Legion World Forums LEGION COMPANION Dr. Gym'll's Cultural Rarities The All Avengers Thread

I hate eggs.

Do you hate pudding, too?

I hate everything. It's part of my charm.

Do you like the first solo Morrissey album, "Viva Hate"?

The first issue of the latest Avengers relaunch came out a couple Wednesdays ago.

It was forgettable. So forgettable I've forgotten most of what happened in it, just that it felt really "decompressed", and it's way too early for that trend to come back into fashion (not that it ever SHOULD, but I digress). IIRC, Vision doesn't even appear, even though he's the only iconic Avenger in the lineup.

Mark Waid is capable of so much better than this.

Yeah, the latest 'Avengers' with Captain Falcon, She-Thor, Iron Man, Vision, Spider-Teen, Ms. Inhuman Marvel and Toddler Nova didn't really start out with a bang.

The first Ultimates, on the other hand, with a team consisting of Black Panther, Blue Marvel, Monica 'I Have No Idea What My Codename Is This Week, But Genis-Vell's Probably Already Stolen It' Rambeau, America Chavez and Captain Carol has set itself up to be pretty interesting. One neat tidbit is that they reveal that Captain Carol can still 'go Binary' if she absorbs enough energy (such as an antimatter blast from Blue Marvel).

The All-New Avengers with Hulkling, Wiccan, Hawkeye, Sunspot, Songbird!!, Power Kid, White Tiger and Squirrel Girl has also been amusing, if a bit Nextwave-ish in it's oddity.

I am gonna stick with ANAD Avengers for a few months because I love Kamala, but I do agree it was a pretty uninspiring start. I honestly wish they'd raised Sam's profile as Falcon rather than have him become Captain America and I am ambivalent about everyone else on the roster. I love Mark Waid when he's on, I'm just not sure he's on here (yet anyway).

New Avengers on the other hand I am already loving despite some misgivings with the art. I didn't actually realise Ultimates had already come out, I'll grab that tomorrow and see what I think

I got the Ultimates and the others. The Ultimates is probably the only one I will stick with.

I love that Carol can Binary again! and hopefully more Marvels will show up! Genius, Phylla Quasar etc. I also like Carol and Photon together, hopefully we will see how they are both awesome and different.

I can't believe what they did for Scarlet Witch. You know how Mavrel's doing variants based on the 90s? You know what costume they used for Wanda's variant?

Her evil look from West Coast Avengers, as in the one she wore when she assaulted Wonder Man.

Wanda did not have an easy time of the 90s...or the 2000s.

I place the blame squarely on the Michelinie/Byrne Wundagore story from the late 70s.

So, The Vision #1 was totally weird and offbeat, and highly enjoyable!

Still haven't found the enthusiasm to read Avengers yet though.

Cobie, thanks to you, I'm intrigued now. The Vision has always seemed like Martian Manhunter to me -- a great team-book character who just can't shine on his own. Would you mind elaborating what it was about the first issue of his book that you found so pleasing?

Did she even have that costume in 1992? I thought that was from the late 80s.

It was the late 80s ('89 to be exact), but it was close enough to the 90s to be attached to them by default.

I have to wonder if Byrne or anyone else would've ever explored the dark sides of Pietro and Wanda if they had remained the children of the Franks. I've said it before, but making them the children of Magneto was probably the worse thing that ever happened to them.

Agreed 100%, Lardy.

There was, admittedly potential for the exploration of Wanda and Pietro's dark sides before the Magneto reveal -- I'm thinking in particular of Wanda's increasingly anti-human attitudes around midway through the Engelhart era, something which never really got followed up on.

You are right that there was some negativity before the reveal. I doubt Englehart ever intended for Wanda to go bad. I like to think he was exploring how a former "Evil Mutant" might have some growing pains in her heroic transition.

I seem to recall, though, his later use of Quicksilver as an antagonist in WCA originated from his thoughts on the character when he occasionally used him during his original Avengers writing tenure. This from some half-remembered Englehart interviews.

Pietro had dark leanings even back in the Roy Thomas/John Buscema run. In #49, when Magneto uses his powers to make two of the guards fire their guns at Wanda, Pietro, none the wiser, thinks that they did it on purpose -- "It was humans who did this! Humans!" Powerful stuff.

I'm never one who is keen on summarizing issues, but to give an overview: The Vision has settled in Washington, D.C. for a job reporting to the President (though this plot point has not yet been followed up on). He's found a home in a rural suburb of D.C. and prior to the start of the issue has created for himself a "family": an Android wife, son and daughter, all based on the same way he himself was created. Whose brain waves he used to do so remain a mystery for now, though its obviously an important subplot that is continually alluded to. "The Visions" thus try to fit into rural DC life while the Vision does his superhero thing. The wife is a stay at home Mom and the kids go off to high school. All of them are supposed to be somewhat unemotional androids...though that is obviously not the case. What follows is a terrific study in human emotion and relationships that is nicely pin-pointed by the set-up of the series.

I'm not explaining it well because the set-up isn't really the important part of the issue. What's more important is how the story is told: there are some wonderfully insightful moments and great character study interactions. There is a steady stream of tension and weirdness that feels fresh and odd and just all around interesting.

The Grim Reaper shows up in the issue also, claiming the Visions are a disgusting perversion of life. He claims they are not real and the Vision is not Simon Williams, and they should all be destroyed. This ties into the main theme.

This is not a superhero book in the least. It's a science-fiction series that fits alongside the 80's indies and 90's Vertigo. So approach with caution. But regardless of whether its your cup of tea, there's no doubt that its incredibly well written.

Okay, this got me. I guess I will pick it up now!

Thanks, Cobie.

I think I'll wait til the library gets the first trade.

Random thoughts:

- Avengers, or whatever the main Avengers title is called, was incredibly boring. And I just can't find a single bit of enthusiasm for any of the characters or the plot within. Eff it.

- Scarlet Witch and Black Knight both have series and both are outright unreadable. Compete failures. Ugh.

- Vision #2 was good. Perhaps not as compelling as the first issue but still interesting, and something I want to know more of. The pacing and writing just seem tighter and more controlled, compared to the mess that is most of Marvel's other series.

Agreed. And FWIW, the full title is All-New All-Different Avengers. Talk about false advertising!



I didn't even try the first issues, because their respective writers, James Robinson and Frank Tieri, are usually deal-breakers for me. But my friend Matt did inform me that Black Knight #2 had a pretty sweet Steve Epting variant cover. I found it on the internet and it is very good, but I never bother buying a floppy just because of the cover, because...I can always find the cover on the internet.

Scarlet Witch #1 by James Robinson, art by Vanessa del Ray, colours Jordie Bellaire: I have no history with the Scarlet Witch, apart from knowing that she was with The Avengers, but picked up this issue for (a)witchcraft story and (b)solo female character.

Wanda's on her own now, living in Manhattan with a ghost companion named Agatha, who believes Wanda killed her. We're told that Wanda is devoted to being a good witch now. Something else else's amiss in the city and with witchcraft; cats are dying and wealthy people are being murdered in apparently random attacks. The Witch goes to a crime scene, exorcises a demon from the investigating detective and realizes that there's a lot more going on than she thought. Which will lead us to the next issue....

It's a good first issue introduction for the character, without going into a backstory. I get from this first issue than Wanda has suffered some crisis and is trying to rebuild her life. She's done some bad things in the past, but is determined to atone for them. She wants to be on her own but is not hostile to The Avengers.

This issue is more set-up for what will follow. However, interest is added to the story with some history of witchcraft and the mysterious Agatha.

The tone of the story is underlined by the colouring: a lot of red, black, white; generally dark and muted.

Happy to have read it, but I think I'll wait for the trade on this one.

Agatha Harkness was this mentor character associated with Wanda for many years. Unfortunately, she was killed off in one of the Avengers storyarcs where Wanda went off the deep end. This is, like, the first time Agath has been in a comic in years.