Legion World Forums LEGION COMPANION Dr. Gym'll's Cultural Rarities My Big-Ass Pile o'Trades Waiting To Be Read At My Whim

I finished off the Man-Thing Omnibus earlier today. Overall, I think the post-Gerber stories are very good. My only quip is that the writers tended to write the same kinds of stories that Gerber wrote without really putting their own signature on the character. But it was a great framework he built, so I can't blame them.

It's always interesting to see Chris Claremont writing non-mutant books, and he wrote the bulk of the second ongoing Man-Thing series. He added three new supporting cast members, all of whom were pretty interesting, and there was a really good multi-part arc to end the run.

The standard of above average art continued as well. We got some vintage Sal Buscema in a 2-part Hulk guest appearance, one of my personal faves John Byrne in Marvel Team-Up and Two-in-One stories, an unusual turn for Jim Starlin in a story that appeared in Rampaging Hulk, Jim Mooney in the first four issues of Man-Thing Vol. 2, Gene Colan in a Doctor Strange crossover, some above par work from Don Perlin for the bulk of Claremont's run, short stories drawn by Ed Hannigan and Larry Hama and a return for the second series finale by one of Manny's defining artists Val Mayerik. All do a creditable job, even workman but generally unexceptional guys like Perlin and Hama who's better known as a writer and whose art I compare unfavorably to Mark Gruenwald's thankfully sparse drawing output. One has to conclude that the unusual material is inspiring to those who worked on it.

There's a nice treat in that the Rampaging Hulk story features a Gerber script after his run. It's typical of his standalone stories, which is not a bad thing. It makes me think this was a previously unpublished inventory story because I think he would've grasped the chance to do something unusual with the character had he returned for another story. Again, Starlin drew the story, and seeing him do more down to earth/horror fare is a bit of a treat because he's obviously known for his cosmic stuff.

All in all, I strongly recommend all of the material from Man-Thing Omnibus. Though the Gerber stuff (reviewed earlier in this thread) is clearly the best, I feel the whole thing is very much worth reading and well worth the cover price (though you can get a bargain like I did pretty easily). Plus, there's libraries and Marvel Essentials cheap B&Ws. In fact I wish Marvel would revive the book with a passionate creative team. There's a definite void in their line-up that a book like this could fill. Plus, there's SO much unexplored potential with the nexus of realities and Jennifer Kale, etc. that even Gerber never got around to fulfilling.

Just checked my shipping list for my DCBS order-- by Friday, I shall have 5 new trades: CHEW: Chicken Tenders, DARK TOWER: The Drawing of the Three- The Prisoner, RUST: The Death of Rocket Boy, SEX CRIMINALS: Two Worlds One Cop, and The Walking Dead HC Vol 11. Hope Ginny's not bringing me anything for Library Day this week---!!

Are those Man-Thing stories similar in tone to the Swamp Thing stories from the same era?

Hm. Not sure, since I've only really read the Moore stories any time recently (the non-Moore others, like, 30 years ago). I'll try, though:

What is similar, at least, to the ones that I can remember is there's a definite horror bent and more mature themes than your superhero fare.

What is very different is that Man-Thing has no sentience to speak of. He is truly a creature and only reacts empathically to what goes on around him. "Negative" emotions, particularly fear, tend to cause him huge psychic pain, and he is driven to stop that pain. His tagline is: "whoever knows fear burns at the Man-Thing's touch!"

So Man-Thing stories are much more about the people and situations he comes in contact with, and Manny is often a catalyst in whatever the drama might be. Swamp Thing can be about that, as well, at times, but he has his intelligence and is very much an active player in his stories for the most part. But, trust me, these are some interesting, exciting and thought-provoking stories that are still relevant and meanigful over three decades later!

Thanks for the recommendation, Lardy. I'll check them out when I can.

Pile UPDATE (3/19/15).....

Just Finished
From Hell

Recently Read
Star Wars (The Marvel Years) Omnibus Vol. 1 (the first 17 issues/300 pages)
Marvel Masterworks: Defenders Vol. 2

To-Read Pile (new stuff since last time in bold)
Tales of the Batman: Gene Colan
Huntress: Darknight Daughter
Marvel Masterworks: The Defenders Vols. 3 & 4
Grendel Omnibus Vol. 2: The Legacy
Mage Vol. 2: The Hero Defined
Legion Archives Vol. 9 (for the Re-reading project)
West Coast Avengers Omnibus Vol. 1
Jinx
Goldfish
Captain America: War & Remembrance
Fantastic Four by John Byrne Omnibus Vol. 1
Scout Vol. 2
Frank Miller's Ronin Deluxe Edition
Marvel Masterworks: Iron Fist Vol. 1
Spider-Man by Roger Stern Omnibus
Marvel Masterworks: Silver Surfer Vol. 1
Iron Man by Michelinie, Layton & Romita, Jr. Omnibus
Tales of the Batman: Len Wein
Murder Me Dead (David Lapham)
Stray Bullets Uber Alles Edition
Star Wars: Marvel Years Omnibus Vol. 1
Amazing Spider-Man: The Original Clone Saga
Daredevil by Frank Miller & Klaus Jansen Omnibus
Grimjack Omnibus Vol. 2
West Coast Avengers Omnibus Vol. 2
Avengers Omnibus Vol. 1
Jon Sable: Freelance Omnibus Vols. 1 & 2


On the Way from eBay/In-Stock Trades
Avengers Omnibus Vol. 2
Secret Six Vol. 1: Villains United

Current Heavy eBay Stalk
Fantastic Four by John Byrne Omnibus Vol. 2


Have I mentioned that I'm in LOVE with Omnibuses?!?

Look for reviews very soon on From Hell, classic Marvel Star Wars and Defenders Masterworks Vol. 2!!!!!

Excellent, Lardy. As always, I greatly look forward to your reviews.

BTW, I've yet to read From Hell. I think it's about time I did...but not until after I re-activate the PAD Hulk re-read and finish the third Fables trade.

To me, "From Hell" is Moore's best work. Maybe not my favourite on an emotional level, but in terms of scope, structure and tone, it's a masterpiece.

That's high praise, indeed!

I just checked my library's catalog -- they have it. YAY!

I suppose, with its mention receiving the most attention, I should start with From Hell:

Where to start? Well, Dave's brief analysis of the work is certainly apt. From Hell is quite a masterpiece and is yet another in a series of such from Alan Moore, who is himself one of this medium's undisputed masters. Oddly enough, Moore is seemingly always joined by a different artist with each major project. That's really saying something because so many writers tend to return to certain artists over and over again and use them like a safety net or even a crutch. I find myself really admiring Moore for this. It shows he wants to challenge himself and not get stuck in a rut because you just know he could have his pick of artists on any given project.

So I will start with Moore's artist for this piece: Eddie Campbell. Campbell is an artist with whom I've had very little exposure to before. I thought it was as an artist on Hellblazer, but he was actually the writer for a brief run there with another artist. And like seemingly every artist Moore works with, Campbell's art is absolutely perfect for conveying the mood and feel that Moore's story deserves. To me, every black and white panel looks like a lithograph (if that word is accurate to describe the art I'm thinking of). the overall effect evokes both the general shaded cartooning style of political cartoons and the old style of printing them using etched plates for mass-production. It's all that and yet still has modern sensibilities and high levels of detail. That's what I'm trying to describe. And for a story set near the end of Victorian London, I can't think of a better stylistic choice to use.

From Hell is not a mystery yarn. Almost immediately, we are clued in as to whom the Ripper is/will be in the story. And it's not an unfamiliar scenario. I'm pretty casual in my knowledge of "Ripperology", but I recognized the story's culprit and the larger conspiracy theory behind him that makes this spin, true or not, such a tantalizing story to tell. On its own this story angle makes for an entertaining tale, but From Hell is so much more than that.

[Digression] Honestly, the film that was (very) loosely based on this work does the source a tremendous disservice by basically stripping it down to its bare bones and, even then, altering many of those bones beyond recognition. I know that the Watchmen and V for Vendetta films are criticized similarly, but in comparison both are much more faithful in their own ways than the From Hell movie. [/Digression]

So beyond the excellent plot detailings around and within the conspiracy and the murderers and the fascinating cast of characters, we get such a wealth of subtext. I mean, there's the great allegory and shading about the murders giving birth to the 20th century. But there's a great, affecting look at how the British society at the time basically begat the prostitution that these women were forced to resort to--many of them were, or had been, married for chrissake! Often, they had to turn tricks just to have a safe place to sleep from night to night. And there's the always wide divide between the haves and have-nots that clashes in a particularly literal and explosive manner. I think doing this was particularly appealing for Moore when choosing to dramatize this particular Ripper theory.

I think that's an important thing to remember while reading From Hell: it's A theory and a particularly entertaining one, but we'll probably never know the truth of the matter. It's pretty clear from his lengthy Appendix that Moore has no such delusions about the complete truth of the story and especially about the Ripper's identity. But he fully commits in the story itself and sells every aspect of it. He even gives the Ripper some depth while not making him less of a monster. And we get to know the eventual victims' stories very well. Lots of other fascinating characters as well, such as lead investigator Abberline and many other real-life characters and even many famous cameos.

I think what really sends From Hell over the edge is the metaphysical content. Moore has always had a particularly great talent for making the metaphysical relatable and understandable without ever dumbing it down. There's a lot in there, as when the Ripper has his driver take a specific tour of London to illustrate his personal motives for the horror he is about to undertake. I can't really do it justice trying to describe it. And then there are the supernatural phenomena the Ripper experiences during the murders that venture to the edge of sci-fi. And then, how it all coalesces in the Ripper's final journey.... Believe me, it all works and serves the story in a way that just elevates it into something that is so much more than just a Jack the Ripper story!

And then there's the Appendices.....you'll want to read all 41 pages of Moore's chapter-by-chapter notes and then the excellent illustrated short story that casts the whole Ripper phenomenon in its proper sardonic context.

Hell, just read the damn thing already if you haven't and experience it for yourself! My review of the book does it about as much justice as the lousy film adaptation did when all is said and done. READ IT!

Been sick and am now travelling in Dallas, Shreveport and Oklahoma City, but wanted to chime in on From Hell-- read it just about a year ago and posted a review full of praise in the Any Recs thread.

Absolutely was mesmerized by it, and I think it's a solid contender for Moore's best work and my favorite by him. So many choices by he and Campbell are bold and original, and work towards creating an amazing narrative about humanity, gender, the Victorian era (and by extension, of course, today). One of the most rewarding reads in a long while.

Love those appendix notes too.

Here's what you wrote about it last year:



Like you, I think it's probably between V for Vendetta and From Hell for his best work, though I may lean slightly toward V for my overall reaction to it. I may have to re-read V soon to help me reassess this notion.

Most people would say Watchmen, I suspect, because of its ultra-high profile and impact on the comics landscape. I'll never dispute its excellence, but it's hard to eliminate the cumulative effect of its overexposure and DC's recent exploitation of it from the equation. In fact, I'd elevate his run on Swamp Thing above Watchmen at this point.

I found V hadn't aged as well as other Moore works in my last look at it, but as the political pendulum continues to swing right in the West, it may be worth another look.

Swamp Thing for me is still the favourite and the most emotionally resonant.

As a standalone piece, I think Watchmen is brilliant, though it's subtleties are often misunderstood (and as the movie and "before" books prove, misunderstood by DC/WB as well). I can understand Moore's frustrations that people took exactly the wrong things from it, leaving him in many ways as one of the inadvertent fathers fo the Dark Age.

In From Hell, the chapter in which the Ripper and his driver take a tour of London's architecture is one of those mesmerizing series of pages that I allude to above. I read it in a noisy airport last year and by page 4 I had totally drowned out everything around me as if I was in a library--that was how well Moore masterfully transported me to the Victorian era.

The gradual build up of tension, culminating in the driver's everyday reaction, is palpable. You, as a reader, understand precisely what Moore is doing, yet you still feel the sense that something sinister is taking place. It's riveting! And on the surface, it's something like 45 pages of discussion on architecture.

It IS a really fascinating chapter, so much so that it was the only part of the Appendix that I skipped because I really didn't feel I needed further explanation. Oh, I intend to read it at some point, of course....probably after some future second reading. It's enthralling, though, to see how Moore used this tour of London to paint the broad strokes of (this version, anyway) the Ripper's own personal motivations for committing the murders. It really sets up the extra-normal aspects of the story to come.

I also love how the chapters vary in length, depending on what story Moore wanted to tell. It's the most loosely structured work of Moore's I've seen, and I think it benefits immensely from not being confined to a certain page count.

Meanwhile, I still owe a couple of reviews! Seeing as how I've just read another TPB (Huntress: Darknight Daughter), I'd better step on it!

Star Wars: The Marvel Years Omnibus Vol. 1 (collects Star Wars 1-44): Well, anyone who's been paying attention to my rants about the comics of my childhood shouldn't be surprised about my nostalgia for Marvel's original Star Wars series. The most pleasant surprise, though, in reading the first 300 pages of this handsome collection was really how well-crafted and entertaining these stories really were, especially with so much going against them.

What do I mean? Well, the actual film adaptation (comprised of the first six issues) of what would later be called "A New Hope" was completed without any of the creators seeing anything near the final cut of the film! I mean, Howard Chaykin and even writer Roy Thomas had to take some leaps of faith and do the best they had with what they got. What you get is an adaptation that feels much more like a comic book than a movie. A lot of the dialogue is a little off, and some scenes lack special detail. Plus, some of the iconic deleted scenes were still in the adaptation, including the legendary scenes with Luke and Biggs and the notorious Jabba the Hut (one "t") appearance as a bipedal green dude. But I love it! All of the narration and descriptions that deepen the context of the story make it, hands down, my favorite of any comics movie adaptation, especially because it's unapologetically a comic book!

Another thing interesting about the book after the movie adaptation is how little the creators had to go on to continue the story. As Thomas says in his intro, restrictions were put on the book by Lucasfilm, including their not being allowed to use Darth Vader (something they obviously would loosen their stance on eventually), to develop the Luke/Leia romance (and not being told why) or to delve into the Clone Wars as mentioned in some throwaway lines.

In truth, the post-movie stories do feel a bit off in tone. If you think about it, they didn't really have a lot to go on from just the one film. Though it did a great deal of world-building, the universe was still vastly unexplored and the characters mostly just scratching the surface. The next movie would go a long way toward expanding the scope and characters, but meanwhile, Marvel just kinda had to run with it as best they could. For me, that made for a fun and imaginative run from the get-go.

The first arc to follow the film adaptation in issues 7-10 is one that is often referenced, usually in a derisive manner, as an example of Marvel's supposed abuse of the franchise. Most often cited is the appearance of giant humanoid green Bugs Bunny-riff character Jaxon as part of Thomas and Chaykin's Seven Samurai riff with Han and Chewie at the center of the crusade. Well, I personally loved Jaxon as a kid and still love him during this rediscovery. The more egregious character in the group, to me, is the character of Don Won Kihotay, the apparently senile wannabe Jedi Knight. But even he becomes pretty cool as the story progresses and leaves me wanting more of survivors of the "Eight for Aduba" crew.

Beyond that, I like the arc for daring to focus pretty much entirely around Han and Chewie, leaving Luke, Leia and the droids entirely to brief subplot cameos. I thought it was interesting they had the pair immediately get their reward from the Rebellion ripped off by pirates and find themselves down and out on a backwater world--yet immediately finding a heroic purpose while still within their mercenary ways.

All of the Aduba Eight are fun, and when two of them are lost (though one loss is frustrating because his death or even any peril was not depicted clearly) and another almost lost, it's pretty affecting. Several of them are analogs for the missing members of the Star Wars cast, and it's interesting to see what effect Luke and the rest had on Han (who for all he knows, he may never see again) by proxy during their brief adventure.

The ending, in which there is a destructive third party called to intervene between Han's crew and the marauders, robs the story of some of it's gravitas and build-up. But it's nice to see more fantasy elements brought in, which would later become more prominent in the films.

The end of this second arc marks the departure of both Roy Thomas and Howard Chaykin. Roy, I think, gives way to a writer more suited to the book, Archie Goodwin. I lament the departure of Chaykin more because toward the end of his run, Tom Palmer joined him as inker, and I feel the book never looked better (at least early on) than it did with those two paired together. I certainly wish I'd seen more of them, at the very least!

The third arc (issues 11-15), imo, is really a superior arc. While searching for a new rebel base, Luke and the droids crash land on a water planet and are caught in a war between scavengers and dragon-riders who are descendants of some never-do-wells. It gets even more complicated when Leia gets captured by the same pirates that ripped off Han and Chewie's reward while looking for Luke. Han and Chewie run into the pirates and by extension Leia, and they trick the pirates into taking them all to Luke's last known location with the promise of rebel treasure. Eventually, all the characters come back together and face the triple-threat of all these factions in a very satisfying story. Honestly, if Lucas had done an Episode IV and a half, this would have made for a very entertaining movie!

The arc just seems so perfectly crafted that I'm surprised it doesn't get mentioned more in fandom. there are some great moments--like when Leia decks Han--that seem so appropriate and prescient of what would later happen. Goodwin, supposedly restricted from exploring Luke and Leia, seems to have run with the chemistry Leia and Han had. Han comes off as a bad-ass, the Princess aggressive and cunning and Luke capable of thinking on his feet with some logical extension of his desert farmboy upbringing--it makes sense that he can't swim! And it also has just the right dash of pathos in a character's passing and just a really deep backstory behind the water planet inhabitants.

The artist in residence on the arc and for some time to come is legendary Flash artist Carmine Infantino. In some ways his style here in a situation utilizing characters whose likenesses are based on real people is a little jarring. Chaykin rarely worried about the likenesses (though in some panels he's absolutely dead-on), but his style seemed to be more of a natural to the story. I think even as a kid, I noticed that Infantino's faces seemed, I dunno, a little angular for the characters. Something else else about how he draws Leia, especially. But as I read through the story, there's no denying Infantino's storytelling ability. And though he is an odder choice and less natural fit than Chaykin, I do overall like his work here. Certainly doesn't hurt that the child inside me recognizes the images and stirs the nostalgia.

I think it's wonderful that the series began with three extended arcs (including the film). It immediately marked the book as different from its superhero brethren at Marvel and really suited the epic nature of the property. I know from memory that there are more extended arcs to come and that Goodwin wouldn't be leaving any time soon. From what I'm reading and re-living here, that's definitely a good thing!

Next up, is the first true one-shot of the series, and it's a special treat as none other than Walt Simonson steps in for a guest pencil. Not only is it the first one-shot but it also is devoid of any of the principle characters, aside from some flashback montages! It features a bounty hunter, Valance, out to get Luke and the droids. Instead, he finds the survivors of the Aduba Eight crew, thinking that the characters who fought with Han were actually them. So we get the return of Jaxon and the others in a fine adventure (one last time unfortunately) and the likelihood that Valance will meet the real deals before long, after revealing a (fairly predictable, admittedly) secret Valance has behind his hatred of droids. It's a cool story reuniting Goodwin and Simonson, who created the iconic Manhunter stories for DC.

After that issue, I decided to suspend my reading of the Omnibus for a while. I enjoyed it thoroughly but wanted to savor the great epics I'd just read, knowing that there are more great epics to come. I'll pick up where I left off soon and look forward to doing so when the time is right.

I can honestly say that I enjoyed these stories a lot. I think that aside from the nostalgia, they are very entertaining on their own merits. They are fun, imaginative and memorable. Star Wars purists may scoff, but I'm as big a fan as there's ever been and don't. Honestly, I'm hard-pressed to think of Star Wars comics much better than these and am especially delighted to see stories of the universe not bound by the struggle with the Empire and/or evil Sith lords. It's damn fun space fantasy, and that's what Star Wars is at its core!

It was and it wasn't. Originally it was running as a part of Steve Bissette's "Taboo" anthology in shorter clips, but when that book sadly went under, It came out infrequently as Prestige Format singles (first by Tundra, then by Kitchen Sink), though the last Chapter was larger than the others.

It's interesting that anything by Alan Moore at that stage of his career would have any publication difficulties. Regardless, I think the irregular length of the chapters and that each has a definite purpose speaks to my overall point.

Marvel Masterworks: The Defenders Vol. 2: So the bulk of this hardcover I had read less than a year ago as part of a massive Avengers read project that spanned the beginning of the Kree/Skrull War in Avengers 89 and ending with the original Taskmaster story in Avengers 196. The part of that that this volume includes is the multi-issue Avengers/Defenders War. That very crossover prompted me to look into Defenders reprints as well. I decided to buy this volume despite the bulk of it containing story I already had for the sake of completion, including stories leading up to and taking place after said crossover that I hadn't read before. It certainly didn't hurt that this volume sells very cheaply on eBay!

If anyone's interested in my thoughts (and those of such luminaries as Cobie and Fanfic Lady) on the Avengers/Defenders War, which I really loved, you can read them in the All Avengers Thread, starting here. I don't have much to add to those thoughts on a second viewing, except to say that it remains a very good read even after reading it for a second instance in a short period of time. Not as compelling or new, but still damn good!

So preceding the A/D War, we have a 2-parter which both features Attuma leading (another) surface invasion and sets up Hawkeye to be present and on the Defenders' side during the upcoming War. Attuma has never been all that compelling to me, and this story does little to counter that feeling. weirder for me was seeing the Red Ghost as Attuma's ally without his Super-Apes and wearing a chesty '70s costume instead of his parka! It's not our man Steve Englehart's finest hour, but even with it's problems, it has some genuine pathos with it being Namor's first fight with Attuma since Lady Dorma's death. Plus there's some exploration of the Valkyrie's identity crisis.

After the A/D War, Englehart leaves and Len Wein comes aboard as writer for a while. I thought he immediately got off to a fun start with his Xemnu story in issue 12. Xemnu is not an inherently interesting opponent, but Len makes it a great showcase for the dynamic of Hulk, Val and Doc that makes it work for me.

Then, Len brings in a new core Defender in his 2-parter in 13-14. The plot with the Squadron Sinister "selling" the Earth to Nebulon is a bit of a clunker, but it's nice to see Nighthawk featured and joining up with our non-team.

(As a sidebar, I find the Squadron Sinister a little confusing. I understand (I think!) that they are the main Marvel Earth counterparts to the Squadron Supreme, and that the villainous version actually appeared first. But, I dunno, the waters get muddy for me at some point. For example, whatever happened to them?!?)

In there somewhere is Giant Size Defenders 1. Unfortunately, it's not memorable. It reads like a "clip show" episode of your favorite TV show with a thin plot bridging a series of Hulk, Doc and Subby reprints to supposedly give val a better understanding of her new teammates. Pretty much a yawner.

The edition concludes with a 2-part battle with Magneto and his Brotherhood and centering around Maggie's creation of Alpha, the ultimate mutant. It's really odd that Wein chooses to include Professor X but leave out the original X-Men, who are said to be appearing in Marvel Team-Up at the same time in an editorial box. It's certainly not a great story, especially with its portrayal of Maggie as the garden variety megalomaniac that Claremont would later deconstruct. And its denouement with Maggie and the Brotherhood all reduced to babies was kind of odd, but it's not a bad story on its own merits. Hulk, Doc, Val and Nighthawk are featured and all click pretty well. Plus, you know that Len would go on to revive the X-Men with Dave Cockrum before long, so you know writing stories in the X-Men's milieu probably sparked his interest there.

So it wasn't unexpected that the stories in this volume around the A/D War might pale by comparison, but I don't regret reading them for completeness and for some interesting nuggets here and there. But the greatest pleasure was seeing the work of Sal Buscema continue on the title and knowing there is plenty more to come, especially soon with Steve Gerber writing. To me, his work on Defenders and Spectacular Spider-Man are among the best work Sal has ever done. I feel his character work on Namor, Doctor Strange, Hulk and Valkyrie are just iconic and some of the best interpretations of those four. I'm not in love with his Silver Surfer, and I need to see more of his Nighthawk--but I think those four are rendered just perfectly by him. And given that those are four of the core characters, his mastery of them makes any Defenders story he draws a pleasure to look at at the very least!

Glad you enjoyed those stories, Lardy.

I agree about Sal Buscema's Defenders art at this point -- he was really coming into his own around this time, no longer so beholden to his brother John's style. Sharp, angular (but not to the point of being weird) and very energetic.

But I'm afraid I can't be any help where the Squadron Sinister's history is concerned. I'm just as confused by it as you are.

Funny about Len Wein. Over at DC around this time (or, more accurately, shortly before it), he was reinventing the wheel with his work on JLA and Swamp Thing, but he got off to an awkward start at Marvel. He did improve quite a bit over the course of the mid-70s IMO. And I'd never thought about how the Defenders vs Magneto story might have lit the spark that led to the revival of the X-Men. Good point.

Regarding Nebulon, I've always felt he had a cool name and a great look, but ever lived up to his potential.

IIRC, Lardy, you've got Marvel Masterworks Defenders vols. 3 & 4 in the pipeline, but have you read Marvel Masterworks Defenders vol. 1? I'm very fond of Englehart's first five issues of Defenders, especially his portrayal of the Enchantress. I hope you don't miss out on those.

Yep, I read Vol. 1 several months ago. Thought I reviewed it, but didn't. Certainly meant to!

Alas, the memory's a bit too fuzzy now to rectify that now. But I certainly enjoyed that volume a great deal, particularly the Englehart material once the ongoing series started. The Roy Thomas stuff in Marvel Feature and was decent, but Englehart and Sal really made the book its own thing and grabbed my attention. No surprise, I suppose since Englehart has emerged as such a favorite of mine over the past year, especially.

(It's killing me, though, because I can seemingly recall my review of Vol. 1 but can't find it anywhere!!! )

So, to get all caught up, my most recent read from The Pile was the Huntress: Darknight Daughter TPB I'd gotten last summer. This was a no-brainer to get once I learned of its existence because I love me some classic Earth-2 and have been particularly enamored of its alternate Batman mythos since I was a child. This collection reprints the Huntress solo stories from DC Superstars 17, Batman Family 18-20 and her backup stories from Wonder Woman 271-287, 289-90 & 294-95. The writer is her co-creator and giant among the Legion mythos Paul Levitz and the penciller is her co-creator Joe Staton with various inkers including Steve Mitchell, Bob Layton and Jerry Ordway among others.

I love this original version of the Huntress! Even as a pre-teen there was something that attracted me to her enough that I actually bought a couple of the original issues of Wonder Woman (which also happened to feature the debut of Diana's "WW" breastplate) to read Helena's adventures. I only bought one or two of them, but I've always remembered those back-ups and how much I loved the character. Really, her post-Crisis revamp as Helena Bertinelli and even her supposed return to form in the New 52 have paled in comparison, and reading the stories collected within this trade have only reaffirmed that belief.

It's really hard for me to pinpoint what makes these stories really good to me. There have certainly been better-written stories by writers and even Levitz himself, certainly. But I love how Helena's legacy drives her without also overwhelming her. I love that it's Earth-2, but the writing doesn't beat you over the head trying to explain it. I love how her world's Robin and Power Girl guest star but don't overshadow her in her own book. I love that she's tough but no clone of her father. I love the sad origin story centered around her mother's death and the terrible circumstances around it. And I just love that there's a reality where a recognizable version of Bruce and Selina fell in love and had a daughter that carried on their legacies.

Levitz was a fledgling writer crafting these stories, and there are some flaws and holes in many of his plots. But Helena is always capable, likable while also having flaws. Her characterization and the heart he injects into the stories make the flaws easily diminished.

I said in earlier reviews of his run on the Justice Society in the '70s that Joe Staton did some of his best work in the Earth-2 milieu. the same certainly goes for his work on the Huntress. He draws her consistently and beautifully in all of these stories, regardless of who is inking, though some inkers do a better job than others. Here, I could especially see that perhaps Tom Mandrake had some Staton influence in his work.

I honestly don't know if everyone would enjoy this collection as much as I did, but if you like Helena Wayne and the classic earth-2 mythos, I don't think you'll be disappointed. It actually has me hungering for more, as I know there were actually a number of Huntress backups written by Joey Cavalieri for a while after these, which concluded Levitz's run. It seems unlikely that we'll ever get a second collection, sadly.

Actually, it makes me a bit resentful of Crisis and the kind of casual panel-or-so death it gave Helena and Dick. Huntress has never been the same, and she had the potential to be the female superstar that DC has had so relatively few of.

Don't worry about the lack of a Defenders v.1 review, Lardy. That's what we have the Re-Reads thread for. Maybe sometime in the next few years we can do a Defenders re-read together.





My sentiments exactly, Lardy. I would only add that Helena was refreshingly free of the cynicism, angst, and I-have-to-be-tougher-than-the-guys kind of hang-ups that far too many so-called heroines of recent vintage have had.

Lardy, some really great reviews and insights into some very cool comics! As some general feedback, here are my own thoughts and experiences:

Star Wars
I’ve never actually read a single Star Wars comic in my life. It’s fascinating to hear your thoughts on them because I know you are a huge Star Wars fan, and that counts for a lot. I also consider myself a very big Star Wars fan, which I loved throughout my entire childhood and beyond. My experience is quite different from probably most of my LW peers though, because by the time I was old enough to watch the films, Jedi had already been in and out of theaters and the best place I would catch the films is when they were played on TV (which if anyone remembers was like all the time during the late 80’s and 90’s, especially on Christmas day). So I think I ended up watching them totally out of order as a kid: first Jedi, which was great, then Empire, which I loved, and finally I got around to watching “A New Hope” when I was like 13—after watching the other two like 10 times each over the last few years.

But long story short, I loved the films and I feel like just about all of my friends did too. My entire generation of 80’s babies is probably almost entirely more Star Wars than Star Trek. Yet, neither my Dad nor I had much interest in Star Wars comics (or Star Trek comics). And I really still don’t. I even passed on the recent Star Wars #1 which apparently everyone in the world has at least two copies of. I am a huge admirer of Archie Goodwin, Howard Chaykin and even Roy Thomas to a lesser extent, so I’ve always been a little curious. But I have to say its one line in particular of what you wrote that actually has me truly interested in Star Wars comics for the first time ever: “I’m especially delighted to see stories of the universe not bound by the struggle with the Empire and/or evil Sith lords. It's damn fun space fantasy, and that's what Star Wars is at its core!” I think that right there hits on a major reason why I maybe haven’t been all that interested in Star Wars comics but would be interested in these earlier stories. I’ve had more than enough stories featuring the Empire and the Sith. But stories exploring the larger universe beyond? Now that sounds awesome!

Huntress
I’m also a big fan of the original Huntress, though I’m almost certain I only ever really knew her as a kid from the JLA team-ups and her role in Crisis on Infinite Earths. A little later I did read the 70’s All-Star Comics run, and found her awesome there, but I think the real reason I like her is I just love the idea of her. Helena Wayne, by all accounts and purposes, was exactly what it looked like when DC delivered on the promise and concept of Earth-2. DC should have spent the last 30 years coming up with similar Earth-2 concepts instead of trying to bludgeon them into the shared post-Crisis universe, but I digress.

Long story short, I’ve never read any of the Huntress back-ups, but I easily could since we have every Wonder Woman comic from 1960 forward. So at some point, I’d be happy to check them out, because she is a character I would very much like to get to know better.

Defenders
As you allude to, it’s kind of hard to remember a lot of the other Defenders stories right at this time besides the Avengers / Defenders War, which is such a potent force of the era. But I’m with you on Englehart and only have the most positive memories / feelings towards his Marvel work. Meanwhile, the Len Wein stories, like so much of his work, always left me with the memory of them falling very flat. Wein, like Roy Thomas and Gerry Conway, could be brilliant at times but also have extensive runs on comics where his work was average at best. These are the latter. The Magneto story, which I only read once 20+ years ago (so who knows what I’d think now) always felt pretty terrible to me. Nothing offensive about it, just a good example of bad 70’s superhero comics.

However, Sal Buscema is a longtime favorite of mine—naturally because of the Spectacular Spider-Man—and his work during this era was truly coming alive as Fanfie says. As you pointed out, Sal true some iconic on a lot of the Defenders, and for me, his Hulk always stands out.

Love that you’re doing these reviews Lardy. As I grow increasingly bored with modern comics—even the independent scene which I’ve been so immersed in for the last five years or so—I’m feeling more and more like I need to get back to reading past runs from the eras of comics I loved as a kid. These reviews are great to feed that hunger.

I honestly think you'd enjoy these stories quite a bit! It's one thing the original series clearly excelled at, telling fun stories not bound by the Sith and the Empire. The second and third arcs read almost like some terrific LMB adventures, actually! Han's almost a Cobie/Lardy amalgam without powers!

I sure hope you read them some day!



Since you own them anyway, I'd certainly encourage you to read them! When you do so, I'd like to hear about the post-Levitz/Staton stories (something like 24 of them :Elasticlad: ), so you can give me some 411 on them!

Seriously, Helena had a tremendously long run as a backup in WW! I've seen few backups last nearly that long without getting their own book. I'll bet she was on the precipice before the decision was made to do away with Earth-2!




I don't think Len did all that badly in these stories. Like I said, something about that crazy Xemnu story really clicked for me in a way that's hard to explain. But I guess it's hard not to pale in comparison between writers like Englehart and Gerber, who both really made their mark on the book.



It's nice to know my obsession with doing these reviews is paying off! Seriously, it's always gratifying when discussion spins out of them.