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Re: Re-Reading the Legion: Archives Volume 21
Fat Cramer #953993 07/19/18 02:15 AM
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Quote
The cover is overly busy. The Khund and the poster work. But then we have three Legionnaires in close, mid and long shot added. A space scape and a Legion cruiser are needlessly put in too. Only the first part works.


It is like two covers combined. Either lose the Khund or the Legionnaires and cruiser.

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The opening scene where Dirk stops a Khund assassin is supposed to inform the reader of an assassination plot while having a light tonal touch.

Madre de Dios! I woke up in bed with Sun Boy! The scene does illustrate Dirk's confidence and easy-going attitude, his defeat of the Khund seems almost effortless.

Quote
Behind him Dreamy makes a snide remark and Element Lad calls her on it. Perhaps this comes from her last encounter with Thom, when she was thinking about how important the Legion was. Just an issue ago, the two seemed fine, but there is tension there.


This seemed out of sorts for Nura, who seemed to have achieved some balance with Jan - so I attribute it to tensions with Thom. Jan isn't giving her a free ride, however. Maybe he's learned to cut the sniping in the bud.

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Unfortunately for him, Jacques warping abilities activate when he’s threatened to a certain level (but after Darkseid – actually I wonder if there could be a connection between them activating and the Boom Tube technology he went through in GDS). Jacques teleports him into space, killing him.


The boom tube connection makes a lot of sense! The writers could have used that to explain the teleportation and the instability of that power. At least he didn't turn into the Hulk when threatened.

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We don’t learn much about surprised candidate one. Candidate two, Leung, has written a paper on streamlining government. That makes me wonder just how much bureaucratic fat there is in the UP. How do they all feel about a computer using a paper to point it out to them? The third candidate Mojai Desai is much more confident. His family have been leaders since the time of caste (see also The Dominion) He seems to be in a position of some power already that enables him to bestow wealth and comfort. That makes me think about Leung’s paper again.


I guess she got an A+ on that paper. You raise a good point about Desai's wealth and how he's operated in his own region. The computer gives the people a chance at efficient government, but they go for the hope for hand-outs. Prosperity versus austerity.... I'd like to have read their campaign promises.

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There’s a lot to learn about Drake in this scene. The Lightle visual of his suit having absorbed the energy is a favourite.


The suit is well done. And the behaviour is pure Wildfire at his ... what? neither best nor worst. Sulkiest, perhaps. He's no doubt been in a bad mood since Dawnstar left and gets to take it out on the Desai family with rude manners and the Khund with power.

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While it would have detracted a bit from a very strong scene for Gim, it could have also provided Yera with an opportunity to show her skills.


They could have fought as a team (did they ever?), but I guess this was meant to be Gim's personal fight, defending his Mom. She should have hired him as her full-time bodyguard.

Quote
Desai’s confidence was well founded and he’s duly declared the election winner. At his side is vid-gupta, with a villainous (and distinctive) twinkle in his eye. Vid-Gupta (clue in the name) is known to Desai. Considering the plans Vid-Gupta has, I’m reminded again that no one asks who programmes the election computer. I doubt vid-gupta would have shown up at the side of the other two candidates. That means the computer has been tampered with. How long has that been going on and how often will it happen again, are questions could be a long time in being answered.


Oh, I hadn't thought about the computer being tampered with. Of course!

Quote
Continuing the Orando plotline, Brin meets Karate Kid’s teacher, and we find out that Brin has inherited billions from Karate Kid, as his heir, Projectra has moved the planet elsewhere. There seems to be plenty of danger in fulfilling the terms of the request. But Brin is prepared to do it. It’s good to see him sense the approach of Sensei, and also to move away from the sometimes moping, sometimes comedy duo with Blok routine. Points to Levitz for not just settling in on one view of a character, which is all too easy to do.


Just as Ayla had to leave to find herself, Brin gets the opportunity to come to terms with his life on this adventure. Had he stayed at Legion HQ, he might have been caught in an endless cycle of moping and Blok-comedy. I don't know if the Levitz intended that, but it works (or can work) in real life. And he won't have Tasmia and Tinya around to put him down either. (The Terrible Ts Tease - a new superpower.) Another thing I like about this situation is that Brin doesn't seem to care particularly about the prospect of great wealth; is it because he just doesn't care about money or that his senses are dulled by depression?

Originally Posted by HWW
Oddly, the one candidate whose face is shot out in the candidates’ poster is the one who gets elected. I don’t know if this is meant to be foreshadowing, but, as I recall nothing comes of it.


I was wondering if there was some greater meaning behind this, or if it was just a visual effect.

Quote
It’s also odd that the Interlac word on the left-hand side of the cover reads “Vote.” Yet the candidates are all selected by computer as is the eventual winner. I’m unclear on who was voting or why it was necessary for Senor Lopyt to campaign.


It's not specified here, but in the previous election, the computer chose candidates and the people voted.

Quote
The concept of computers electing the president makes me think of the Electoral College and the recent debates over its validity. In the 30th century, elections have been taken even further out of the hands of the voting public. The “leveling” the Electoral College is supposed to create is taken to extremes. But, it was 1985, and we had much more faith in computers than we do now.


True! Computers were going to manage everything. Then we got Windows... The Legion itself allows members to choose themselves to run for Leader, no computers involved except to tally results. There's also thoth's suggestion of tampering, which could apply even if citizens voted, as we sadly know.

Quote
This may be the first Legion issue in which I’ve admired the art more than the story. At best, the art and story have complemented each other for excellent narration and breathtaking visuals. More often, it’s the writing I gravitate toward, regardless of the quality of the art. But here Lightle shines (pun semi-intended). His faces are distinct and attractive. The action scenes move the story along with clear, concise images, and the mood is palpable, especially in the Brin/Sensei scene. (Kudos must also be given to Mahlstedt and colorist Gafford.) Unlike previous issues, in which Lightle seemed cramped to include so many visuals, here he has the space to stretch out and breathe. That’s one advantage of Levitz’s wafer-thin plot.


It would have been interesting to see the script. How much of the action scenes were described to Lightle, or did he just run with his own ideas? Regardless, the result is, as you say, admirable.

Quote
Originally Posted by thoth
The third candidate Mojai Desai is much more confident. His family have been leaders since the time of caste (see also The Dominion) He seems to be in a position of some power already that enables him to bestow wealth and comfort. That makes me think about Leung’s paper again.



It would have been interesting to see these two square off in a debate. Ah, missed opportunities.


A debate would have been fascinating! And too bad that Leung never made another appearance; she's clearly interested in government and to be chosen as a candidate must change one's life.


Holy Cats of Egypt!
Re: Re-Reading the Legion: Archives Volume 21
Fat Cramer #954036 07/19/18 10:51 AM
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Originally Posted by Fat Cramer


Quote
It’s also odd that the Interlac word on the left-hand side of the cover reads “Vote.” Yet the candidates are all selected by computer as is the eventual winner. I’m unclear on who was voting or why it was necessary for Senor Lopyt to campaign.


It's not specified here, but in the previous election, the computer chose candidates and the people voted.


Thanks for the clarification. I couldn't remember how Marte was elected.

It does raise more questions. Since voters now have one day to choose, they don't have the opportunity to get to know the candidates or watch them develop or modify their stances on issues over a period of time. Are voters supposed to go with their gut feelings? Like answering a personality quiz, the first response is the best one? Perhaps this system is meant to give candidates less chance to be dishonest and the voters less chance to rationalize their biases.

Quote
Quote
The concept of computers electing the president makes me think of the Electoral College and the recent debates over its validity. In the 30th century, elections have been taken even further out of the hands of the voting public. The “leveling” the Electoral College is supposed to create is taken to extremes. But, it was 1985, and we had much more faith in computers than we do now.


True! Computers were going to manage everything. Then we got Windows... The Legion itself allows members to choose themselves to run for Leader, no computers involved except to tally results. There's also thoth's suggestion of tampering, which could apply even if citizens voted, as we sadly know.


Windows 10--yeah! laugh

The Legion's first election was determined by computer. I suppose this was meant to get the team started and, with only three members, eliminate the possibility of everyone voting for him- or herself.

The notion that candidates are chosen without first deciding to run for office is troublesome. It reeks of totalitarianism or at least English monarchy. One thing I've gleaned from Downton Abbey and The Crown is that there's no legal mechanism for someone to refuse to be monarch or even an earl. Abdicating the throne, as Edward VIII did, is costly and creates uncertainty in a realm which depends on an orderly and predictable transition of power. It's unclear how much of this lack of an "escape clause" applies to the 30th century election process. There's no indication that candidates can turn down the nomination. However, Marte resigned as president--so it's okay to quit after you've been elected, apparently. (In this sense, the president seems similar to a prime minister. )

The built-in assumption appears to be that it's good to be president and no one would want to refuse. There also seems to be a sense of duty to the community outweighing the needs of the individual (a common theme on The Crown). Ironically, this is very much at odds with the individualism championed by US comics and US culture in general at the time.




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Re: Re-Reading the Legion: Archives Volume 21
Fat Cramer #954068 07/19/18 08:58 PM
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More Comments

Originally Posted by HWW
Oddly, the one candidate whose face is shot out in the candidates’ poster is the one who gets elected. I don’t know if this is meant to be foreshadowing, but, as I recall nothing comes of it.


Yeah, I was expecting a scene where the candidate is killed and replaced. But our villain doesn’t need to do that to get control. So, its less a bullet hole and more the shattering of the mind of the targeted character.

Originally Posted by HWW
It’s also odd that the Interlac word on the left-hand side of the cover reads “Vote.” Yet the candidates are all selected by computer as is the eventual winner. I’m unclear on who was voting or why it was necessary for Senor Lopyt to campaign.


The final winner is elected by the voting public, with the candidates elected by computer, from what I remember form an earlier story. Presumably the one where Marte Allon got nominated/elected.
I reckon that, even though the public voted, that the votes are tallied by computer and that this has been rigged. I see Cramer commented on this one too. smile

Originally Posted by HWW
1985 was not a national election year in the US, though Ronald Reagan began his second term as president shortly before this issue was published. I can’t help but wonder if this issue is meant to comment on the inefficiency and bloating of the US election process. In the Legion’s time, candidates are selected by computer, and those selected are not professional politicians (though Mojai might be). They cannot spend months or years campaigning, running media ads, and slandering the opposition. Strangely, Blok asks if humans cannot choose their leaders in a simpler manner, but that’s exactly what’s happened here. I wonder what Element Lad means by “we’ve tried.”


Thanks for the background, HWW. I think its exactly a commentary on political systems, much like the Allon one was too. I think the “we’ve tried” form Jan is really the writer expressing frustration with the systems used in our time.

Things are much better in the Legion’s time when a member can join and use the bylaws to oust everyone else in a villainous coup…um…

Originally Posted by HWW
The concept of computers electing the president makes me think of the Electoral College and the recent debates over its validity. In the 30th century, elections have been taken even further out of the hands of the voting public. The “leveling” the Electoral College is supposed to create is taken to extremes. But, it was 1985, and we had much more faith in computers than we do now.



…I mean, trust in a computer to tally votes, safe in the knowledge it can’t be got at….er… or that there’s a villain called Computo around…um…

Originally Posted by HWW
The story itself fails to grab me. It seems all over the place, even though there’s a consistent theme… But these are just crumbs of stories. There is no cookie.


I think that can be one of the downsides to the Levitz approach. It’s important that there’s a sufficient payoff to each issue and movement in each scene. That means that there’s a pacing to the subplots, to make sure that there’s always enough drama/action in each issue, and that they don’t all fall into quiet moments. Otherwise, although there might be plot progress, the little ensemble pieces don’t add up to enough within a single issue.

The last few Baxter issues have been closer to the line than anything in Tales for me. Things like the character moments HWW mentions help to offset this.
Levitz could have had teams protecting each candidate, with a Khund squad for each to increase the action. I prefer that we got to see more of individuals. Besides, having a squad would have interfered with Jacques subplot. So that was possibly on purpose.

Originally Posted by HWW
A couple of plotlines are advanced—Jacques accidentally kills a Khund and may be the next Legionnaire up for court martial (after Dawnstar, of course); Rokk announces his leave of absence and hints at further changes in his life. (As a reader then, I thought he was going to propose to Lydda; I was disappointed when he didn’t.)


A Rokk/Lydda marriage seems like a probable outcome of all this, although it becomes a bit of a boring tease with the length of time its taking him to tell anyone.

Originally Posted by HWW
Unlike previous issues, in which Lightle seemed cramped to include so many visuals, here he has the space to stretch out and breathe. That’s one advantage of Levitz’s wafer-thin plot.


As the team develops, hopefully we’ll see more of Levitz finding a good pace for Lightle to express himself. Also, where Lightle’s work inspires Levitz plots.

Originally Posted by Cramer
Madre de Dios! I woke up in bed with Sun Boy!


Well, it was his turn. There’s probably another computer election for that.

Originally Posted by Cramer
True! Computers were going to manage everything. Then we got Windows...


After a century or two of that, people were happy to put up with Planetary Chance Machine v1


"...not having to believe in a thing to be interested in it and not having to explain a thing to appreciate the wonder of it."
Re: Re-Reading the Legion: Archives Volume 21
thoth lad #954125 07/20/18 07:55 PM
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Originally Posted by thoth lad


Levitz could have had teams protecting each candidate, with a Khund squad for each to increase the action. I prefer that we got to see more of individuals. Besides, having a squad would have interfered with Jacques subplot. So that was possibly on purpose.


I totally agree about the focus on individuals. As I said in my own post, it makes the Legionnaires look like professionals if only one of them is needed to guard each candidate--and they all succeed in their missions.

What's missing in the story for me is that there is no central character to root for, no one to focus on (except Jacques, briefly), no climax, resolution, or denouement. The story just isn't a story.

Several months ago, I watched some old episodes of Hill Street Blues on YouTube, and I found them very instructive. Even though there's a lot going on and several interweaving storylines, every episode still felt like it was complete. Maybe this is because most (all?) episodes took place during a single day--from roll call in the morning until late at night. I think, however, that Frank Furillo provided us with a focus--someone to root for, someone to sympathize with when he had to deliver someone bad news or find out what had happened to his officers. Through Furillo, we came to admire, sympathize, and relate to the other officers and detectives. Most TV series of this nature have had such a viewpoint character (Dr. Westphall on St. Elsewhere, Michael Kuzak on L.A. Law). When the viewpoint character leaves, the show inevitably suffers.

The Legion, of course, has never quite worked this way--although Superboy was its central character for many years. The role of central character changes with leadership elections, and Jan is only now coming into his own as an admirable and confident leader. If there had been more Jan in this story, it might have worked for me. However, it could also have focused more on one of the candidates--but we get only bits and pieces of who they are.

So, Legion 10 is a story without a central character to me.

Ironically, growing up with Levitz's Legion, I thought this was "good" writing--very similar to real life. But now I understand why the story felt incomplete to me even then.


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Re: Re-Reading the Legion: Archives Volume 21
Fat Cramer #954300 07/24/18 02:33 AM
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Tales #323 Triumph... and Tragedy by Mindy Newell & Paul Levitz, art by Dan Jurgens & Karl Kesel, Colors by Carl Gaford, Letters by Ben Oda

[Linked Image]

People on Kol's planet are dying and it's accepted as the will of Kol, although some question if Jhodan consorting with demons is the cause.

Brainy and Dawnstar reunite; Jhodan attacks him until Spliff, "Kol's mystic", intervenes. Dawnstar realizes that Brainy understands Jhodan and asks to learn his language, since she may stay with him. Spliff finds the computer reel Brainy took and is angry.

At the temple, the Reverend Mother comforts Ina and absolves her of blame since she swiftly reported Jhodan's alliance with Dawnstar. Rand becomes Ina's new teacher, but she mourns for Jhodan. The Reverend Mother also mourns Jhodan's betrayal and wonders if his faith truly has faltered. As she prays to Kol, a lightning bolt hits the temple.

In space, Gigi relieves Shvaughn as Dev-Em's partner in the Black Circle infiltration.

Jhodan questions Brainy about the computer reel; he lectures Jhodan on minds closed by dogma. Dawnstar criticizes Brainy for his disdain of the culture and comforts Jhodan. An angry mob approaches, hurling rocks, blaming the strangers and Spliff for the death of their children. A tornado appears, which Jhodan takes as a sign of Kol's displeasure and Brainy sees as a coincidence. As they return to the temple, they encounter more mobs blaming them for the children's deaths.

As Rand and Ina in military gear prepare to capture Jhodan and company, Ina begins to fall ill. As she collapses, Brainy examines here and admits he and Dawnstar are responsible for the illness, but not because Kol is angry with them. An earthquake strikes, Rand falls into a crevice and Dawnstar saves him.Aiwan arrives with more priest-soldiers, captures the group. Brainy, Dawnstar and Spliff are bound to a semi-circle platform to be killed. Brainy wants to get free to access antibiotics in his ship.

On the Dark Circle world, Dev-Em is unmasked yet overconfident, until he realizes he can't fly away and is vulnerable. He awakens imprisoned and weak with kryptonite poisoning; a Dark Circle member says they already got what they needed from him and that his scorn for the Legion will help their plan.

As Ina lies gravely ill, Jhodan questions why Kol would punish innocent children. Rand speaks up to defend Dawnstar when Aiwan calls her a witch. After speaking privately with Aiwan, Jhodan addresses the crowd and renounces his association with Dawnstar and Brainy. They are released and Jhodan rejects Brainy's offer of medicine for the sick children. As he leaves, the computer reel falls from his robe and Brainy picks it up as Dawnstar weeps.

Epilogues: Brainy meets with President Desai, who tells him that a vaccine has been seeded in the atmosphere of Kol's planet and an expedition is planned to research the planet's link to Earth's 23rd century Great Wars period. Brainy wants to join the expedition and warns of a dangerous force of nature operating on the planet. Dawnstar reflects on her time with Jhodan and the emotions she experienced. She's distant with Wildfire and brushes off his questions about the man she met. When he leaves, she vows to return to Jhodan someday.


Comments:
The splash page with Dawnstar throwing her arms out to Brainy is one of my favourites. There's a lot of emotion there, all the more striking for two people who bottle up their feelings.

The soldiers and the priests are the same, which I didn't get in the previous issue. They just wear different clothes. Warrior priests, not so unusual.

Brainy and Dawnstar infected the planet, but only the children. That makes it rather more heartbreaking and leaves the adults free to cry for revenge. It does raise the question of whether there were original inhabitants of this planet wiped out by the Earthlings who arrived to build the present society. There's an interesting ethical question raised since Jhodan refused medicine for the dying children, but the U.P. went ahead and sprayed vaccines anyways. If there were unintended consequences, however, we'll never know.

Brainy's easy-going attitude vanishes as he collides with the closed minds imposed by Kol's religious order. He can't think his way out of this one, though - and it's only Jhodan's submission to the Reverend Mother that allows the Legionnaires to go free. That's unusual for a Legion story; they generally manage to battle their way out of everything.

Dawnstar mirrors Ina to some degree; she has loyalty to her fellow Legionnaire, but is siding with Jhodan when Brainy attacks his religion. Just as with Ina, the choice is made for her and she returns to the Legion. Had Dawnstar stayed with or returned to Jhodan, she might have been an agent for gradual, positive change. Rand changed his view of her based on their experience, when she saved his life. Dawnstar appreciated the spiritual aspect of that society, unlike Brainiac 5, who, in this issue, condemned and imposed his "enlightened" views (although in the Epilogue, he's talking about an unknown force of nature on that planet, not coincidental natural events).

Ina continues to be torn between her devotion to Jhodan and to her religion. Sadly, we never see the end of her story, whether she lives or dies, stays as Rand's novitiate or returns to Jhodan.

There are plenty of unresolved stories here. Mindy Newell, in the Legion Companion interview, suggested that she bit off more than she could chew with this story, too many ideas that didn't come together. These all could have been resolved if the story arc had continued, but it was dropped. We don't know what was on the computer reel, if Ina survived, what happened with the expedition, what was the deal with the nature force which so concerned Brainy. Dawnstar may spend a panel or two in future issues remembering Jhodan, but she never tries to return. So it's ultimately very frustrating to reread this story and know that these questions won't be resolved.

Ironically, in the letters column, Chris Miller asks for a future history of the DCU, the time between the 20th and 30th centuries, and is told that it will be made clearer in the Crisis series. Was this Legion story supposed to link to Crisis in that historical sense, with its big mystery about the 23rd century? I don't recall such details from Crisis (and have ordered the book from the library to find out) but does someone here know if there was such a connection? I also couldn't find anything on-line that Mindy Newell said regarding her ideas of where the story of Kol's planet might go.


Holy Cats of Egypt!
Re: Re-Reading the Legion: Archives Volume 21
Fat Cramer #954355 07/24/18 04:40 PM
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TotLoSH 323

I didn’t pick up the finale for this story for some years, possibly ten at least for some reason. The baggy with this back issue comes with a very detailed sticker, telling me everything except the date I bought it. It was from an outfit that I mainly remember getting concessions in big stores. They had a much more technical approach to their inventory, compared to the other guys who just put little price stickers on the baggies. They ended up allegedly involved in some shady comics practices to improve the gradings.

As a body burns and we’re told a sickness inflicts the land, an old man dismisses stories of what we’ve seen in the last couple of issues. It seems like a fair amount of time has gone past for a sickness to take root in their society, and this comes over as a framing sequence. It could almost have been an elderly Jhodan failing to come to terms with the effects of the visitors to their planet. A quick peek to the end shows no old man or final look at a village coming to terms with the effects of the plague. It’s an interesting introductory page, but there’s no pay off to it.

There is a mix of cultures still in evidence, reminding us of the depth in Newell’s world. All of the main cast have been essentially travelling this world since the opening panel. Perhaps there’s a small incubation period for the disease, explaining why it’s spreading and killing so quickly. Ina will be carrying it back to the temple too.

Dawny and Brainy, two of the most reserved heroes on the team, give each other a genuinely warm embrace. Dawny then immediately distances herself, which fits her personality nicely. Brainy is a bit more in tune with himself. In truth, he always has been, as seen with his first appearance “be my girl” chat to Supergirl. The balance between his caring and analytical mind comes across very nicely in Newell’s dialogue. It’s a nice moment, that I’d hope to see carried on in some friendship capacity in later issues (v4 not recognising Bounty is a big minus on this relationship).

It lasts all of a few seconds as Brainy is tackled to the ground by Jhodan. Plot wise, this attack occurs so that the data reel is discovered. But Jhodan comes across as petulantly jealous. Perhaps Ina actually got some of her attitude from her teacher? We learn that Jhodan defers to Spliff, who turns out to be a Mystic of Kol. Having calmed the situation, it’s then Spliff who remonstrates with Brainy over the reel. Later, Spliff has settled back down but wants the reel returned. Jhodan recognises it as a tablet of Kol. The access to such tablets is restricted to Awian.

It’s interesting to see Brainy fib to try and keep hold of the reel. Both Spliff and Jhodan recognise it (although they must be hidden in a number of temples) while Brainy pretends it’s nothing. Although Jhodan refers to it as a tablet of Kol, he hasn’t said what his understanding of Kol is. That doesn’t stop Brainy going off on a rant about the world’s religious dogma closing them off from other possibilities.

The main issue is really that the data is only accessible by a single person, not the providence of the information. Brainy has figured out the chronology of the data and knows the rough origin of the people. But he hasn’t bothered to determine the historical context behind the world he sees. It’s a blind spot brought from exasperation, but it makes him as closed as the people he’s criticising. Dawny is quite right to call Brainy on it. Her own faith is different and provides a third cultural viewpoint in the story. Newell gets a lot of credit for providing strengths and weaknesses of each position.

The sickness is really spreading and the villagers turn on the group. Spliff seems to have been involved in angering them too. He seems to either be precognitive or directly able to influence Kol through his role as a mystic, as a tornado suddenly appears (Red Tornado and Blue Devil on the same world? smile ).

Awian also seems to have a direct connection to Kol’s storms. While everyone is blaming Jhodan’s actions for events, its Awian questioning Kol that seems to start it. She keeps a picture of Jhodan in her office. There’s a connection between them that runs deeper than just their positions in the order. That she perhaps treats Jhodan a little differently doesn’t sit well with what we’ve seen of the order. But she’s just as quick to declare Jhodan a heretic. She carries out her duty, even if she still trusts Jhodan’s faith.

While the readers are privy to all the information Brainy has, it’s nice to see him be the one waffling over the coincidental tornado that suddenly appears to be bearing down on them. Determined to hold his position, despite coming from Earth which has a weather control system. smile Again, it’s credit to Newell for reminding us that everyone is fallible. It’s also a switch to see the scientist being the one to come up with a clearly incorrect hypothesis, and the people of Kol knowing exactly what it is.

Brainy had also involved Dream Girl in sharing some responsibility for their predicament. On one layer Dreamy, as acting leader, authorised the experiments and dispatched the two to search for their missing colleagues. But on another, we’re reminded of her past where she altered Ayla’s powers to make her Light Lass.

As they travel back towards the temple, the extent of the illness is revealed, but the walking Venturian credit doesn’t drop into place. By looking to help in each location they go to, they would make things worse. The disease is targeting the young. We don’t see any evidence of it affecting other vulnerable groups, so is the disease influenced by Kol? Brainy thinks of the villagers as a mob. Jhodan retreats inwards, thinking of himself as an outcast. But the villagers may well be doing exactly the right thing. A lesson for both worldviews of Brainy and Jhodan when faced with the reality of the world people actually live in.

The group run into the Arms of Kol, including a sickly Ina. In battle, Dawny retrieves a sword and threatens Rand before stopping herself. This would have been the scene that last issue’s cover was based on. There’s not much choreography in the battle. A Kol-initiated earth quake (Kolquake?) separates the combatants. There’s only Rand and Ina (Since Ina collapses, it’s only Rand), so the Arms of Kol are actually outnumbered until Awian turns up with reinforcements. Had Awian appeared at the same time as Rand and Ina, we could have had a more effective battle. The subterfuge set up to disguise the sleeping party seems a little wasted. Still. It does allow the confrontation between Awian and Jhodan at the temple more power, I guess.

With the others captured, Dawny gives herself up, and they are all placed in the Arch of Agony as threatened earlier on by Awian as she departed with her troops. Newell gets the chance to show off her background as a nurse as Brainy diagnoses Ina’s condition. If only she could be sued as a comics consultant for other writers when this sort of thing comes up smile

We don’t see the arch actually do anything. It does resemble Awian’s staff of Kol though, so perhaps there’s a connection there.

As they await their fate on the arch of agony, Brainy continues to fill in plot blanks or “computing” as Dawny calls it. He recognises more structures as 23rd century starship parts. That one has possibly been overdone. He also confirms that it was they who brought the plague to the world. The Legionnaires are inoculated against various diseases, but the locals are not. Considering the number of lost worlds and distant eras the Legion has visited, it’s about time this sort of thing was brought up. But it would slow the action to a crawl every adventure as the team go through testing procedures. A way round this is to say that their transuits would normally protect the local lifeforms. But when these malfunctioned on Kol disease spread.

Elsewhere in the temple, compromises are reached. Jhodan concedes he’s a betrayer of Kol, in respect to the innocence of the others who have been struck by disease. He can’t recant if such punishment is meted out to the innocent by a jealous and vengeful god.

Having had his life saved by Dawnstar on a couple of occasions, Rand defends her from Awian, even in the face of a spot on the arch of agony.

Awian calls Jhodan “my son” and I wonder if that is why she has his picture in her office (it looked like a photo – did that tech survive? smile ) She tells him that the visitors might have been a test. She tells him that his love for Dawny is pure. But these are just the openings of negotiations. Jhodan rejects Brainy and Dawny from Kol, freeing them in the process and waring them never to return. Brainy thinks that Jhodan has chosen his religious ignorance to being with Dawnstar. He’s missed that Jhodan has sacrificed his love for her freedom.

All of which is very odd as Awian isn’t really in a position to negotiate on behalf of Kol. If Kol is annoyed then it has certainly shown it directly. What part did Kol play in Awian’s plans? Enough to return the use of technology to the Legionnaires. Enough to allow Jhodan to gift Brainy the data reel.

Which makes sense of Brainy’s assertion to President Desai (points for keeping up with Baxter) that the planet contains a force of nature and that it is expecting their return.

Decisions made behind closed doors and favours being asked of Kol and seemingly granted doesn’t look likely to prolong the order of things there for long. It might actually be Rand who’s the main agent of change.

Despite Jhodan telling Brainy that Kol did not need their help, the UP has vaccinated the world by satellite. Despite Jhodan telling Brainy that he must never return to the world, the Coluan immediately volunteers himself for an expedition that Desai is launching to visit.

Considering the time taken for Dawny and Brainy’s return and the quick deaths of the children we saw in the story, I don’t hold out a lot of hope for Ina. She was possibly older than a lot of the victims which might help her.

Last issue I suggested that Dawny and Johdan were intimate in the night they spent together. In the final scene Dawny thinks to herself that “I’m no longer innocent… I know what it is to love a man.” Dawny’s brief time with Jhodan immediately changes her relationship with Wildfire. What she thought was love for Drake has been eclipsed by something stronger. Drake is smart enough to immediately know what’s happened. Actually, he had a premonition of it last issue. He takes it well, and there’s that constant dark thought that shapes so much of what he does: “I’m not a man.” Dawny looks out at the stars, determined to return.

Except no one did and none of these subplots were followed up. That’s fine. Comics are littered with loose plot threads. But did this stack up as a story? On balance I’d say yes.

The development of Dawnstar’s character was significant. This was a moment of real potential for her, as she launched into the opening issue of Crisis. Her relationship with Drake was challenged. A knock-on effect from this story should have seen some changes in him too. With the try out issue coming, as well as a trans time Crisis, it should have been a strong time for Wildfire too.
Their last scene in this issue was as powerful as anything in this era.

Newell’s work in this story reminded us of the emotional side of Brainiac 5, even as he indulged his curiosity at every available moment. He was shown to be vulnerable, and rationally fallible. He had to figure things out as he went rather than having everything appear in a convenient plot dump.

We don’t get to find out if Kol was sentient and, finally encountering beings from outwith its system, using events to make stronger connections. We don’t know how it could disrupt technology or use its power through The Core and deliver manna. But, in the end, it’s an enigmatic addition to the Legion’s universe like the Puppet Planetoid and the Antares of the Llorn.

Considering what happened to Red Tornado during Crisis, a world which he could control the environment of isn’t such an off the cuff suggestion. smile

The depth of culture on Kol and its underpinning theology and Newell’s handling of it in the story were big plus points.

Jhodan made a compromise. Perhaps he broke this to give Brainy the reel. Perhaps Kol was involved here too. But his choice made, his arc in the story ends well enough. Likewise, having brokered/ enforced whatever deal there was to make, Awian gets a world that returns to normal. With the UP’s vaccination no doubt being hailed as the work of Kol, faith may be even stronger than it was.

We don’t see what Awian has learned as she took Jhodan through the compromise. There are some things she doesn’t seem to grasp about the nature of Kol, but she’s a lot closer to it than anyone else there. We’ll never get to find out if her position would change when faced with Kol’s plans for the future.

One definite plot link was Desai’s intention to send an expedition there. Considering who he’s under the thrall of, this could have opened up a further story nicely. His master is a man very interested in history, and weapons and knowledge of a lost Great War would be useful to him. It would also get a certain Coluan out of his way.

The subplot running through this issue was Dev-Em’s continued infiltration of the Dark Circle. They confront him and disable him using Kryptonite. The sight of Dev-Em half encased in a Kryptonite chamber is a harrowing one. There’s plenty of sign posts on what the Circle intended to do here. But I’d not have read those until later. Considering his power, that’s quite a threat to the Legion. Just imagine that was Superboy.

Newell was on dialogue duty for the next two issues. I think that was her last involvement in the Legion? In her interview in the Legion Companion, she recounts the unusual way she came into the business, and into the new talent programme. Karen Berger was the Legion’s editor at the time and the mature output of DC was beginning to take shape. Once Vertigo got started, I’d have liked to have read something from Newell. It would have been a fresh voice amongst all those whiny-protagonists-finding-themselves stories I seemed to wade through later on. With Berger books out these, perhaps it’s not too late.


Li’l thoth’s Elsewhere Section

Only a few again this month.

The Old JLA meets the new in #238 and there’s an unconvincing passing of the torch. Great Patton art though.

Action 567 has Supes up against the Yellow Peri. I didn’t realise she wasn’t a major recurring Supes villainess.

It’s a Liberty Belle spotlight in All Star Squadron 38, with Baron Blitzkrieg in the wings. It’s a darker issue this one.

I’d get Crisis #2 and Who’s Who #3 very shortly, along with…

Firestorm goers up against Plastique and Killer Frost in #35

The Titans chase after Azrael in #53, after he puts Lilith through some changes. At that point, they don’t realise he’s not worth chasing after. Gar glowers in a courtroom as part of Termy’s trial.

Elsewhere…

Alan Moore was comfortably into Swamp Thing with #36. But he also did the back ups in both GL (Englehart & Staton run begins here I think?) and in the GA story in Detective. The first brings us Mogo, the second has Black Canary shot for plot purposes. Moore wonders why heroes aren’t taken down more easily. I agree, but shoot GA for a change next time.

Atari Force 17 – There’s a mind link scene here that would later be lifted and dropped into a Star Wars movie.

Sgt Rock saves a bunny rabbit from the Germans in #400

DC Comics Presents – 81 – Ambush Bug switches places with Superman after some Red Kryptonite exposure.

The Shadow War of Hawkman begins. A storyline that would take the characters right out of DC’s first Event comics. Like the Red Tornado mini series, this one must have sounded a lot better in the pitch than in the pay off. The new JLA would appear in a scene somewhere in this series.

The Infantino/Adams Deadman stories are reprinted. Frank Miller does the cover to the final part of Superman the Secret Years.

Vigilante 17 has the first part of a dark storyline. It’s what I thought Vigilante would be, only to be less than impressed with some gimmicky early issues. There’s also a funny reference to the JLA. The JLA also get a mention on the cover of Blue Devil 12.


"...not having to believe in a thing to be interested in it and not having to explain a thing to appreciate the wonder of it."
Re: Re-Reading the Legion: Archives Volume 21
Fat Cramer #954451 07/25/18 06:10 PM
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Originally Posted by thoth
As a body burns and we’re told a sickness inflicts the land, an old man dismisses stories of what we’ve seen in the last couple of issues. It seems like a fair amount of time has gone past for a sickness to take root in their society, and this comes over as a framing sequence. It could almost have been an elderly Jhodan failing to come to terms with the effects of the visitors to their planet. A quick peek to the end shows no old man or final look at a village coming to terms with the effects of the plague. It’s an interesting introductory page, but there’s no pay off to it.


That would have been an interesting approach, to have elderly Jhodan relate what happened. The speed of the illness's spread baffled me as well - given what else goes on on the planet, maybe it wasn't even the Legionnaires who brought it. Brainy made a logical assumption but didn't do any tests.

Quote
It lasts all of a few seconds as Brainy is tackled to the ground by Jhodan. Plot wise, this attack occurs so that the data reel is discovered. But Jhodan comes across as petulantly jealous. Perhaps Ina actually got some of her attitude from her teacher?


Indeed! Jhodan is a bit quick to judge.

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While the readers are privy to all the information Brainy has, it’s nice to see him be the one waffling over the coincidental tornado that suddenly appears to be bearing down on them. Determined to hold his position, despite coming from Earth which has a weather control system. Again, it’s credit to Newell for reminding us that everyone is fallible. It’s also a switch to see the scientist being the one to come up with a clearly incorrect hypothesis, and the people of Kol knowing exactly what it is.


It's a good illustration of the tenacity of one's belief system, presented in a very realistic manner.

Quote
Brainy had also involved Dream Girl in sharing some responsibility for their predicament. On one layer Dreamy, as acting leader, authorised the experiments and dispatched the two to search for their missing colleagues. But on another, we’re reminded of her past where she altered Ayla’s powers to make her Light Lass.


Meddling in people's lives, or fulfilling a precognitive destiny? Now I'm going to be looking for other instances of Nura messing with or advocating that others mess with someone's power.

Quote
With the others captured, Dawny gives herself up, and they are all placed in the Arch of Agony as threatened earlier on by Awian as she departed with her troops.


I didn't really get why Spliff was put on the Arch. He seemed to have a special position as Kol's mystic, but is damned here by mere association.

Quote
Considering the number of lost worlds and distant eras the Legion has visited, it’s about time this sort of thing was brought up. But it would slow the action to a crawl every adventure as the team go through testing procedures. A way round this is to say that their transuits would normally protect the local lifeforms. But when these malfunctioned on Kol disease spread.


Great and sensible explanation!

Quote
All of which is very odd as Awian isn’t really in a position to negotiate on behalf of Kol. If Kol is annoyed then it has certainly shown it directly. What part did Kol play in Awian’s plans? Enough to return the use of technology to the Legionnaires. Enough to allow Jhodan to gift Brainy the data reel.


I kept expecting Awian to start using a computer or otherwise indicate that she knows how it all works and the religious rites are just cover. We never find out if there's some secret knowledge available only to the leader.

Quote
Decisions made behind closed doors and favours being asked of Kol and seemingly granted doesn’t look likely to prolong the order of things there for long. It might actually be Rand who’s the main agent of change.


Rand and Jhodan - two apparently highly placed religious figures. Could be a Vatican II in the works.

Quote
Despite Jhodan telling Brainy that Kol did not need their help, the UP has vaccinated the world by satellite. Despite Jhodan telling Brainy that he must never return to the world, the Coluan immediately volunteers himself for an expedition that Desai is launching to visit.


This may have been meant as benign, but it certainly illustrated that the U.P. - with Earth the driving force - pretty much does what it wants with unclaimed planets.

Quote
The development of Dawnstar’s character was significant. This was a moment of real potential for her, as she launched into the opening issue of Crisis. Her relationship with Drake was challenged. A knock-on effect from this story should have seen some changes in him too. With the try out issue coming, as well as a trans time Crisis, it should have been a strong time for Wildfire too.
Their last scene in this issue was as powerful as anything in this era.


Dawnstar underwent a major change in her life, so to drop that plot is particularly disappointing. Well, maybe it wasn't entirely dropped. Maybe her physical relationship with Jhodan encouraged her later to try and have some physical relationship with Drake. However, she seems to fall back into the Wildfire partnership pretty easily. You're right that Drake should also have changed. The two just seem to fall back together; maybe other options just proved too challenging.

Quote
Newell’s work in this story reminded us of the emotional side of Brainiac 5, even as he indulged his curiosity at every available moment. He was shown to be vulnerable, and rationally fallible. He had to figure things out as he went rather than having everything appear in a convenient plot dump.


Agreed, one of the better characterizations of Brainiac 5.


Quote
Jhodan made a compromise. Perhaps he broke this to give Brainy the reel. Perhaps Kol was involved here too. But his choice made, his arc in the story ends well enough. Likewise, having brokered/ enforced whatever deal there was to make, Awian gets a world that returns to normal. With the UP’s vaccination no doubt being hailed as the work of Kol, faith may be even stronger than it was.


Oh, hadn't thought about that. Unintended consequences.

Interesting bunch of other comics from that time. What's rabbit stew in German?


Holy Cats of Egypt!
Re: Re-Reading the Legion: Archives Volume 21
Fat Cramer #954562 07/26/18 06:42 PM
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Tales 323

Newell’s interview in The Legion Companion is most insightful. She made a lot of mistakes in writing this story that novice writers often make (and which I’ve made more than a few time): trying to say so much in her story that it lacks a clear focus and resolution. I commend her for her ambitious aims in writing this story. I also commend DC for giving her the chance to write a three-issue tale, even though, by her own admission, she wasn’t ready. And there is a lot of good in the wrap-up, even though it doesn’t wrap up everything.

For me, the biggest takeaway is that Dawnstar has indeed changed because of the story. I didn’t pick up on the carefully couched references to her having sex with Jhodan—and, even now, the wording is vague enough to pass the Comics Code. But it’s clear that her experience with him did have an effect on her. She learns she wants more from a relationship than Wildfire can provide.

I don’t think this lesson is meant to reflect just the physical sense. Jhodan is a very different man than Wildfire: someone who looks after her without talking down to her, who demonstrates intelligence and thoughtfulness, and who is willing to sacrifice everything—even his love for her—for her freedom. Drake has never exhibited any of these qualities. At best, he’s come off as clingy and condescending. Even during their brief reunion, he focuses on his own needs and not on what she’s been through.

I can also see why Dawnstar would want to return to Jhodan’s world—not only to be with him, but because the world itself represents a simple way of life with clear-cut standards of right and wrong. This setting suits her temperament better, I think, than the varied worlds and complicated relationships of the Legion. As a “weirdling,” she can arguably make more of a difference than she can as a Legionnaire—someone who inspires the Kol natives to question their long-held beliefs and assumptions, and, with the support of Jhodan and Spliff, might succeed in guiding them to become a more tolerant, educated, or open culture.

(Ironically, the cover shows several Kol natives bowing before a statue of Dawnstar—a scene which doesn’t happen in the story. Perhaps Newell had intended for Dawny to be worshipped as a goddess in the never-to-be sequel.)

Brainiac 5 doesn’t change—and that’s fine; this is really a one-character story. Brainy serves the needs of the plot, mostly in good ways which honor the truth of his character (such as spouting medical jargon while attending Ina—good move, Nurse Mindy!). The plot also forces Brainy into some less convincing roles, such as his intolerant rant over Jhodan’s intolerance. Brainy has been on enough missions with the Legion to know how varied cultures can be. Did he also not learn that calling people ignorant and foolish is not a good way to win them over? Worse, it could alienate the very people he needs as allies.

I’m all for Brainy expressing a bit of condescension towards dogma as well as magic (as he later does during the Magic Wars), but his open hostility toward Jhodan and the others doesn’t ring true.

My biggest gripe about the story, in fact, is that most of the characters act either out of character or with knee-jerk reactions. It begins with Jhodan attacking Brainy after Dawny throws her arms around the latter. Even if Jhodan had spent the night with Dawny in the conjugal sense, it seems out of character for him to jump this green-skinned foreigner and assume he’s seducing his “woman.” The Jhodan of the last two issues was more patient and willing to assess a situation.

I’ve already discussed Brainy’s out of character rant above, and Dawny gets her turn when she grabs Rand and nearly skewers him. Granted, it’s been a tough time for her and she did accidently skewer a soldier last issue, but the whole “I will brutalize you—oh my god, what am I doing?” routine smacks of cliché. It serves the needs of the plot and provides a payoff when Rand—in another convenient and out-of-character turn—serves as mouthpiece for the author: “We should not destroy what we do not understand.” If the people on Kol can be turned around so easily, then Dawny’s return as Goddess of Enlightenment is assured.

I was waiting for some revelation that the atmosphere of Kol or the hidden god him/herself was somehow manipulating people’s emotions and forcing them to act in bizarre ways. But such a revelation never comes. The real explanation is probably that Newell (who said in the interview that she’d never had a formal writing class) did not know how to let the characters reveal themselves without forcing them to meet the needs of the plot.

Another indication of Newell’s rawness as a writer can be found in the science fiction plot. I mentioned how the first part of the story reminded me of the Star Trek episode, “The Omega Glory.” In the conclusion, I see echoes of other episodes, as well. Many of these ideas are based on tropes (the humans’ bacteria proves fatal to aliens, the planet turns out to be the remains of a spaceship, connections to earth’s violent past since the 20th century are mentioned, religious intolerance prevents people from accepting scientific solutions to their problems). I can only assume that Newell drew from the same well I did as a fledgling writer—Star Trek and other mainstream sources—because I, too, thought they were original and did not understand the larger literary context.

(In no way do I mean to compare myself to Newell. As a writer, she accomplished a lot of things I haven’t. And she did develop into a fine writer, though I’m mainly familiar with her self-created series The New Wave from Eclipse Comics.)

Another example of this reliance on mainstream material appears at the end when the UP takes it upon itself to vaccinate the inhabitants of Kol without their knowledge. It’s an act of mercy, sure, but also one of arrogance and the unquestioned belief that advanced cultures know best for less advanced ones—an attitude that can be found in several episodes of Star Trek and other TV shows of the time.

So, “Look Homeward, Legionnaires” (the title on the splash page) leaves us with a lot of tantalizing mysteries and possibilities. However, it is also refreshing to see a new writer’s take on the characters after so many years of immersion in the Levitz Legion. Newell brings in a lot of fresh ideas to revitalize the characters and their universe—and there’s never anything wrong with that.


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Re: Re-Reading the Legion: Archives Volume 21
Fat Cramer #954563 07/26/18 07:15 PM
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By the way, here's how these two issues fared in my "Top 30" of February 5, 1985:

1. Superman: The Secret Years # 4 -- DC
2. Tales of the New Teen Titans # 53 -- DC
3. Crisis on Infinite Earths # 2 -- DC
4. America Vs. The Justice Society # 4 -- DC
5. New Teen Titans # 8 -- DC
6. All-Star Squadron # 44 -- DC
7. Star Trek # 14 -- DC
8. Badger # 5 -- First
9. Green Lantern # 188 -- DC
10. Power Man & Iron Fist # 117 -- Marvel

11. Nexus # 8 -- First
12. Iron Man # 194 -- Marvel
13. Captain America # 305 -- Marvel
14. Superman # 405 -- DC
15. Shadow War of Hawkman # 1 -- DC
16. Infinity Inc. # 13 -- DC
17. Fantastic Four # 278 -- Marvel
18. Amazing Spider-Man # 264 -- Marvel
19. Zot! # 7 -- Eclipse
20. Marvel Tales # 175 -- Marvel

21. New Defenders # 143 -- Marvel
22. Legion of Super-Heroes # 10 -- DC
23. Justice League of America # 238 -- DC
24. Avengers # 255 -- Marvel
25. Fury of Firestorm # 35 -- DC
26. Tales of the Legion of Super-Heroes # 323 -- DC
27. Uncanny X-Men # 193 -- Marvel
28. American Flagg! # 20 -- First
29. Wally Wood's T.H.U.N.D.E.R. Agents # 2 -- Deluxe
30. Flash # 345 -- DC

. . . so, I didn't think much of either issue at the time. I'm only somewhat more impressed with 323 now.


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Re: Re-Reading the Legion: Archives Volume 21
Fat Cramer #954565 07/26/18 09:21 PM
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I'm sensing you weren't a big fan of 'The Trial of the Flash' HWW. wink

Re: Re-Reading the Legion: Archives Volume 21
Fat Cramer #954591 07/27/18 05:59 AM
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As I recall, Blacula, the trial went on way too long and the art (by Carmine Infantino?) wasn't very good.


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Re: Re-Reading the Legion: Archives Volume 21
Fat Cramer #954621 07/27/18 10:27 AM
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Originally Posted by Fat Cramer
. . . it's only Jhodan's submission to the Reverend Mother that allows the Legionnaires to go free. That's unusual for a Legion story; they generally manage to battle their way out of everything.


Good point. Our heroes don't win by any stretch of the imagination. But the story isn't about winning. It's about Dawnstar growing up, to an extent.

Quote
Dawnstar mirrors Ina to some degree; she has loyalty to her fellow Legionnaire, but is siding with Jhodan when Brainy attacks his religion. Just as with Ina, the choice is made for her and she returns to the Legion. Had Dawnstar stayed with or returned to Jhodan, she might have been an agent for gradual, positive change.


I kind of thought this might be where the story would head in the sequel, as well. I don't think DC would have been willing to let Dawny leave the Legion for good, so it's interesting to speculate on how the sequel might have turned out.

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Ironically, in the letters column, Chris Miller asks for a future history of the DCU, the time between the 20th and 30th centuries, and is told that it will be made clearer in the Crisis series. Was this Legion story supposed to link to Crisis in that historical sense, with its big mystery about the 23rd century? I don't recall such details from Crisis (and have ordered the book from the library to find out) but does someone here know if there was such a connection? I also couldn't find anything on-line that Mindy Newell said regarding her ideas of where the story of Kol's planet might go.



I don't remember anything from Crisis that addressed the time between the 20th and 30th centuries--unless there were some brief appearances by the Space Museum (25th century or so) and other characters who might have been set in that in-between future time.

Originally Posted by thoth
Brainy has figured out the chronology of the data and knows the rough origin of the people. But he hasn’t bothered to determine the historical context behind the world he sees. It’s a blind spot brought from exasperation, but it makes him as closed as the people he’s criticising.


People who criticize others for being narrowminded are often blind to the claustrophobic dimensions of their own views. It's a plus that Newell recognized this.

Quote
Awian also seems to have a direct connection to Kol’s storms. While everyone is blaming Jhodan’s actions for events, its Awian questioning Kol that seems to start it.


This, too, was a nice subtle touch. The "natural force" Brainy recognized is quite real and it interacts with the inhabitants in chilling ways.

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She keeps a picture of Jhodan in her office. There’s a connection between them that runs deeper than just their positions in the order. That she perhaps treats Jhodan a little differently doesn’t sit well with what we’ve seen of the order.


Awian, Ina, and Dawny each held a special place in her heart for Jhodan. Perhaps his secret power is the ability to make women fall in love with him. He's secretly . . . Starfox!

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Considering the time taken for Dawny and Brainy’s return and the quick deaths of the children we saw in the story, I don’t hold out a lot of hope for Ina. She was possibly older than a lot of the victims which might help her.


The time element at the end of the story is muddled. Brainy says UP scientists have studied the reel for one month, suggesting it's been that long since he and Dawny returned. However, Wildfire suggests he hasn't seen Dawny in a month. Does that mean it's been a month since she and Brainy left on their mission or that she's been avoiding Wildfire for a month since her return?

Given how fast the disease spread, it could very well be that the entire population had died by the time the vaccines were sprayed.






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Re: Re-Reading the Legion: Archives Volume 21
Fat Cramer #954691 07/29/18 03:50 AM
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Comments

Originally Posted by Cramer
It does raise the question of whether there were original inhabitants of this planet wiped out by the Earthlings who arrived to build the present society.

It would make an interesting parallel to the events in this story. There’s also the possibility that Kol was there when the human arrived, is the spirit of the planet or is a combination of a planetary spirit merged with a spaceships AI.

Originally Posted by Cramer
Brainy's easy-going attitude vanishes as he collides with the closed minds imposed by Kol's religious order. He can't think his way out of this one, though - and it's only Jhodan's submission to the Reverend Mother that allows the Legionnaires to go free. That's unusual for a Legion story; they generally manage to battle their way out of everything.


The battle and their appearance on the arch was a little convenient plot wise, pushing events that little bit to get to the conclusion. The pacing in this issue wasn’t as strong as the last two, or perhaps the first two could have picked up a bit more to allow space here.

Originally Posted by Cramer
Dawnstar mirrors Ina to some degree; she has loyalty to her fellow Legionnaire, but is siding with Jhodan when Brainy attacks his religion. Just as with Ina, the choice is made for her and she returns to the Legion. Had Dawnstar stayed with or returned to Jhodan, she might have been an agent for gradual, positive change. Rand changed his view of her based on their experience, when she saved his life. Dawnstar appreciated the spiritual aspect of that society, unlike Brainiac 5, who, in this issue, condemned and imposed his "enlightened" views (although in the Epilogue, he's talking about an unknown force of nature on that planet, not coincidental natural events).


Dawny would definitely have kicked those mountain people’s butts. But since Kol is at the heart of everything that happens on that world, she may well have found that it was either conform, leave, die or take over.

Originally Posted by Cramer
There are plenty of unresolved stories here. Mindy Newell, in the Legion Companion interview, suggested that she bit off more than she could chew with this story, too many ideas that didn't come together. These all could have been resolved if the story arc had continued, but it was dropped. We don't know what was on the computer reel, if Ina survived, what happened with the expedition, what was the deal with the nature force which so concerned Brainy. Dawnstar may spend a panel or two in future issues remembering Jhodan, but she never tries to return. So it's ultimately very frustrating to reread this story and know that these questions won't be resolved.


I don’t mind that there are unanswered questions. Some, such as the fate of Ina could have been dealt with here. But the wider ones are the whole point of sequels. Compared to the huge number of “spotlight” stories that demolish characters without ever reaching their natural conclusion, I’m happy enough with what we got here.

Originally Posted by Cramer
Ironically, in the letters column, Chris Miller asks for a future history of the DCU, the time between the 20th and 30th centuries, and is told that it will be made clearer in the Crisis series. Was this Legion story supposed to link to Crisis in that historical sense, with its big mystery about the 23rd century? I don't recall such details from Crisis (and have ordered the book from the library to find out) but does someone here know if there was such a connection? I also couldn't find anything on-line that Mindy Newell said regarding her ideas of where the story of Kol's planet might go.


The Great Disaster might have been a link to Kamandi. But the plot of Crisis was going through so many changes that the advice in the lettercol is more about the goals of the series than the actual detail. I imagine that Newell might have been given some advice not to be too specific, hence the repetitive comments about Brainy finding ship parts? Oh, and don’t have Kol be the home of the Zoo Crew. smile

I didn’t find anything more on a sequel the last time I searched either. I think there are a few strong hints in the story. The story on Kol is self-contained enough that it can sit there waiting for that sequel.

Originally Posted by cramer
Originally Posted by thoth


Despite Jhodan telling Brainy that Kol did not need their help, the UP has vaccinated the world by satellite. Despite Jhodan telling Brainy that he must never return to the world, the Coluan immediately volunteers himself for an expedition that Desai is launching to visit.


This may have been meant as benign, but it certainly illustrated that the U.P. - with Earth the driving force - pretty much does what it wants with unclaimed planets.


That’s one of the key things from the story too. It links back to the Imskian separatist story from earlier years, through to later tension in the reboot years.


Originally Posted by cramer
[quote=thoth] The development of Dawnstar’s character was significant. This was a moment of real potential for her, as she launched into the opening issue of Crisis. Her relationship with Drake was challenged. A knock-on effect from this story should have seen some changes in him too. With the try out issue coming, as well as a trans time Crisis, it should have been a strong time for Wildfire too.
Their last scene in this issue was as powerful as anything in this era.
Dawnstar underwent a major change in her life, so to drop that plot is particularly disappointing. Well, maybe it wasn't entirely dropped. Maybe her physical relationship with Jhodan encouraged her later to try and have some physical relationship with Drake. However, she seems to fall back into the Wildfire partnership pretty easily. You're right that Drake should also have changed. The two just seem to fall back together; maybe other options just proved too challenging.


There’s a lot here that should have pushed Dawny (and Drake) forward into new stories. It’s certainly a missed opportunity for both characters. Drake is also missing opportunities through the need for members in the Baxter issues too.

Originally Posted by HWW
Newell’s interview in The Legion Companion is most insightful. She made a lot of mistakes in writing this story that novice writers often make (and which I’ve made more than a few time): trying to say so much in her story that it lacks a clear focus and resolution. I commend her for her ambitious aims in writing this story. I also commend DC for giving her the chance to write a three-issue tale, even though, by her own admission, she wasn’t ready. And there is a lot of good in the wrap-up, even though it doesn’t wrap up everything.


It's a very open interview. I agree that there’s a lack of focus just before the end, although the final actions of the characters were locked in well enough. There’s more hits than misses in the story. Quite a few more actually, which pushes it well above a lot of what DC has put out since.

One thing Newell should also be given credit for is having her first major story be an extended spotlight issue. The Legion’s ensemble cast meant it could have characters with cardboard personalities for a lot of its early years. It can easily be a very plot driven book. It was before Levitz got there, and again once he was no longer involved. Even later spotlight issues were often used to retcon some origins, such as the Star Boy issue or Wildfire. Newell does none of that, instead choosing to push Dawnstar forward. Despite a few rough edges, there’s some things much more experienced writers could be taking away from this story.

Originally Posted by HWW
For me, the biggest takeaway is that Dawnstar has indeed changed because of the story. I didn’t pick up on the carefully couched references to her having sex with Jhodan—and, even now, the wording is vague enough to pass the Comics Code.


Ah, the code. On the recent HQ diagram, if you weren’t married, you got your own distinct quarters on the map. That is where the diagram was definitively saying that you would find your characters. Even if they’d actually been shacked up with someone down the corridor for several years in the book. Poor Chuck didn’t even get to share with Lu. smile

Originally Posted by HWW
I don’t think this lesson is meant to reflect just the physical sense. Jhodan is a very different man than Wildfire: someone who looks after her without talking down to her, who demonstrates intelligence and thoughtfulness, and who is willing to sacrifice everything—even his love for her—for her freedom. Drake has never exhibited any of these qualities. At best, he’s come off as clingy and condescending. Even during their brief reunion, he focuses on his own needs and not on what she’s been through.


It's a shame for Drake that writers didn’t use this story as a push for him to try and address a lot of those issues, instead choosing to keep him in his character box (or containment box) going forward. It’s even more of a shame than Dawny got dragged into that too.

Originally Posted by HWW
(Ironically, the cover shows several Kol natives bowing before a statue of Dawnstar—a scene which doesn’t happen in the story. Perhaps Newell had intended for Dawny to be worshipped as a goddess in the never-to-be sequel.)


That’s an interesting spot. I could easily have seen a Angel of Kol sort of storyline take shape. Perhaps Marv Wolfman was reading this and used it to shape his Azrael plot when he joined Brother Blood.

Originally Posted by HWW
Brainiac 5 doesn’t change—and that’s fine; this is really a one-character story. Brainy serves the needs of the plot, mostly in good ways which honor the truth of his character (such as spouting medical jargon while attending Ina—good move, Nurse Mindy!). The plot also forces Brainy into some less convincing roles, such as his intolerant rant over Jhodan’s intolerance. Brainy has been on enough missions with the Legion to know how varied cultures can be. Did he also not learn that calling people ignorant and foolish is not a good way to win them over? Worse, it could alienate the very people he needs as allies.

I’m all for Brainy expressing a bit of condescension towards dogma as well as magic (as he later does during the Magic Wars), but his open hostility toward Jhodan and the others doesn’t ring true.


We have seen Brainy be quite short with people over the years. But there’s little doubt that it did go over the line into writer’s sock puppet on this occasion. As you mention, Jhodan’s words when assaulting Brainy didn’t quite match up either. These are probably the two weakest moments, and I see you also think of them as your biggest gripe. Oh, and Dawny going a bit possessed by the wrath of Kol. That all three happen in the same issue suggests that the pacing/ plotting wasn’t quite right.

Originally Posted by HWW
I was waiting for some revelation that the atmosphere of Kol or the hidden god him/herself was somehow manipulating people’s emotions and forcing them to act in bizarre ways. But such a revelation never comes. The real explanation is probably that Newell (who said in the interview that she’d never had a formal writing class) did not know how to let the characters reveal themselves without forcing them to meet the needs of the plot.


“But I do remember Karen saying to me “What do you do?” “I’m a nurse.” “Did you ever take any writing classes?” I said “Yeah, y’know, one or two.” Although enjoying writing, Newell just hadn’t done anything professionally at that point.

The tone of Newell’s set up was a little different to what you’d get in a lot of books. A lot of folks would have revealed more about the spacecraft. Others might have drafted the history of humanity’s exodus from Earth, before being tackled by Crisis Wolfman in the corridor. Roy Thomas would have charted the course of every JSA artefact out into the stars. There are lots of ways of executing this.
What we get is very Empire Strikes Back where the cast look out a viewport telling us that the search for Han has begun, without hitting us over the head with teasers for the next movie. And that’s a Leigh Brackett script, so that’s as valid an approach as any. (Leigh Brackett > Ed Hamilton >Legion!)

Here, Brainy wants to go back and soon. Dawny also wants to go back. Actually, she’s looking out a viewport too! So, that’s the two principles looking for a lot of questions to be answered. Newell’s also quite up for the sequel. It’s sort of poised at half way.

Originally Posted by HWW
I mentioned how the first part of the story reminded me of the Star Trek episode, “The Omega Glory.” In the conclusion, I see echoes of other episodes, as well. Many of these ideas are based on tropes (the humans’ bacteria proves fatal to aliens, the planet turns out to be the remains of a spaceship, connections to earth’s violent past since the 20th century are mentioned, religious intolerance prevents people from accepting scientific solutions to their problems). I can only assume that Newell drew from the same well I did as a fledgling writer—Star Trek and other mainstream sources—because I, too, thought they were original and did not understand the larger literary context.


It’s fun reading old short sci-fi stories and realising the impact they would have on popular culture, whether lifted-and-dropped or just unconsciously taken from the well.

Originally Posted by HWW
Another example of this reliance on mainstream material appears at the end when the UP takes it upon itself to vaccinate the inhabitants of Kol without their knowledge. It’s an act of mercy, sure, but also one of arrogance and the unquestioned belief that advanced cultures know best for less advanced ones—an attitude that can be found in several episodes of Star Trek and other TV shows of the time.


Yeah, they should have shown Desai only order the vaccination after the UP had determined that Kol’s assets were worth plundering, like the real world. smile Actually, that’s probably what they decided after reviewing the reel. In the sequel Rand will have been promised power. In turn, Rand will offer the people change. The only concession will be a few giant mines, drilling into the Heart of Kol. What could go wrong? smile

Originally Posted by HWW
Newell brings in a lot of fresh ideas to revitalize the characters and their universe—and there’s never anything wrong with that.


nod

He Who Wanders Down Comics Memory Lane

A back up in Thunder Agents #2 paired up Keith Giffen with… Tom & Mary Bierbaum!

You buying this one helped forge that TMK team HWW!

I did eventually get the Thunder Agents book, as it has Perez art. It also has Cockrum art and stories by Englehart and Dann Thomas too. I don’t know if I’ve actually read it. I remember b&w reprints of the original series that I was probably reading around the time of your list.

A quick search tells me that Avengers #255 was leading up to key events with the Vision. I’d only heard about that when it was mentioned in the West Coast Avengers run of John Byrne. John Byrne was also the artist on four Captain America (also on your list) comics I just got around the 250 mark. The writer on those was Roger Stern who wrote that Avengers #255!

I also noticed New Defenders. Was that leading towards the end of that series? I remember enjoying the art and a bit of a darker storyline leading up to the end of that one. I’d get some of those some 6 years after you.

Originally Posted by Blacula
I'm sensing you weren't a big fan of 'The Trial of the Flash' HWW

[quote=HWW]As I recall, Blacula, the trial went on way too long and the art (by Carmine Infantino?) wasn't very good.[/quote


I guess Bates, who had been told of the books Crisis cancellation well before this, saw the big ending and padded out/ added several issues to get there. One plus point was that for readers who dipped in and out of the title, there was always the touchstone of that trial.


"...not having to believe in a thing to be interested in it and not having to explain a thing to appreciate the wonder of it."
Re: Re-Reading the Legion: Archives Volume 21
thoth lad #954743 07/29/18 02:24 PM
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Originally Posted by thoth lad


“But I do remember Karen saying to me “What do you do?” “I’m a nurse.” “Did you ever take any writing classes?” I said “Yeah, y’know, one or two.” Although enjoying writing, Newell just hadn’t done anything professionally at that point.


Newell contradicts herself. Later she says, "I think in some ways it was too easy for me, 'cause everything just sort of happened. I mean, I never really took a class in writing" (p. 156, middle column). The "one or two" comment might have been b.s., which she admits to using when Len Wein entered the office.

Quote
The tone of Newell’s set up was a little different to what you’d get in a lot of books. A lot of folks would have revealed more about the spacecraft. Others might have drafted the history of humanity’s exodus from Earth, before being tackled by Crisis Wolfman in the corridor. Roy Thomas would have charted the course of every JSA artefact out into the stars. There are lots of ways of executing this.
What we get is very Empire Strikes Back where the cast look out a viewport telling us that the search for Han has begun, without hitting us over the head with teasers for the next movie. And that’s a Leigh Brackett script, so that’s as valid an approach as any. (Leigh Brackett > Ed Hamilton >Legion!)


All true. I shudder to think of what Roy Thomas might have done to this story. smile

Quote

He Who Wanders Down Comics Memory Lane

A back up in Thunder Agents #2 paired up Keith Giffen with… Tom & Mary Bierbaum!


Interesting. I didn't remember that. Is that the backup in which Lightning reveals that his super-speed accelerates his aging?

THUNDER Agents is another series I wish I had given more of a chance. I only bought the first two issues, but that story of the terrible consequences of super-speed has stayed with me over the years.

Quote
You buying this one helped forge that TMK team HWW!


It's great to have played a small role in Legion history. wink

Quote
A quick search tells me that Avengers #255 was leading up to key events with the Vision. I’d only heard about that when it was mentioned in the West Coast Avengers run of John Byrne. John Byrne was also the artist on four Captain America (also on your list) comics I just got around the 250 mark. The writer on those was Roger Stern who wrote that Avengers #255!


Connections, connections, connections. smile

. . . or Six Degrees of Roger Stern?

Quote
I also noticed New Defenders. Was that leading towards the end of that series? I remember enjoying the art and a bit of a darker storyline leading up to the end of that one. I’d get some of those some 6 years after you.


New Defenders ran until # 152. I also fondly remember the somewhat darker, moodier take on the series, with a revamped lineup that included three original members of the X-Men. Angel's girlfriend, Candy Sothern was made the team's non-powered leader in another unusual move.

According to Wikipedia, the series was cancelled to make room on the schedule for X-Factor (and to free up the three X-Men to join that team). Up to this time, I loved the idea that the storylines in the Marvel Universe progressed and that characters moved on with their lives while still maintaining the close friendships they once had, such as Angel, Beast, and Iceman. When X-Factor was launched--complete with the resurrection of Jean Grey--that forward progression was halted, I felt. It was the beginning of my disillusionment with Marvel.

Quote


I guess Bates, who had been told of the books Crisis cancellation well before this, saw the big ending and padded out/ added several issues to get there. One plus point was that for readers who dipped in and out of the title, there was always the touchstone of that trial.


DC, as I recall, was very much into honoring anniversary issues--more so than Marvel--so the plan may have been to end The Flash with # 350, which is what happened. Unfortunately, the storyline was drawn out too long to make this happen.


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Re: Re-Reading the Legion: Archives Volume 21
He Who Wanders #954761 07/29/18 04:11 PM
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Originally Posted by He Who Wanders
Originally Posted by thoth lad


“But I do remember Karen saying to me “What do you do?” “I’m a nurse.” “Did you ever take any writing classes?” I said “Yeah, y’know, one or two.” Although enjoying writing, Newell just hadn’t done anything professionally at that point.


Newell contradicts herself. Later she says, "I think in some ways it was too easy for me, 'cause everything just sort of happened. I mean, I never really took a class in writing" (p. 156, middle column). The "one or two" comment might have been b.s., which she admits to using when Len Wein entered the office.


Thanks. I meant to take that line out of my post, which is why it's sitting there with no context. I was sure I'd read your version, but only saw the one I used when I was skimming it. As Newell enjoyed writing well before her breakthrough, perhaps she'd dabbled in the odd thing, without it being a formal course. The middle ground between the two quotes. There was certainly more than enough in her pitch to get her into the Talent Showcase.


Originally Posted by HWW
All true. I shudder to think of what Roy Thomas might have done to this story. smile


Considering that two of his books are in your top ten for the month and a third is at #16, I think you'd have been thrilled. smile It would certainly have had plus points.

Originally Posted by thoth
Originally Posted by HWW


A back up in Thunder Agents #2 paired up Keith Giffen with… Tom & Mary Bierbaum!


Interesting. I didn't remember that. Is that the backup in which Lightning reveals that his super-speed accelerates his aging?

THUNDER Agents is another series I wish I had given more of a chance. I only bought the first two issues, but that story of the terrible consequences of super-speed has stayed with me over the years.


Issue #1 showed that there was an ageing effect on him, due to the suit. Issue #2 by TMK showed him take off a young looking mask, to reveal a much older face. There was a another story in #2 which showed that Lightning was suffering from some serious health issues.

As the trial of the Flash continues, I'm just thinking about how that turned out for the Flash in Crisis. Also, about the power effects that Wally West was undergoing as Kid Flash around this time. Strikeforce Morituri would continue this theme, beginning in 1986.

Originally Posted by HWW
Originally Posted by thoth
I also noticed New Defenders. Was that leading towards the end of that series? I remember enjoying the art and a bit of a darker storyline leading up to the end of that one. I’d get some of those some 6 years after you.


New Defenders ran until # 152. I also fondly remember the somewhat darker, moodier take on the series, with a revamped lineup that included three original members of the X-Men. Angel's girlfriend, Candy Sothern was made the team's non-powered leader in another unusual move.

According to Wikipedia, the series was cancelled to make room on the schedule for X-Factor (and to free up the three X-Men to join that team). Up to this time, I loved the idea that the storylines in the Marvel Universe progressed and that characters moved on with their lives while still maintaining the close friendships they once had, such as Angel, Beast, and Iceman. When X-Factor was launched--complete with the resurrection of Jean Grey--that forward progression was halted, I felt. It was the beginning of my disillusionment with Marvel.


Thanks for that info. I'll need to have another look at the art. I remember The Gargoyle as a distinctive member, and a battle against Moondragon. I agree on X-Factor. I have a few of those early issues. I kept thinking that whatever it was supposed to have built up to never really happened. I didn't know enough about Jean Grey at the time I read those issues to realise what a mess it was. But it was, and would only get worse.


"...not having to believe in a thing to be interested in it and not having to explain a thing to appreciate the wonder of it."
Re: Re-Reading the Legion: Archives Volume 21
thoth lad #954784 07/29/18 08:02 PM
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Originally Posted by thoth lad

Originally Posted by HWW
All true. I shudder to think of what Roy Thomas might have done to this story. smile


Considering that two of his books are in your top ten for the month and a third is at #16, I think you'd have been thrilled. smile It would certainly have had plus points.


A guy's allowed to change his mind. smile

I re-read some of Thomas' "classic" work--the '60s X-Men and the Kree-Skrull War--a few years ago, and I didn't think they were very good. The stories were imaginative and the plot points were there (mostly), but the dialogue was verbose, characters behaved in over-the-top ways, and, even though the events were significant, there was a sense that they existed just to get us to the next arc or issue (a common feature of Marvels in general at the time); they didn't "stand" on their own.

The Roy Thomas of the 1980s was a more mature writer, and he was working with characters he had loved since childhood. He was able to develop their personalities and worlds from the framework established by the stories of the '40s, which, I think, requires a somewhat different approach than creating everything whole cloth. Thomas excelled at "filling in the gaps" and building on what previous writers had established (especially in America Vs. JSA). It may be no coincidence that All-Star started to falter when he had to create new characters to replace those excised by Crisis. The new characters effectively thrust the Golden Age heroes into a "new" universe, one which engaged me less than the previous universe.

That said, I remember Thomas still being verbose during All-Star, Infinity Inc., etc.

Of course, all of this is speculation. I haven't re-read the All-Star output in many years; if I did, I might have an altogether different opinion.

I'm sure Thomas's take on the Kol story would have been entertaining, but it would have lacked the depth, risk-taking, and freshness Newell brought.


Originally Posted by thoth


Issue #1 [of THUNDER Agents] showed that there was an ageing effect on him, due to the suit. Issue #2 by TMK showed him take off a young looking mask, to reveal a much older face. There was a another story in #2 which showed that Lightning was suffering from some serious health issues.


Thanks for that information. I remember the youthful-looking mask now.




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Re: Re-Reading the Legion: Archives Volume 21
Fat Cramer #954885 07/31/18 02:37 AM
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LSH #11 Taking Care of Business: Old Business by Paul Levitz, art by Ernie Colon & Larry Mahlstedt, colors by Carl Gafford, letters by John Costanza

[Linked Image]

Garth, Imra and Rokk talk together, after an all-member Legion meeting, about staying with or leaving the Legion. Baby Graym is in tow.

At SP headquarters, Zendak complains about paperwork, learns that Dvron has made no progress on the Laurel Kent shooting and meets with Sun Boy, who wants to discuss Gigi Cusimano.

The three founders (and Graym) travel to Glacier Point, an Antarctic prison. Rokk and Garth destroy several security drones which have failed to recognize them, since the codes are out of date.

President Desai finishes his inaugural ceremony and promises big changes.

In Antarctica, the founders find the two men who they stopped from assassinating R.J. Brande, thereby creating the Legion. They have been serving hard labour sentences but are to be released this day. They don't recognize the Legionnaires but attack them out of anger regardless, and will receive psychic rehab before final release.

At Legion HQ, Chuck mans the Monitor Board. Superboy tells him that he might rejoin the Legion and Chuck informs him that history says otherwise and he would face stiff competition from other applicants.

Comments:
Pretty dull as stories go. The founders decision to stay or leave is drawn out for yet another issue. It's nicely written dialogue for three old friends musing over their past and future, but even with a weekly reading this decision is taking a long time. Not that it wouldn't in real life, but one expects a faster pace in comics.

The various sub-plots, the Laurel Kent investigation, Dirk discussing Gigi, Desai's promises, new members are all pretty vague and serve more as reminders than advances in those stories.

The R.J. assassination attempt has been told many times. The version I prefer is the single assassin, his cousin Doyle, not these two unnamed memory-less characters. I don't quite get the point of them having no memory of the Legionnaires. We don't know what their motive was either. Hired killers? Personal resentment? The very concept of this particular prison, while visually interesting, is strange for a Legion book. The Legionnaires are surprised that the convicts perform hard labour in difficult conditions. Perhaps it's meant to indicate that prison conditions leave something to be desired, even in the future. Although they're subjected to psychic rehab, the prisoners are angry - there's no indication that they're about to become productive, peaceful citizens on release. Releasing the prisoners themselves closes a chapter for Imra, Garth and Rokk, but it's a peculiar way to do that.

Nevertheless, a few points to enjoy:

Imra is the practical one vs the action-oriented Rokk and Garth: she just opens the prison gate. She also displays appropriate concern for the baby while the guys are blasting security drones to pieces.

The pinching baby joke is well done and not overplayed. I do wonder if Graym is delivering little electrical shocks.

The opening page, with all the Legionnaires flying off after their meeting, is a great splash page. Of note: Dawnstar and Wildfire are apart, for once; there's an Ayla-Vi-Brin grouping, which might raise a question of whether a triangle is developing; the other regular couples fly together.

Rokk's face in the hourglass is meant to show the passing of time for them as Legionnaires, but shouts Time Trapper to me now.

(Second story to follow later in the week, unless someone wants to deal with it now.)


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Re: Re-Reading the Legion: Archives Volume 21
Fat Cramer #954923 07/31/18 02:54 PM
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LoSH v3 11

Although this is a fill in issue, drawn by Ernie Colón, it does take one of the ongoing subplots as its basis. Likewise, although the splash page is just a group shot (Dawny going in a different direction from Drake for the first time in ever) there’s a reason of sorts given. The three founders have been discussing their place on the team for some time. Garth and Imra have a newborn. While they have lost a child, when Darkseid stole it away to become Validus, the one they have seems to be some time displaced version of Holdur, judging by the grip it has. In a constitution bound team of tradition, this must come across as a big change. It’s been going on for ages, as each of the founders begins to wonder about a transition to something else.

In fairness, I can’t think of any other comic at the time where heroes would retire from active service. Decades later, it would be used as the basis for Legion writers Abnett and Lanning’s Hypernaturals.

Imra: The Legion might grow better without us.

Rokk: I doubt it.

He would be right. There would be dark days following their departure. He would lead the Legion again in v4 and Imra would return to active duty before the end of v3.

There’s a one page scene where Dirk burns arrest papers. It’s reckless of him. It surely won’t help him in his chat over Cusimano. Not that we find out anything more. Is it payback for her payback? Other than surprise at them still having paperwork, and the hint of a v4 probe there’s nothing in this scene.

In addition to the numerous scenes of Rokk discussing his future, and then Garth and Imra doing likewise, all three have been kept apart from the team for quite some time. Other characters, such as Nura have been given more panel time. I do get the feeling this was a long term plan of Levitz. He’s allowed a new cast of core characters to have more panel time, to let the changes seem more natural.

Another example of the three reaching a “natural” end to their tenure is the release of the would-be assassins who tried to kill Brande in the Legion’s origin. The three founders are the ones to tell the prisoners that their sentences are at an end. They find the pair as they work on an Antarctic wasteland. Both men seem almost brainwashed. There’s mention of psychic rehabilitation. It seems the hard labour goes in hand with mind altering treatments on the prisoners. Their criminal tendencies are broken down and erased. It might not leave much, but they are supposedly built back up to enable them to reenter society. It’s the sort of thing Uli Algor would be immune to in the old days. The Legion seem impressed by it. But changing someone’s mind forcibly is open to all sorts of corruption, never mind the ethics of it in the first place.

In a nice twist the pair don’t even recognise the Legionnaires. It a little surprising we don’t get a recap of the team’s origin, or find out who the assassins were working for. I could normally do without another recap of how the team started. But there hasn’t actually been one in the Baxter run. This would have been a good time for a little reminder. The issue has a small cameo of the team’s inspiration as Superboy visits. While the Baxter book was showcasing the Legion standing on its own, a little reminder wouldn’t have gone amiss, since transition is a theme of the issue.

Superboy teases that he might return to active duty along with Garth and Imra. Usually the past has plenty of blank spots for the Legion. But Chuck is very sure Superboy never rejoins, closing a very big door on future stories. Of course, behind the scenes Crisis and the Superman relaunch was going to make sure that Superboy wouldn’t be back in the team. Actually, I’m wondering if next issue will be his last.

Seeing Chuck bounce around talking about the fate of Kal-El is a chilling foreshadowing of a scene in v7 #23, the team’s final issue to date.

So, we see our two prisoners shuffle off looking a bit broken and waiting to be rebuilt. As the sentences of the prisoners are over there’s a feeling from the three founders that their, if not sentence, but duty is over too. There’s a decent feeling of closure here, which was probably the thing being reached for. Imra and Garth might have returned to active duty, but their look indicates it might not be for long.

To make the passage of time even more visual, Colon shows us an hourglass with the young Legionnaires making their debut to Cos talking to the others now. It’s such a good image it would be used for a cover in v4 #5.

So the story has a feeling of decisions being made, and old faces; founders, Superboy and prisoners moving on to a new lives in a world that will have new Legionnaires.

But there’s a whole other layer to this story, to Levitz’s credit. The whole main plot also feeds directly into the other subplot in this issue. Under the guise of driving for a brighter, more prosperous Earth, President Desai tells the assembly that key institutional values must change. The repercussions are chilling. It all looks so promising and fulfilling, but there are shadows creeping in on Earths’ freedoms. It seems a little unlikely that Desai would push for huge changes all at one. But it has happened often enough here. It seems that the computer selected President has a great deal of power.

A quick peek out at our own world shows plenty of leaders (ugh!) willing to use all sorts of mechanisms to achieve, and hold onto, power. None of them are good ones. In this issue we’ve learned that minds of criminals can be altered to make them docile and programmable. Of course, the definition of who is a criminal can change as the law does and as the lawmakers/ tyrants decide. Let’s hope the President isn’t mixed up with someone who could use mind altering treatments that we’ve just seen used on the Legion’s first prisoners. smile

There’s more depth to this issue than it first appeared to have. It could have been a trip down memory lane to the Legion’s origin. It focused more on the passage of time since that origin instead, that will lead into the membership changes. But the whole thing also acted as a set up for a much longer arc.


"...not having to believe in a thing to be interested in it and not having to explain a thing to appreciate the wonder of it."
Re: Re-Reading the Legion: Archives Volume 21
Fat Cramer #955009 08/01/18 08:10 PM
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LSH # 11

I’m going to go ahead and discuss both stories because there isn’t much to either one. It’s an odd issue, with the first story serving as springboard to the second—but, really, nothing much is accomplished here.

It seems like Levitz wanted to spend some quality time with the Founders, these old friends, before shuffling them off into retirement. What stands out is the relationship between Garth, Imra, and Rokk—the friendship, the shared history. They are (pun not intended) the rock of the Legion, the Holy Trinity, the Jagger & Richards, the Frey and Henley . . . the irreducible core of the team. Yet this core wants to move on to other things. Each feels the pangs of young adulthood. The club they formed so long ago no longer serves their own needs, and it’s time to explore life outside the Legion—the organization that has defined their existence for at least half of their young lives.

It's hard to leave, though, so no decisions are reached in this story. In hindsight, however, we know where this is going, where it must go. At the time, I couldn’t imagine anybody wanting to be anything other than a Legionnaire (or a member of a rock band, to draw on a real-world equivalent). I would have died to join the Legion or some other group where people were valued for their individual talents yet part of a collective that served some worthwhile purpose. Fitting in is a powerful motivator to adolescents and is one reason, I understand, why young people become radicalized. They are seduced into thinking they will find a “family” that their real families and friends failed to provide for them.

The Legion often served as my “family” in this regard.

So, it’s somewhat bittersweet to read about the three Founders laying plans to move on yet sharing in one last grand adventure together. Except it’s not so grand nor even an adventure. To fulfill their own need for nostalgia, perhaps, or closure, they travel to the Antarctica prison to participate—marginally—in the release of the two hired guns who led to them coming together as the Legion in the first place. But these hired guns don’t even recognize them. There’s no a-ha moment, as occurred when Batman—wearing the Halloween costume of his father—confronted Lew Moxon, the thug who hired Joe Chill to kill his parents. There’s nothing. The Founders’ foray to Antarctica is a self-indulgent trip for nothing.

Eight years after this issue was published, the bridge crew of the original Star Trek series would go on its final mission together. The film ends with Kirk directing the helm to take the first star on the left, “thataway.” There was a sense of closure—a leisurely trip to end the long journey of these old friends. I get the sense this is what Levitz was shooting for, but it just doesn’t come together.

There is no plot. Nothing changes. No one learns anything. No one grows. At its core, every story should include this element—something is different than it was at the beginning of the story. Otherwise, what is the point?

I guess the point is that “times change” (Imra’s last line), but we already knew that.

In lieu of a point, we get a one-page bridge in which Bouncing Boy entertains a shadowy guest who turns out to be Superboy. A hint is dropped that, from a historical perspective, Superboy never rejoins the Legion as a full-time member. There are all sorts of time paradoxes with this one (e.g., doesn’t telling Superboy he will never rejoin the Legion already change history?), but never mind. It’s just a setup for Bouncing Boy’s solo story.

The new-style Giffen artwork is jarring after the attractive images and inventive layouts of Ernie Colon, but it fits the odd contortions of Chuck’s rubbery body and the Valley Girl alien-ness of Comet Queen. Especially effective is the 10-panel sequence on Page 4, when Chuck listens with polite confusion as Comet Queen’s mouth dominates alternate panels, prattling on in what to him amounts to a foreign language. This is one of the few instances I can think of when Giffen’s sense of humor actually works. (Chuck, like Tenz, is made for Giffen’s off-the-wall humor.)

Chuck narrates the story of how he discovered Comet Queen and recruited her to the Legion Academy. It’s all a setup for us to expect CQ to join the Legion in the next few issues, but this doesn’t come to pass, making this pretty much a wasted origin story. It would be redeemed if we saw something heroic in CQ, but we don’t. It’s Chuck who saves the day by directing CQ to use her “comet-like gases” to short-circuit the machine. Furthermore, CQ’s origin—diving naked into a comet to acquire powers—should qualify her for the psychiatric ward on Medicus One, not the Legion Academy. However, it does establish her as someone who takes her Legion hero worship seriously (the comet episode was inspired by Star Boy’s origin), as do many fans. I guess we are meant to relate to CQ because she is “one of us.”

This story reminds me of the first Chuck solo story I ever read, “The Impossible Target” from Superboy # 199. That story has become a favorite of mine over the years for its simple message that, whatever his power, Chuck was as effective as any Legionnaire. The story in # 11 fails to convey anything of similar profundity. It ends on a punchline with Chuck saying he was worried about keeping CQ off him and admitting that having a two-in-one wife “is too much for me.” This tells me nothing about CQ or Chuck, except that the latter is rather full of himself –appropriate since he is also filling himself with food.

“The Impossible Target” undermined our stereotypes of who Chuck is and what he could do. “New Business” merely reinforces them.

LSH 11 is the second issue in a row that isn’t a story—just a collection of scenes. Some of these scenes are very good, but, without a structure to hold them together, I’m left feeling that I’ve been taken on a journey and dropped off in an out-of-the-way motel with no idea how to reach my destination.



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Re: Re-Reading the Legion: Archives Volume 21
Fat Cramer #955045 08/02/18 11:27 AM
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Originally Posted by Fat Cramer

Pretty dull as stories go. The founders decision to stay or leave is drawn out for yet another issue. It's nicely written dialogue for three old friends musing over their past and future, but even with a weekly reading this decision is taking a long time. Not that it wouldn't in real life, but one expects a faster pace in comics.


Indeed. One of the hard lessons I had to learn about writing is that stories are not like real life. Someone once said that fiction is like real life with the dull parts edited out. This is good advice to all writers.


Quote
The R.J. assassination attempt has been told many times. The version I prefer is the single assassin, his cousin Doyle, not these two unnamed memory-less characters. I don't quite get the point of them having no memory of the Legionnaires. We don't know what their motive was either. Hired killers? Personal resentment? The very concept of this particular prison, while visually interesting, is strange for a Legion book. The Legionnaires are surprised that the convicts perform hard labour in difficult conditions. Perhaps it's meant to indicate that prison conditions leave something to be desired, even in the future. Although they're subjected to psychic rehab, the prisoners are angry - there's no indication that they're about to become productive, peaceful citizens on release. Releasing the prisoners themselves closes a chapter for Imra, Garth and Rokk, but it's a peculiar way to do that.


The two thugs were hired by Doyle, which I believe was established in the Legion's origin story in Superboy # 147. Doyle was revealed in Secrets of the LSH to have died in prison.

I wasn't sure where the loss of memory angle was going, either. I thought the Founders would discover something unethical going on at the Antarctica prison and step in to stop it. But that doesn't happen. I guess we're meant to conclude that the prisoners' behavior is just part of the mental reprogramming we've seen criminals go through before, but it does leave us with disturbing implications. The thugs must have known at one time who the three Legionnaires were and their own role in sparking the formation of the Legion. Are criminals not allowed to watch the news in the Antarctica prison? Other prisoners would surely not have allowed them to forget.

Quote


The pinching baby joke is well done and not overplayed. I do wonder if Graym is delivering little electrical shocks.


Ha! Hadn't thought about that. smile

Originally Posted by thoth
In fairness, I can’t think of any other comic at the time where heroes would retire from active service.


The JSA retired in the early '50s, but the entire team retired--not just individual members. It was indeed a unique angle in comics that the founders of the team retired and expected the team to continue without them.

Quote
Imra: The Legion might grow better without us.

Rokk: I doubt it.


This seemed like an odd comment since Rokk has alluded that that's exactly what he wants to happen. Maybe he can't resist a good comeback.

Quote
But there’s a whole other layer to this story, to Levitz’s credit. The whole main plot also feeds directly into the other subplot in this issue. Under the guise of driving for a brighter, more prosperous Earth, President Desai tells the assembly that key institutional values must change. The repercussions are chilling. It all looks so promising and fulfilling, but there are shadows creeping in on Earths’ freedoms. It seems a little unlikely that Desai would push for huge changes all at one. But it has happened often enough here. It seems that the computer selected President has a great deal of power.


Reading it now, Desai's speech is indeed chilling. It made me think of JFK's speech, "Ask not what your country can do for you, but what you can do for your country." But we've also had decades of presidents telling us this or that must be sacrificed for the common good. And not just presidents say this. Dictators are fond of this kind of rhetoric, too. Knowing who one of Desai's key advisors is provides an additional chilling subtext.

Quote
A quick peek out at our own world shows plenty of leaders (ugh!) willing to use all sorts of mechanisms to achieve, and hold onto, power. None of them are good ones. In this issue we’ve learned that minds of criminals can be altered to make them docile and programmable. Of course, the definition of who is a criminal can change as the law does and as the lawmakers/ tyrants decide. Let’s hope the President isn’t mixed up with someone who could use mind altering treatments that we’ve just seen used on the Legion’s first prisoners. smile


Yep. I don't know if Levitz intended for us to draw connections between Desai's speech and the reprogramming of criminals. If he did, he's a brilliant writer (or an overly subtle one. smile )

Quote
There’s more depth to this issue than it first appeared to have. It could have been a trip down memory lane to the Legion’s origin. It focused more on the passage of time since that origin instead, that will lead into the membership changes. But the whole thing also acted as a set up for a much longer arc.


Good points. I just wish there had been an actual story. When you have to wait months or years for a plotline to bear fruit, there should be something else to make the in-between trips worthwhile.



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Re: Re-Reading the Legion: Archives Volume 21
Fat Cramer #955063 08/02/18 03:01 PM
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Comments

Originally Posted by Cramer
It's nicely written dialogue for three old friends musing over their past and future, but even with a weekly reading this decision is taking a long time. Not that it wouldn't in real life, but one expects a faster pace in comics.


I don’t know if it’s knowing how things turn out, or being used to different levels of pacing, but this one could have been shortened on the planner.

Originally Posted by Cramer
The various sub-plots, the Laurel Kent investigation, Dirk discussing Gigi, Desai's promises, new members are all pretty vague and serve more as reminders than advances in those stories.


Very true, although a parallel to the Desai plot dawned on me. The rest are just holding in place. That could be due to the shorter story length so we can learn more about Comet Queen though.
Originally Posted by Cramer
The R.J. assassination attempt has been told many times. The version I prefer is the single assassin, his cousin Doyle, not these two unnamed memory-less characters. I don't quite get the point of them having no memory of the Legionnaires. We don't know what their motive was either. Hired killers? Personal resentment?


I would read about this in flashbacks well before I ever read the actual origin issue. What always struck me about it was that, other than the founding of the team, there were few plot threads leading from it. This is probably because it was a retcon and the story served its main purpose. If it were done from scratch… well, I suppose I’ll have to wait for the Postboot Rereads. smile

With the origin in mind, it was possibly too late to have an espionage thriller here, as they uncover something about the team’s origins. Actually, no. It wouldn’t be too late. That would have made for a much more interesting subplot. smile Likewise, this story could have been done through RJ Brande visiting the prisoners, having spoken with the founders and learning of their decisions. We could have learned something new, or had a few plot seeds sown. This story serves its purpose, just as the origin issue did. Two would be assassins dealt with by three people, firstly in a small skirmish and finally in a back water prison.

Originally Posted by HWW
So, it’s somewhat bittersweet to read about the three Founders laying plans to move on yet sharing in one last grand adventure together. Except it’s not so grand nor even an adventure. To fulfill their own need for nostalgia, perhaps, or closure, they travel to the Antarctica prison to participate—marginally—in the release of the two hired guns who led to them coming together as the Legion in the first place. But these hired guns don’t even recognize them. There’s no a-ha moment, as occurred when Batman—wearing the Halloween costume of his father—confronted Lew Moxon, the thug who hired Joe Chill to kill his parents. There’s nothing. The Founders’ foray to Antarctica is a self-indulgent trip for nothing.


You mention the closure of the visit, and that is really the point. Oddly enough, despite having heard Rokk go on and on about his plans and shaking things up, it’s Imra and Garth who take Rokk there to make their point. I think it’s taken Rokk a lot of convincing to get to this stage, hence all those issues. It took Imra and Garth five minutes with their newborn for them to really make up theirs. Perhaps Levitz even used some of those earlier hints to test the water of the readership? The Legion has jettisoned Kryptonians, moved to a Baxter book and is looking to change the team. Perhaps Levitz was aware of the implications of losing the founders as well on the book.

Using the subplot pages we’ve had to reveal something dramatic about the origins of the team would have been nice. But if there was only one short story left to do it, I’d prefer what we got to someone popping out of nowhere in a Bizarro costume claiming “Me No Create Justice League!” smile

Originally Posted by Cramer
Although they're subjected to psychic rehab, the prisoners are angry - there's no indication that they're about to become productive, peaceful citizens on release. Releasing the prisoners themselves closes a chapter for Imra, Garth and Rokk, but it's a peculiar way to do that.


I imagine that they will only be released after their further psychological treatments. Treatment that will instil the values of the society they will be re-entering. Imagine you took the values of your country in the 1950s and used that as a template to use for prisoner treatments now. In other words, the values of a society change very rapidly. Not to mention all the other things that will have been added to make them docile and conformist to authority.

Originally Posted by Cramer
Rokk's face in the hourglass is meant to show the passing of time for them as Legionnaires, but shouts Time Trapper to me now.


Good Spot! So many signs!

Originally Posted by HWW
I would have died to join the Legion or some other group where people were valued for their individual talents yet part of a collective that served some worthwhile purpose. Fitting in is a powerful motivator to adolescents and is one reason, I understand, why young people become radicalized. They are seduced into thinking they will find a “family” that their real families and friends failed to provide for them.

The Legion often served as my “family” in this regard.


Thanks for sharing that HWW. It’s always interesting to find out how the book connects with people and how much it can mean to them.

Originally Posted by HWW
There is no plot. Nothing changes. No one learns anything. No one grows. At its core, every story should include this element—something is different than it was at the beginning of the story. Otherwise, what is the point?


I think that there’s certainly some sense of closure of this part of the Legion’s story, even if it’s mostly confirmation of subplots we’ve had running for a while. The change, each time, is a gradual one towards deciding to leave. They’re closer each time, and tying it to the team’s origin makes this one a larger step than most. But I agree there should have been a more decisive moment at the end here, to cement that step.

Originally Posted by HWW
Originally Posted by thoth
A quick peek out at our own world shows plenty of leaders (ugh!) willing to use all sorts of mechanisms to achieve, and hold onto, power. None of them are good ones. In this issue we’ve learned that minds of criminals can be altered to make them docile and programmable. Of course, the definition of who is a criminal can change as the law does and as the lawmakers/ tyrants decide. Let’s hope the President isn’t mixed up with someone who could use mind altering treatments that we’ve just seen used on the Legion’s first prisoners. Smile


Yep. I don't know if Levitz intended for us to draw connections between Desai's speech and the reprogramming of criminals. If he did, he's a brilliant writer (or an overly subtle one. smile )


The sound of the penny dropping in my head made me think it was deliberate. It’s one of those in his tenure where I wonder what else I’m missing just romping through the rereads. However, I don’t recall a direct link between this and later issues, so we’ll see. All the pieces are here though. The price of this is that some stories in isolation look to be a little static, because they are really part of a larger structure. The trick is to give each layer suitable payoffs along the way.

Originally Posted by HWW
Good points. I just wish there had been an actual story. When you have to wait months or years for a plotline to bear fruit, there should be something else to make the in-between trips worthwhile.


I agree. A lot of UK writers who began working for DC Comics around this time were bred on anthology comics where there had to be a weekly payoff, whether as a standalone or as part of a larger arc. So the plot would have to push every six or seven pages. Pretty much perfect for a Levitz Legion. While very often action packed, it didn’t always have to be, as Alan Moore showed with Halo Jones for example. There was plenty of scope to provide meaningful, poignant stories, but ones with more drive than the meandering founder one here. The Legion would see that sort of structure at work in the early arcs of Abnett & Lanning.


"...not having to believe in a thing to be interested in it and not having to explain a thing to appreciate the wonder of it."
Re: Re-Reading the Legion: Archives Volume 21
Fat Cramer #955098 08/03/18 06:00 AM
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Originally Posted by HWW
The two thugs were hired by Doyle, which I believe was established in the Legion's origin story in Superboy # 147. Doyle was revealed in Secrets of the LSH to have died in prison.

I wasn't sure where the loss of memory angle was going, either. I thought the Founders would discover something unethical going on at the Antarctica prison and step in to stop it. But that doesn't happen. I guess we're meant to conclude that the prisoners' behavior is just part of the mental reprogramming we've seen criminals go through before, but it does leave us with disturbing implications. The thugs must have known at one time who the three Legionnaires were and their own role in sparking the formation of the Legion. Are criminals not allowed to watch the news in the Antarctica prison? Other prisoners would surely not have allowed them to forget.


Thanks for the background info. That makes more sense. They could have done more with the memory problem - that they were deliberately wiped by someone (as suggested by thoth, like Universo - setting up a deeper layer re: the attempt on RJ's life and future plans) or that the rehab technology went wrong and has turned them into something else, to be seen at a later date, or they're faking it for some reason.

Originally Posted by thoth
With the origin in mind, it was possibly too late to have an espionage thriller here, as they uncover something about the team’s origins. Actually, no. It wouldn’t be too late. That would have made for a much more interesting subplot. smile Likewise, this story could have been done through RJ Brande visiting the prisoners, having spoken with the founders and learning of their decisions. We could have learned something new, or had a few plot seeds sown. This story serves its purpose, just as the origin issue did. Two would be assassins dealt with by three people, firstly in a small skirmish and finally in a back water prison.


Agreed, more could have been done with this story. Bringing in RJ would have been a plus.

Originally Posted by HWW
Especially effective is the 10-panel sequence on Page 4, when Chuck listens with polite confusion as Comet Queen’s mouth dominates alternate panels, prattling on in what to him amounts to a foreign language. This is one of the few instances I can think of when Giffen’s sense of humor actually works. (Chuck, like Tenz, is made for Giffen’s off-the-wall humor.)


This was a good scene. I don't recall anyone else having trouble with or commenting on her strange language pattern.

Originally Posted by HWW
“The Impossible Target” undermined our stereotypes of who Chuck is and what he could do. “New Business” merely reinforces them.


That's my biggest problem with the story. It does show that Chuck is at ease dealing with people and the public and can figure out how to use different sentients' powers effectively (good for his Academy work). However, to leave his flight ring behind was just careless.

Originally Posted by HWW
. I guess we are meant to relate to CQ because she is “one of us.”


Great Galaxies! I hope not!


Holy Cats of Egypt!
Re: Re-Reading the Legion: Archives Volume 21
Fat Cramer #955140 08/03/18 01:51 PM
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Back Up Story

Chuck shares a story with his good friend Kal. In the past, we saw how Lone Wolf reached the Academy. We quickly learned that RJ Brande hired Dawny away from her previous job. Here, we learn how Chuck met Comet Queen.

I’m trying to remember what I’d have felt about the art. I’d not have hated it as I’d been introduced to Ambush Bug quite a while before this hit the newsstands. I doubt I’d have loved the cartoony approach either. Being in an issue with the classic Colon art probably worked in it’s favour. Cartoony Giffen against shiny, bright Lightle might have been a bit more jarring.

Looking at it now, it’s a treat seeing GIffen really getting the most out of the visuals of Chuck’s powers. The expressions and movement are really nice. After the splash page, where Giffen can’t resist adding another panel, we’re back into the Levitz and Giffen story density. We get a lot of panels, anchored around the same circular one with narrator Chuck.

Chuck being a goodwill ambassador is a light hearted affair. But it’s also a nice reminder of all the work that the legion does when not fighting villains. It also fits in nicely with Chuck’s (at the time) reasonably recent role at the Academy. He can use the tour to scope out prospective students.

He’s not that impressed with the effervescent Grava though. His trouble understanding her is priceless, and it’s a payoff for having all those earlier panels. He tells her that he got rejected and then had to prove his worth to the Legion before he could join. Grava takes the hint. But Chuck’s point was that it wasn’t so straight forward to join. Grava, on the other hand, thinks that if she succeeds in something heroic, then she’ll be accepted. Chuck ungraciously refers to her as dense (in front of her dad too) it’s how Jacques, Shady, Blok and Mysa all got in. smile

There’s the one big plot fudge where Chuck hasn’t brought along his flight ring. Flight would have solved all the upcoming issues. As Chuck tackles Grava and they crash, even she’s grounded by breaking her leg (ouch!). We learn about her origin, which is a play on Star Boy’s.

Unfortunately, the ancient ruins Grava thought she was finding to prove herself, turn out to be volcanic vents. We get to see Grava’s powers at work as we’re reminded of just how tactically minded Chuck is. It’s good writing to make sure that both get their spotlight. Chuck instructs Grava to short out the venting system, preventing them from being incinerated.

Although things didn’t work out as planned, Grava does enough to prove herself worthy of a place in the Academy. As Chuck was the one who gave her the idea to go off and do something dramatic, and was the one who got her leg broken because he forgot his flight ring, it’s the least he could do.

We’re told that Comet Queen will be one of the candidates for membership at the next general meeting. It’s more of a definite statement than the founders inching towards a decision in the first story. It looks as though the plan is for both storylines to become one, which might explain a couple of the small steps along the way. It’s a shame we didn’t have a few issues with back ups showing us some of the prospective members. I imagine that readers would have thought Comet Queen would get membership, having had a whole back up spotlighting her. Time will tell.


"...not having to believe in a thing to be interested in it and not having to explain a thing to appreciate the wonder of it."
Re: Re-Reading the Legion: Archives Volume 21
Fat Cramer #955235 08/05/18 04:44 PM
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Originally Posted by Fat Cramer

Originally Posted by HWW
Especially effective is the 10-panel sequence on Page 4, when Chuck listens with polite confusion as Comet Queen’s mouth dominates alternate panels, prattling on in what to him amounts to a foreign language. This is one of the few instances I can think of when Giffen’s sense of humor actually works. (Chuck, like Tenz, is made for Giffen’s off-the-wall humor.)


This was a good scene. I don't recall anyone else having trouble with or commenting on her strange language pattern.


After CQ was admitted to the Academy, perhaps Brainy reprogrammed the earplugs to accept Valleygirlese.


Quote
Originally Posted by HWW
. I guess we are meant to relate to CQ because she is “one of us.”


Great Galaxies! I hope not!


What? You don't have the desire to sleep in a nuclear reactor? smile

If I were going to emulate any Legionnaire's origin, it would be Lyle's. He's the only one who went looking for a power and used some intelligence to do so. Nearly everyone else acquired their powers through nature, birthright, an accident, or the machinations of a villain. Even Val, who was trained from infancy, didn't really have a choice in the matter.


Originally Posted by thoth
Chuck shares a story with his good friend Kal.


Curiously, Kal does not appear in the backup story, nor is he referred to by name. I wonder if this story was commissioned and begun some time earlier, like the Orlando fill-in in #6, before it was decided to whom Chuck would be talking.


Quote
As Chuck was the one who gave her the idea to go off and do something dramatic, and was the one who got her leg broken because he forgot his flight ring, it’s the least he could do.


Ah, that explains a lot. Guilt-trip a Legionnaire. They've come a long way since their days of callous rejections. smile


Quote
I imagine that readers would have thought Comet Queen would get membership, having had a whole back up spotlighting her.


That was certainly my impression. She was the most distinctive of the academy students, both in appearance and personality. Her comet powers would have been very useful in battle and open to a variety of applications, much like Jan's.


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Re: Re-Reading the Legion: Archives Volume 21
Fat Cramer #955250 08/05/18 06:58 PM
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Joined: Sep 2013
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If Giffen had remained on the title, I imagine she would have joined since he created her along with Levitz. We'd have ended up with a different "special student" who turned out to be Tellus and Quislet.


"...not having to believe in a thing to be interested in it and not having to explain a thing to appreciate the wonder of it."
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