The Perez/ Giordano opening issues are among my favourites. Behind the scenes, I think the work on this and Who’s Who meant that something was going to have to give. In the same way, that Wein and Wolfman were originally closer on the project but one had to pick up the reins of Who’s Who due to the work involved.

This issue also saw the repeat scene of the Monitor being confronted by Harbinger, at which point Perez became co-plotter.

The cover didn’t show cosmic lightning. This is made up for as quickly as possible by having terrible weather and anti matter clouds above a city scape. Perez has used advertising hoardings to provide the credits, giving the page a Eisner quality to it too.

Across the sky flies Supergirl. As a fairly new reader, Kara really stood out in Crisis and in recent Legion issues. She’s flying to meet Batgirl who she hasn’t heard from in months. It gives you a glimpse that a lot of the hero community know each other well , outside of work. Neither Kara or Barbara have been in a team together. But they know each other well enough to have shared some secrets.
As if that wasn’t enough Kara also informs the reader that she has lived through the destruction of a world. She was older than Kal El when she left Krypton. Her survival of the disaster is also the reason for her arc in this series.

The same situation applies to Barbara. One of the goals of Crisis was to streamline the mythos of characters. Having multiple characters with “Bat” in their title didn’t suit this. While it may have been hard for Batgirl fans, I thought this scene showed a very human response to the Crisis. Barbara is scared and full of self-doubt and doesn’t like herself much for her reactions. She sees Kara selflessly keep using her powers and then flying off to perform a rescue. That makes her feel even worse. But as the opening said, events has shaped Kara’s life differently. She admits to being scared too, but has worked through some of the issues Barbara faces.

This scene is supposed to set up having Barbara retiring from her costume. Other Bat characters wouldn’t get so lucky.

Crisis was set up so that writers would have to use The Monitor and Lyla, show weather patterns etc. Crossovers relating to early Crisis issues would happen in the individual titles and link into the main story. There weren’t many events happening in the main Crisis story as yet, that would lead the other way.

A very early one occurs here with the first appearance of John Constantine. He’s a bit different to what we’d get in Swamp Thing and certainly the early issues of Hellblazer. Here, he’s positive that the Earth won’t die as he can sense things, knowing what’s happening to “one and all.”

While Dayton and Constantine don’t play a further main role in Crisis, there would be a parallel Crisis in Swamp Thing. I tied this into Dayton’s downward spiral in Titans.
Later, Wolman would have to fit in many more requests, making the logistics of the later issues tougher.

Pariah finds himself on a world where there have been no duplicates. He wonders about that briefly as he watches the Anti-Matter cloud approach. His speech here has been the basis for the multiverses of Michael Moorcock and Bryan Talbot.

Pariah always seems to land near a planet’s superheroes making things a bit more dramatic. The remaining heroes on this Earth come from a house of nobles. Wolfman gets in a traditional fight scene of misunderstanding, as Lord Volt thinks Pariah is responsible for events. Volt and his wife, Lady Quark, don’t play around. They go for fatal use of their powers. Pariah turns out to be immune from anything. Handy. More Immortal than the Immortal Man bathing in a pool of regeneration.

Pariah had tried, and failed, to save a boy last time. Here he manages to save Lady Quark as her husband and daughter die. She doesn’t want to survive any more than Pariah wants to keep living through these tragedies.

Perez shows the end of that world in 16 monitor shaped panels, and we switch to The Monitor’s satellite.

...Continued...

The Secret Origin of Doctor Light

The Monitor creates a new Doctor Light believing that she alone will have the power to stop The Foe. In a Japanese observatory, a rude, rather cruel, angry, driven woman called Kimiyo Hoshi stays after the others have left for their families or more relative safety. The laws of physics have changed allowing observers to witness cosmic events in detail they would never have had before.

Kimiyo looks to Vega, just as she sees a burst of energy erupt form the sun. Spatial distances have warped and the energy obliterates the main telescope of the observatory. Kimiyo’s dad has kept up with lots of Superhero clashes. Despite the destruction, he knows the difference between a Vegan solar flare brining instant death and energy that’s able to teleport someone away.

Crisis Reread Crossover!: Omega Men #26

From what I know of the Titansverse, I always thought Kimiyo’s origins would end up being related closely to a return of X’Hal. Possibly we’d see some massive Omega Men/ Titans crossover again. Bear in mind that Wolfman was the creator of the Omega Men and the Vegan links to the Titans, so it’s a natural crossover.

Kimiyo was slated to be part of the Titans book after the Crisis. She appeared once (I think) and that was about it. But, as I mentioned with Constantine, this issue was beginning to have cross overs, and there’s a mention of Omega Men 26. Which I got when I was getting other Crisis issues a few years back. I’ve not actually read it, so let’s take a look…

An ancient Psion satellite observes Vega. Legends have grown up around it, suggesting it’s a guardian of some sort. Today, it sends out its alarm just as a flare form the sun destroys it. In the Okaraan legend it is The Fury of Vega. Across the Vegan system, beings give pause.

Nimbus arrives, heading towards the sun, seemingly aware of the nature of the threat in an attempt to stop it. He encounters Auron, who has a different view and the two clash.
Nimbus streaks down to the star, passing through some sort of zone of spirits, where he meets fallen Omega Men. In the star, he meets a giant, monstrous version of X’Hal. She thinks she has discovered a way to release her from the immortality that drove her mad: The complete detonation of Vega.

She begins the process, only to be stopped by Nimbus. He is a lifeform connected to the creature that assaulted X’Hal and fathered Auron, who seems to have gone mad too.
As the shadows of Nimbus, clash with the stellar power of X’Hal…

“On the star’s surface, the clash of immense energies worsens the solar storm—hurling deadly ion streams through the system! Waves of gravity ripple across billions of miles – gathering a growing flotsam of asteroids and small moons!”

Some of these bodies leave their orbit, as Nimbus tries to absorb the darkness in X’Hal and Auron. They sink towards the centre of Vega and the star seems to stabilise.

While all this has been going on, there’s been the parallel plot of the Omega Men returning form a battle, against the Spider Guild, in a crippled ship. Despite all their work, a near sacrifice by ELU, and the Green Man giving up his power ring to join them, the ship goes dark as the waves of energy from Vega hit it. We’re told that the star nearly went nova.

The ship is then eaten by a giant space worm, which you’d prefer to see should they ever redo the Legion’s Moby Dick of Space.

Back to Crisis. The Monitor sent a beam of energy into a star that was already sending out streams of energy across billions of miles. A stream of energy came out of the star in response to the Monitor’s beam.

The Monitor could just have sent a beam of energy directly at Kimiyo. That he didn’t, means that there’s something in Vega that’s relevant to her origin. As we’ve just seen in Omega Men #26, Nimbus, Auron and X’Hal have just battled to the centre of that star. The star looks peaceful here when the Monitor’s beam hits it, so it looks as though the beam was sent to the star just after the end of that battle, when it began to stabilise.

We see Nimbus later in Crisis, so it would suggest that the beam is related to either Auron or X’Hal. There’s not a blatant link given in Crisis or Omega Men. It’s not mentioned in Doctor Light’s Who’s Who page. But it fits well with what we see. Auron’s powers had grown to rival his mothers, so whoever The Monitor tapped into, Kimiyo is hugely powerful. Which is exactly what the Monitor was looking for to counter The Foe. She’s not given the powers, as much as recreated with them.

Here’s the DC Sampler with the original version of the revised Doctor Light in it.

Crisis #4- Continued

The Monitor watches the reaction of Doctor Light’s father in the destroyed observatory. Harbinger watches the Monitor watching the reaction of Doctor Light’s father in the destroyed observatory. Alex Luthor watches Harbinger watch the Monitor watching the reaction of Doctor Light’s father in the destroyed observatory. You are watching Alex Luthor watch Harbinger watch the Monitor watching the reaction of Doctor Light’s father in the destroyed observatory. Just don’t turn around to see who’s watching you watch Alex Luthor watch Harbinger watch the Monitor watching the reaction of Doctor Light’s father in the destroyed observatory!

If that wasn’t bad enough, Harbinger threatens to destroy the Monitor. A plot point that she had passed by at the end of the last issue.

The Monitor doesn’t just monitor you know. Nope. He also tells his precognitive visions to Alex Luthor. Luthor knows that Harbinger is going to kill The Monitor. He’s completely resigned to it. For a tiny baby, he certainly knows a lot about people’s emotions. Both he and The Monitor think its part of a bigger plan. Only Lyla will feel the pain and the guilt. Off she goes for the second time on page 10- to reach that earlier plot point.

If writers are going to make their cast precognitive, then I’m as well just skipping to the end if everything is so destined.

Rather than see Harbinger get on with it, we skip to The Foe. Psycho Pirate thinks he had a choice in joining forces with The Foe. It reduces the villain form cosmic force into Mega Villain. The two are looking to capture Red Tornado. The Foe disrupts Reddy and then teleports him. Remember these powers because The Foe will make absolutely no use of them later on in the story.

On one hand The Foe tells Tornado about destroying a universe. On the other, he’s promising Pirate that there will be a world to control at some point. A new world. Clearly something has been left on the cutting room floor. The other option is that he’s precognitive too, but he’s surprised at the turn of events later on, so it’s not that.

We don’t see Reddy put up a fight, as we switch to the time of Camelot. It’s just Firestorm and Frost here. Wolfman has them joined by The Shining Knight, but one of the four who went to the Wild West should really have been here. Psimon probably as Green Lantern and Firebrand are a bit close to Firestorm’s concept and Cyborg’s technical skill might have been needed. Prof Stein supplies that here.

There’s nearly another fight of mistaken identity, but the Shadow Demons come forth again from a machine. There’s quite a few of them here. Justin sees that the newcomers are heroes and joins them against the demons. The demons again don’t cause any damage to the machine they are there to destroy.

Like Cyborg, Firestorm seems to be of the belief that the Shadow Demons “fold in the crunch.” Either some fight scenes got edited out, or the threat level of the demons attacking the satellite in #1 wasn’t executed properly. “They’re hardly a real threat,” thinks ‘Stormy who had to depend on The Monitor in the first issue.

In the background Vandal Savage looks on, wondering how he can use find out what’s going on and use that knowledge to conquer the world. It’s a nice touch to see him there, but eventually he finds finishing his drink more important than the battle on his doorstep. Justin uses his sword to channel the Crisis lightning from the sky and into the demons. It’s a trick I don’t recall him using in the A:SS but presumably that’s just my memory.

‘Stormy gets a condom joke into a code approved book, as the shadows retreat above them. However, the Demons then merge together. They form a giant Monitor shaped figure and it happens simultaneously at all the mission sites. Loads more Shadow Demons must have arrived considering that the final shape looms over the Golden Towers of Kirby.

The mission teams, and the allies they’ve met along the way look on in shock. The allies, such as Kamandi, have filled in the gaps that reinforcements were meant to take.

In the Wild West, the heroes are moving rubble in the mine, while the tower is unprotected above. Psimon is still not seen, reinforcing the idea that he’s dead. That seems to be the most vulnerable tower.

The Monitor sent five teams to defend the five towers across eras of heroism. Five points where the worlds could be saved. Well, Earths 1 & 2 anyway. I wonder why Blue Beetle never questioned that.
(Behind the scenes, DC still weren’t entirely sure what they were going to do with the Charlton heroes, so their inclusion in Crisis wasn’t always a given)

Earlier issues made a big thing about there being five towers to protect and activate. A sixth tower suddenly appearing in Metropolis undermines all of that.

Protecting this tower is the new Doctor Light. Starfire, presumably still upset over Tamaran goes into attack., accompanied by Halo. We’re quickly shown what Kimiyo can do, as she blasts them back. Although Kory is seen absorbing energy on a regular basis, she can’t take this in. That might be due to Kimiyo’s light having a Phantom Lady darkness quality to it.

Both Superman and Katana speak Japansese, and its Supes who defuses the situation. Katana is kind of stuck in this scene, and has been frustrated at what she could do. But she’s not the only one. Batman becomes the Bat Stander pretty much from this point.

Wolfman’s scenes will work at a power level that reduces a lot of the cast to bystanders for a while. There will be opportunities later on to fight other forces and events, but nothing that makes much difference against The Foe. It’s something that got fives by the time JLA/Avengers finally came around, with Bats having a more active role in the solution.

As part of Kimiyo’s recreation, The Monitor informed her of all his plans. She probably knows about Harbinger too. Everyone else on the satellite was in on it.

Superman makes an ominous “…and I’ll sacrifice my own life if need be” comment. Who will live? Who will die? In the end, this Supes is wiped from continuity.

On Paradise Island, we learn that the Gods there won’t be able to help. Further, Diana has had a falling out with her mother and the Amazons won’t be helping here either. It nicely takes care of one of the major DC pantheons, much in the same way the Guardians were taken out earlier, while providing a look at what’s going on in Wondy’s book. As she’s not in costume, will she be back to help in the Crisis? We’ll find out later, but so far it’s been Wonder Girl in the front lines.

Pariah appears in the Monitor’s satellite. It’s probably the first time in a while he’s been somewhere that isn’t a dying world. So, there’s almost some calm as he talks to The Monitor. But it’s his powers that will have brought him there. That means that’s where the threat is, as they’re about to find out.

There’s a suggestion that The Monitor has known Pariah for a very long time. The Monitor says that he created Pariah’s abilities and purpose. Yet in Issue 1, Pariah told Supes and Bats that legends of the pair had reached his world. So how long ago was that? Something else else to look for when Pariah’s origin issue comes around.

The Monitor seems to be set up to be a redeemer while Pariah takes on the role of the immortal wanderer, a witness to everything until the end of time. Harbinger is a betrayer, yet one who like the others has little free will in the tasks they must undertake. Lots of symbolism with the characters Wolfman has added.

I wonder if the character who would become Pariah was ever supposed to be The Phantom Stranger? The Stranger has been seen to have many of the same abilities, and it would have provided him with an origin of sorts. The Stranger would have prominence in the Legends series. That had Darkseid as the villain, and an alternate Crisis plot could easily have had Darkseid destroying life in the Multiverse for the solution to the anti-life equation.

As they talk, we see the disasters rage across the eras. Firestorm and Dawnstar are injured; the Giant Shadow forms being able to control the Crisis Lightning. Perez gives us a lovely double page spread of this. The Hawks, Blue Devil and Zatanna (yay! JLD!) are rescuing people and a monitor blows up in front of Brainiac 5 in the 30th century. In the Wild West the team there can only really retreat. The Geo Force/ Polaris partnership still goes strong. They work well together.

The Monitor tells us that Earths-1 and 2 are inextricably linked. We never find out why this is, even as the others worlds share a lot of similarities.

The Monitor tells us that The Foes is always able to move faster as he is unfettered by morals or restraints. Shades of Jekyll and Hyde, which will become relevant shortly.

The Monitor quietly adjusts some controls as Harbinger finally arrives to pick up where she was at the end of last issue. Her energy blast shatters the Monitor’s armour and he falls. The energy projection adds yet another Plot Power to Harbinger.

A confused and stranded Pariah is left unsure what to do as we see the Anti Matter sweep through the Earths. We see the characters on missions. All for nothing as Pariah’s face fades to white and then the worlds of the universe follow. Pariah does what he does best. Cries a bit.

In the absence of matter, smoke like darkness fills its place.

That's an interesting idea, Emily, though I still need a good reason for Jericho to do this other than "I'm drawing allusions to Jesus." Too many heroes have Messiah complexes.

Comments on #3



It was an excellent grounding scene, showing us the impact of what was going on, without it escalating to the point Pariah appears. It also gets points for being a set up to the arrival of the Hidden Sixth Tower and to provide a place for the ongoing Flash subplot. The following Brainiac page is really a set up for much later on in the story too.



I’ve not read many of the US war comics either. I think it’s a bit out of place too. I used to think it was DC paying homage to one of their genres, just as we have a mission with the Western characters. But that fails a bit as I don’t remember many scenes with their romance characters popping up.

Bill: Oh Jill!
Jill: Oh Bill!
Both: Oh noes! We’ve been caught kissing by our Aunty Monitor! How will we convince her our love will last?!


I think seeing the ghost in the Haunted Tank provided a connection between the war and the super hero genres.


I got my dad some Bat Lash comics on the back of that fact. But he firmly prefers Groo and Mad.



I read Kole here before newsstand Titans. I kept thinking there should be more stories with her in them. There wasn’t much time between the reveal of her past and her death and, as you say, it looked as though she had worked with them for a while.



Such a good point. I liked Kimiyo best in #1 of the JL. She had stood out in Crisis because she learned about selflessness and heroism from the rest of the cast and it changed her. No one is perfect and I excepted a fairly short fuse. In JL #1 she’s proactive in her non-hero identity. Her goals are noble. Kimiyo is also useful in the action. She breaks off any association with Lord while all the others gradually get drawn in.

But it didn’t cross my mind at the time that there weren’t loads of characters from all over the world. More representation would allow for such a growth in characters, but there never was.



I reckon that this power is from the beings that were part of her origin that got quietly shelved if not just forgotten about in the mass of Crisis information, as per my earlier post (Kid Plug)



Sales Assistant: Weren’t you shopping for kids pyjamas just five minutes ago, Mr …ah… M’Onitor… must be French…?
Monitor: Ah…my son… is a fast grower…
Sales Assistant: Hmmm… and where is your son today…
Monitor: Oh, I’ve got him wired into a machine to teach him a lesson.
Sales Assistant: >horrified< What?!
Monitor: Yes, he must learn all about human emotions, the future and language before teatime.
Sales Assistant: And you’ve abandoned him there?!
Monitor: >chuckles< Oh No! My demonically possessed assistant will take care of him…perhaps permanently if she ever remembers her orders.
Sales Assistant: >on phone< Hi is that that child services…



Five years for making a false insurance claim for the only kid on her block that didn’t get killed by a Shadow Demon in #12.



I think you can safely put that down to an off panel save from the Amazing Kole!



Before committing to the Brother Eye project Batman did a trial run… as the Wildebeest! Wilson is just the patsy in all of that.



The Crisis is beyond time, space and even the morality of the majority of supervillains. More on that towards the end.

As for the Shadow Demons they are just moved around to make the story more interesting, without really acting on any sort of plan.



I like his outfit more with each reread. He should be brought back, unless its time for another Johnny Thunder of course.







Behind the scenes, and despite what the forewords and interviews say, DC was rolling things up in an effort to sell itself off. The reductionist approach to their universe was to make strong, singular concepts more appealing to their new buyer. It could be that Wolfman was already inspired to go down this road, and that the story was well underway. But that’s the corporate mandate for the series. Wolfman even points it out as the premise for The Foes’ success. The multiverse should have been one, but was split into a multitude of weaker universes.



Again, I think you’ve highlighted that the reasoning behind Crisis, form DC’s perspective, comes through even with the other layers over it.

I’m not bored rereading it and I can’t feel short changed over something I’ve taken massive enjoyment from in the past. You can drive a universe to safety through the holes in the plot. The Hand Of The Plot God leads everyone through by the nose more with each reread, as you point out in the paragraph where you say “I feel like I'm being forced to sit through a movie where the moral is predetermined”. But that also opens up possibilities of what could have been. And that’s grist for the Bits Mill. So, I’m skimming through the stuff I did a few years back for posting.



I’m with Ficklestand on this one. Harbinger is being used to commit murder without much free will. Pariah has been led around the multiverse by the nose form one tragedy to the next. Alex Luthor has been kidnapped and force-fed information by The Monitor. I do agree it’s like a Greek Tragedy. The foreshadowing they had was like being beaten over the head with a scroll. And that’s what this is like. Nura would say “Precognition is never getting to enjoy a murder mystery.” And so many people know about The Monitor’s fate I’m surprised we’ve not seen it as a newspaper banner in each of the Earth’s we’ve seen destroyed.







I think this is inevitable in such a series. Anything more than what we get would be to drag the series down into the Ocean of Exposition. Wolman gives us Kory showing he unashamed display of emotion, which is central to her. We get wisecracking Beetle, and his backstory is nicely added into the plot, when something goes wrong.

Likewise the Solivar/Kamandi relationship works nicely because the team are in The Great Disaster, not swapping stories on the satellite.

Which is the point I pick up from …






We’re going to get plenty of infodumps later on. But true to what’s been said about the purposes of the series, these revolve around the history of the DCU including the Guardians etc. rather than any characters.



Interesting spot Emily. Monitor, Harbinger and Pariah fill roles – Monitor as Messianic Redeemer, Harbinger as Betrayer and Pariah as … well you’ve a couple of cursed Witness legends to pick from.



The department of straw grasping suggests… There’s the difference to seeing Flash turning up normally, and then one that turns up surrounded by a crackling energy field that makes him say “Oh, no—I—I feel so strange…what’s happening to me?” Joey’s worked with Wally a few times. It works just the same if you saw someone reach out to someone being electrocuted. Maybe?

Just as well. When Flash’s face is pulled apart, I might have been reminded of Legion #300 when one of Mordru’s demons does it to Rokk. Icky!

On the 15:-

From the original plots, the heroes had to find the devices as already mentioned. So, there are holdover character for that tracking function.

They would then have to arrange for the construction of the devices and activate them which would require technical abilities.

One character would have a link to the era they were in, providing some local knowledge.

Finally, the towers were to be protected until activation and until their effects were felt. SO, a powerhouse character was picked for that.

Atlantis
Local: Arion
Powerhouse: Arion
Technical: I guess Obsidian gets the schematics, but it’s not a good fit.
Tracker: Psycho Pirate (control people to tell them where the point is.)
Notes; Arion was on the Death List as his book was being cancelled. Psycho Pirate is there, as Ibby says, for further subplot.

Wild West
Local: Green Lantern (following JLA crossover there)
Powerhouse: Green Lantern
Technical: Cyborg
Tracker: Psimon (psychic senses/ control over populace to tell them where the point is)
Notes: GL was to be injured, possibly feeding into the return of Hal Jordan? However, Jordan was briefly considered for termination too. Green Lantern: Guy Gardner anyone?

Great Disaster
Local: Solovar (has form of locals)
Powerhouse: GA Superman
Technical: Solovar (king of a very advanced scientific society)
Tracker: Dawnstar
Notes: GA Superman’s story is part of the spine of the book.

WWII
Local: Geo-Force
Powerhouse: Geo-Force
Technical: Blue Beetle (Ted Kord is a gadgeteer)
Tracker: Doctor Polaris (Magnetic Powers)
Notes: Geo Force provides a link to get the war genre into the book.

Camelot
Local: Shining Knight (who is right at the scene saving Monitor some space pennies)
Powerhouse: Firestorm
Technical: Professor Stein
Tracker: Shining Knight (through some magical means?)
Notes: Shining Knight was a way to get sword and sorcery characters into the book. Silent Knight etc could have shown up, but we got Vandal Savage.

Comments on #4



As I’d not really read anything with her in it, I didn’t have any character reference to go on. SO I’m not surprised that it didn’t match. I do think that the arc is a good one, but is there a hero that it could work for? After this scenes, I had expected Barbara to pop up later in the story. She wouldn’t be in costume, but would be helping others as Barbara Gordon. But that never happened.



Kara and GA Superman are both very strong, inspirational characters here. Partly as…well… like you… say…



Tangent Posts Presents! Moore’s ending for DC’s Watchmen is similar/comes from/inspired/lifted from/to The Outer Limits episode The Architects of Fear. That episode has an actor called Janos Prohaska whose name would be used for the identity of DC’s Blackhawk!



I started the issue thinking he was going to be all “Lor-love-a-duck! That Aunty Monitor is a right bleeder and no mistake!” Small mercies.





And why didn’t Starfire swoop in for a language transfer kiss?!



I was going to wait for #5, but Harbinger’s orders were “to kill the Luthor child.” Something else else that she’s utterly failed to even attempt.



I was never sure what Savage was supposed to do. I just saw him putting a knife into a table on a JSA cover, standing in a JSA flashback and having a drink by the balcony in Crisis. Maybe he had a date with one of the DC romance characters who was running late?

Jill: You know, Vandal, when you said I looked good enough to eat, I didn’t think you meant it literally!
Vandal: Oh No! Will my cannibalistic impulses ruin yet another relationship! >sob<
Read more in “Who’s Cookin’ For Dinner!” a Crisis Crossover Event!




I’ll be watching to see what happens to those big Shadow Demons in #5. Could it be this whole part of the plot was fluff? >gasp<



Well the Monitor did say the Crisis was one of emotion and both camps wanted Psycho Pirate.But if this scene had happened later, with a Psycho Pirate controlling things, I would feel that it lost some of its honesty.




Like the Blue Devil on the JLA satellite later, it’s a launching point into another book. In the case of Swamp Thing it really grows into something very dark and weaves in and out of the Crisis. But yeah, for the purposes of internal consistency it’s a look at one guy getting drunk at the thought of the end. Which actually sits well with the tone of the Barbara Gordon scene.



Pariah has already bounced through time, so it’s possible.



Quark’s name was a hook to hang their post Crisis DC Comics Presents hook onto.



Blast destroys observatory.
Mr Hoshi steps forward into the ruble, shouting for his daughter.
A bright light appears.
Monitor: Sorry for that Mr Hoshi. But you’re very rude daughter just wouldn’t get out of the way. Now, let’s see about giving you these Doctor Light powers…




another plot hole.



New introductions post Crisis would have to make do with slapping Batman around to show how much cooler they were. This one is much more visual.



Something else else that doesn’t always apply after Crisis. Certainly not in this calm, inspirational way.



I don’t mind the little plot capsules. They add a bit of depth, and they might help readers pick up the Wondy book. They’ll have to be fairly quick, since it will get cancelled too.



Good spot! Pariah must have made another stop along the way. Since he only stops in disaster zone, she must be really loving him.
I have little time to wonder, as we see how bad the Crisis is: Earth-2 is affected too. Nice two-page spread showing tons of other characters and settings, including a few making their first appearance in the story.




Good point. It really helps the pacing too, not having to slow up for people to over-explain their reasoning

thanks for sharing thothy! interesting that she was originally conceived as African. why the change I wonder? for more diversity? because Asia tended to be even less represented (though Japan is proportionately more represented than say China or India, with Katana also being around)

I remember vaguely Kimiyo’s appearance in a Teen Titans annual. she was described as being a new and inexperienced hero, which was true. and she was certainly nicer and more cooperative than in her debut , but still more sure of herself than in the JLE days

then Infinite Crisis came and made her backslide in her initial Justice League appearances, being extremely condescending

Since we are discussing various Earths, does anyone here know where I got the idea that Shazam's universe was supposed to be Earth-5 but they chose Earth-S due to printing issues? I swore I saw it in an Index, but I have not been able to find the source. I chalked it up in the past to a fan site, but I wonder if I read it in a tie-in comic.

There's definitely some sort of issue about not being able to distinguish between Earth-5 and Earth-S in the lettering used in comics. I don't remember exactly how the story goes, though.

I always did wonder if it was Earth-5 or Earth-S. I assumed it would be Earth-S because of Shazam.

A few (hurricane scare-) belated thoughts on Crisis # & 4 before we move on....

-gotta admit, when I saw both Kole and Kid Psycho prominent on the same cover, I thought this might be Kole's last stand. Memory's fuzzy, but I now think this happens much later.

-It's fascinating to me what some of you have revealed that Barry's book hadn't yet ended at the time Crisis began, but it spoils where he ends up, if not the exact circumstances involving Iris. This version of his apparent demise is different. Here, he's seemingly torn apart, where before he is broken down to a skeleton and to dust. That's a big difference, unless here it's just his image breaking up?

-I like Brainiac's brief appearance here. I remember being a fan of his recent revamping along with Luthor. I like that he is afraid, and it helps portend a larger role for the villains later.

-Some good use of many of DC's prominent WW2 characters. No appearance by the Blackhawks, though. Were they not yet incorporated into Earth-1 continuity? I feel like they might yet appear in Crisis but not sure.

-Was Flower a prominent member of Easy Co.? I haven't read a ton of Sgt. Rock, but Flower didn't really ring a bell for me.

-The Losers die. I'd never heard of them at the time, but there deaths were stirring for me at the time. A bit less so, now, as I relate more to that amazing New Frontier sequence by Darwyn Cooke.

-Did Solivar die? It sure seems that way, yet the Monitor refers to withdrawing two injured combatants. These are clearly Blue Beetle and Solivar. Do we see the gorillas mourn him at some point? In any case I like Kamandi's attachment to him and how others here elucidate upon why there's such a connection.

-Kid Psycho...so random and so out of context. A safe death of a very obscure LSH character. I'd rather he had died of using too much of his power, either here or elsewhere. At the very least, I wish he's gotten more of a moment than he did. As it is, his potential is just wasted.

-Batgirl. Unlike some of you, I liked the humanity displayed in her scene. It seems realistic that some of our heroes would feel helpless in the wake of such seeming inevitability. And it kind of resonates with some of her then-recent solo adventures in which she was shot and sometimes mulls retiring as a hero. But we should take it as just that: a moment. We can assume she will rise up from her doubts and stand up as hero in the balance. I don't know if she appears again in CoIE; I think she does. If not, I know she will inevitably fight the good fight, whether "on-camera" or not.

-I do love Supergirl's appearance here and how it gives her some heroic context outside of her upcoming death.

-That weird Constantine/Steve Dayton scene...was that essentially a plug for Swamp Thing? Did Steve Dayton also appear in some of those issues?

-Yeesh! Kimiyo was pretty mean in her first appearance, eh?

-Interesting that the only named character death (I think) this issue was the Monitor. After all the mayhem of issue 3 and with other time periods being visited, you would have thought there would be more cannon fodder. Well, I guess you could say the ending implies everyone dies, so maybe that would have been overkill?


Overall, a nice pair of issues, though overall my favorite to this point is issue 2. I will have to disagree with Huey (a.k.a. He Who Wanders), who says (paraphrasing) that he finds the storytelling overall dated and is becoming bored with it. For me, this kind of storytelling, of the Bronze Age specifically, is some of the most enjoyable of my comics-reading experience. I know he qualifies this by saying he likes it better in LSH and how it is done better over there, but I just thought I should put some Bronze Age love in there. Comics have overall lost some magic with its modern trends of decompression, style-over-substance, often unnecessary overuse of splashes and loss of narrative voice in the decades since.

Edit: Oh, I must apologize! I re-read Huey's post and realized his criticism of Crisis is entirely based upon itself and not on the age it was published in! Poor memory at work! All apologies!

Note: It was my intention to review the Legends of the DCU Crisis Special after issue 4, where it is said to take place, but I've been unable to locate it. If/when it turns up, I will review it here.

Appealing to buyers, perhaps, but not necessarily to fans.

I always loved the multiple earths concepts and never understood why DC argued it was a barrier to new readers. What they probably meant was that they needed to dumb it down for prospective buyers.



Good to hear about those arcs. I couldn't remember them, and they aren't hinted at or foreshadowed in the first three issues. At this point, the only characters I have to care about are the three I've mentioned, and for the reasons I've mentioned. In asserting her equality and annoyance at being ignored, Harbinger at least gives me a reason to connect emotionally with her even though her actions are directed from outside.




I was referring to the comedic approaches of Anthro and Bat Lash since I'm not familiar with those characters. The Anthro scene did nothing to endear him to me as a character since he came across as a boob who wins by accident more than design. I'm only assuming that's what his series was like.

I also don't think we need a lot of exposition to develop personalities and relationships, though I grant that something would have to give in order to make room for such developments. Again, I think Wolfman did a great job with what he had to work with, but it's like a doctor being given ten times as many patients. Something else else in terms of quality is bound to be sacrificed.




Those are some mighty thin straws.

As fans, we go to great lengths to explain things that are unexplained in the stories. I think these explanations show our love for the characters and how we want the stories to make sense even when they don't. They also make the writers' job a little easier.

Yeah. Kole makes it all the way to the last issue before... *sob*



Only appearance I can remember is a flashback at the end, after the restart of time, where Harbinger says the Freedom Fighters and All-Star Squadron were on the same Earth. A Blackhawk was present.




I can't find the source, but I read that Flower was supposed to be Easy Co member Farmer Boy. He wasn't very prominent though.



There would be a scene later on where Solovar is being treated by Gorilla City doctors. None know how he was injured, and even Solovar himself doesn't remember his experiences.



Very true. Kid Psycho was the Legion's secret weapon BECAUSE he was so powerful.



I completely agree that I also expected Batgirl to rise above her fears. I don't quite remember that happening though. The only other appearance of hers in Crisis, that I remember, is her deliveirng the eulogy for Supergirl.

I was pretty sure I remembered Barbara eulogizing Kara. I just read issue 5 and saw her among the throngs showing up in the Monitor's satellite, but she doesn't get any lines. But like I said, whether on-camera or not, I have faith that our girl came thru somehow.

Considering that she continued being Batgirl for a few years after Crisis ended, she definitely did! And even after becoming crippled, she reinvented herself as Oracle.

I hope AnnFick is ready to move on to issue 5--I really enjoyed it and can't wait to discuss it!

The way he’s pulled apart does suggest he somehow dies here, but yeah, it’s just the image. The Foe’s reason for doing this to the Flash when he arrives to meet Batman is that Barry can cross universes. Yet, he doesn’t teleport Superman who’s right there who has bounced across time and universes too. More on that next issue.
The fate of the Flash is to have his death repeatedly teased, before it finally happens.



I liked Brainiac in this series too. An early back issue I got was a beat up issue of Action comics where the JLA have to combat his robotic form and he was creepy there too.
I didn’t quite know how Brainiac 5 managed to be descended from the robot though.



I think Roy Thomas was flying them between Earths to make it all fit. If they appear it might be out of their planes or in one of the issues time merges. Something else else to watch out for, as I’d be very surprised if they don’t appear somewhere. They got a nice pic in History though.

Every time I see the likes of Commander Steel, Sargon or Blackhawks just hopping over to live in another universe, I wonder about all the connections they’ve left behind on the other Earth. There’s never a sense that they leave anything or anyone important behind.



He’d been around for a while, but not used much. I think he was the Kid Psycho equivalent for the writers of Easy Company. Someone they could put up for elimination in Crisis, without having a major impact on their stories.



The New Frontier sequence is along similar lines to the Losers Special that came out around Crisis. So if you liked the first…



There’s a bit later on where Solivar reappears injured in Gorilla City. No one, including Solivar remembers how it happened due to it being on the New Earth.



Kid Psycho’s arc was always likely to be him sacrificing himself heroically. But I agree, it should have been like Chemical King’s, after overexerting his powers. Probably against a single Big Foe too.
There is something to be said for the indiscriminate nature of his death here. It could stand for all the other deaths occurring as people try to save loved ones.
You could run a parallel series of human stories taking place in the Crisis. We get a couple of glimpses of it later on.

As I mentioned, I thought he was going to be a new member (having wondered if he was a past member and scanning the few issues I had without success)

Lost Tales: On the Post Crisis Earth, Kid Psycho appears in #14. “You gave me a special status before, and now I have inhibitors to prevent my powers affecting me.” Tellus is booted out and Kid Psycho and Mentalla join.



Thanks for the info. The notes I’ve read on Crisis seemed quite clear that she was going to retire, and I had wondered if it had come up in previous stories.



I’m fairly sure she pops up for Supergirl’s service. While Doctor Light is inspired to be a hero, Barbara is inspired to hang up her cowl. They were really firm on her retiring. Of course, that wasn’t enough…



Even as they were trying to shut down Supergirl related things (no Legion membership, no JLA membership, solo book cancelled, Superboy team up book cancelled) creators got to say final goodbyes to her, and she’s a star in every one of them, including here. I’m not surprised she’s a character that didn’t go away for too long, even if she had to come back in versions.



Dayton plays a role in Alan Moore’s parallel storyline. It involves loads of DC’s supernatural characters. I’d have to reread it, but I wonder if what Crisis would have looked like, if the Foe in Swamp Thing had replaced the one in Crisis.

Like everything Moore, Morrison nabbed a glimpse of it for Mageddon in JLA.



It doesn’t look as though she gives a card for father’s day, that’s for sure.



I’ve never thought that the body count (as in died rather than rebooted) in Crisis was particularly huge considering what was happening.

EDIT: I see some of these have been answered.

I shall post my comments on Paladin's review of Legends of the DCU Crisis Special after issue 4, … here...


… no, here...

It took me a long time to realise that. Although I’d read one letter not long after Crisis spelling it out, it wasn’t until various reboots made me lose interest it clicked.



I’m not a huge Marvel reader, but I got the feeling that Marvel didn’t use all of their parallel universes frequently and certainly not in the same way (although HWW’s lists show that a Squadron Supreme series is out)

Not much later on, Excalibur had a romp across loads of parallels (they were a big part of Alan Moore’s run on the strip). I wonder if that also served as a joke at DC’s expense, showing them all the fun they had deliberately destroyed.







If it was up to me, I’d just have had the energy around the Flash be a bit more crackling, and shown Jericho as closest to Bats. “Ozone fills the air around them, crackling with danger. Mute since childhood, Jericho’s silent scream in unheard as Batman reaches to help his friend.”

So, they all feel it but haunted by what he saw earlier, Batman reaches for The Flash anyway. Jericho is simply in a closer position to stop him.


I thought Crisis was it for Batgirl. I wonder if her still being in the costume was anything to do with the delay in relaunches for the other books, and a soft boot of Bats (mainly Jason Todd’s origins)

The multiple earths concept was one of the things that differentiated the DCU from the MU. Corporate logic, though, is that everything has to be the same. Innovation is risky. Differences must be "brought in line" with other expectations. People who buy and sell companies tend not to be creative because originality involves standing out, taking risks, and occasionally thumbing one's nose at market expectations. Marvel, for example, succeeded precisely because it created heroes who were unlike those who had gone before. Now DC wanted to imitate that success. [/rant off]

The Squadron Supreme started off as a one-shot parody of the JLA, but, over time, they appeared more and more, culminating in their own limited series. Even then, Marvel still pushed boundaries. Since the book was set on another world, the creators could do things they couldn't do with the regular titles, such as



So, yes, Marvel did not use alternate earths frequently, but when they were used, the creators got the most out of them.

By the time Excalibur appeared, I was reading fewer and fewer Marvels and DCs, so I missed out on that series. I recall hearing it was quite fun.

My impression is that Marvel felt a lot more free to explore its multiverse once DC eliminated theirs.


Anyway, I was reminded the other day how absurd it was that DC started publishing their Who's Who series a month before Crisis came out. So you get this weird result that the earlier entries are clearly detailing pre-Crisis history which was no longer relevant by the time the series finished, while the later entries cover post-Crisis stuff that doesn't fit with the earlier entries!

The Marvel Universe exploded in the 1990s when time-travel plots became prevalent due to villains such as Kang and Apocalypse. It was definitely in Excalibur or Captain Britain that the term Earth-616 was invented.

I have read a lot of Who's Whos published during the Crisis, and I really enjoy them. It is cool to see early Todd McFarlane art in the Infinity Inc. entries. They have been examined by a lot of podcasts already, but if we want to dissect Who's Who or the Marvel equivalent, that would be fun.

Hey, Legion Worlders,

Thanks for keeping this thread going. I've been following your posts the best I can, and have enjoyed them greatly.

Since, as I've shared in the Shoutbox, I've become a Busy Bee of late, anyone is free to post a review of CoIE #5. I will jump back in as soon as I can.

Thanks again.