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Re: Re-Reading the Postboot Legion!
Invisible Brainiac #799522 01/21/14 01:39 PM
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Legion of Super-Heroes 67
"Insect Fear"

Issue information

Summary

The Legion's first official mission comes back to haunt them as they follow up on a lead on Tangleweb. Cosmic Boy makes the tactical decision to split the team, leading to a few ruffled feathers. He brings Leviathan, Andromeda, Apparition, Chameleon, Kinetix and Spark (whom Leviathan calls power players). Brainiac 5, Invisible Kid, Saturn Girl, Triad, Shrinking Violet and XS (whose super-speed Cos says isn't much use on a spaceship), are asked to stay behind.

Can the away team including an emotional, guilt-stricken Leviathan and a xenophobic Andromeda save the day? The Legionnaires encounter Tangleweb pillaging a ship. Spark refuses a direct order to back down and gets captured; Tangleweb also takes Cosmic Boy before being driven away.

Meanwhile, Invisible Kid and Triad react to being left behind in different ways. Invisible Kid borrows a government ship to follow. And for Triad at least, her reaction puts her in danger, as she gets beaten by some White Triangle goons!

Thoughts

Minor quibble, but the story title is probably the worst one so far. It seems more apt for a horror movie than for a Legion comic, though it could also refer to Andromeda's disgust towards the spider-creatures.

The story opens with Tangleweb attacking a ship, and we learn that it actually eats the brains of its prey in order to get knowledge and power. Huh, interesting.

Leviathan is still feeling guilt for Kid Quantum's death, which makes him even more hot-headed and temperamental than usual. He handles the meeting poorly by insulting Saturn Girl, insensitively telling the ones left behind not to take the decision personally when they are obviously feeling inadequate (much like he himself does over James' death!), and deals with his guilty feelings poorly.

Zoe is actually the one who calms him down; she adroitly helps defuse the tension by asking about Tangleweb (notice that she speaks up instead of Laurel or Ayla!). You can also see her smiling happily at him and touching his arm to console him. Maybe she can be the Beauty to his Beast?

Cosmic Boy does a better job, calmly but firmly explaining his tactical reasoning in selecting the team. His reasoning is such that even Lyle and Lu can understand, though not like, his decision. "This isn't about who's better or stronger", he says - though he leaves out telepathic Imra, super-fast Jenni and microscopic Vi; the former CAN telepathically detect Tangleweb (despite what Leviathan says) and the latter two can easily evade his attacks. He brings Tinya, possibly because her powers allow her to keep out of harm's way; why not bring the latter two?

Lyle won't take no for an answer, and even borrows a ship so he can follow the team. Why? He mentions in one panel, "You don't understand, you're going to need me." In another he says, "but they can't do without me." But he doesn't reveal why he thinks that; his invisibility and brains are useful but neither proved to be an invaluable asset against Tangleweb. Does he just really feel so confident in his abilities? As he takes off he says, "it's not like I'm going to survive this anyway." So was all that "you'll need me" just false bravado? Is he going more because he wants to prove to himself that he can stand alongside his more powerful teammates?

"Time to repent your sins, pusbag. You're busted!" Oh Tinya, you go girl.

I also like that ships are now equipped with a device that can track Tangleweb. That shows quite a lot of foresight!

The Legion's fight against Tangleweb is terribly one-sided. Despite there being seven Legionnaires, they're taken apart like amateurs! Ayla gets in too close even though Cos warns her back, and if she hadn't been an established character she could possibly have been killed like James was! Andromeda needs to be told to use her non-contact powers; Zoe's powers can't hold her cage together (!) and Cham and Tinya do absolutely nothing during the fight. Gim also makes himself a bigger target - exactly what Cos told him NOT to do during their first fight against Tangleweb!

We can see that Andromeda is genuinely concerned for her teammates - she calls out Spark's name.

Gim, at least, manages to pull the remaining Legionnaires together in Cos' absence. With a little encouragement from Zoe, he prioritizes AND comes up with the good idea to have Andromeda provide propulsion, plus he knows the first priority is to get Cos and Ayla back safe. He's also sharp enough to notice that Tangleweb is smarter.

The five remaining Legionnaires catch up to Tangleweb on a planet full of spider-like creatures too. Uhoh. Thank goodness they have their flight rings.

Finally, we head back to Earth to see Triad again. Her mixed reactions are interesting to say the least; she argues with her selves as if each is a different person. She's also ashamed to let the rest see what she's like, which explains why she walked out. Once she calms down we see her act rationally. Sadly, her splitting up of her selves gets her in trouble as Neutral is cornered by a bunch of thugs; at three against one the odds are bad to say the least. The issue ends with Orange and Purple feeling Neutral's pain, and Neutral left for dead.

Whew. The writers sure know how to up the stakes. We have the entire away team AND Triad in deathly peril by the end of the issue.

Invisible Kid seems to be the writers' darling here; he's set up to be the big hero (or a sad casualty?) by the next issue. I have to say he's one of my least favorite Legionnaires here. And though Leviathan does show some good leadership, I don't like his poor handling of his emotions either. On the other hand, both boys ARE written very realistically (especially considering their ages - they'd both be around 16 I think).

This is a pretty good issue as the action flows along really well and we still get quite a lot of good character moments. Most of the Legionnaires on the away team (except Chameleon) get to do something, and even many of the ones left behind do too.

We also see that the team is in need of serious work. Though they do work together alright, they're not as tight as they could be - the fight against Tangleweb, and the disastrous meeting, show that they still have a lot to work on.

Chris Renaudi's guest pencils are OK; he gives the Legionnaires very expressive faces which are appropriate for each scene (except for the middle panel on page 20 where Leviathan looks like he's about to faint, and the one on page 21 where he looks constipated).

Last edited by Invisible Brainiac; 08/22/18 03:39 AM.
Re: Re-Reading the Postboot Legion!
Invisible Brainiac #799610 01/21/14 10:41 PM
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Originally Posted by Invisible Brainiac
Legion of Super-Heroes [67]
"Insect Fear"


Summary

The Legion's first official mission comes back to haunt them as they follow up on a lead on Tangleweb. Cosmic Boy makes the tactical decision to split the team, leading to a few ruffled feathers. Can the away team containing an emotional, guilt-stricken Leviathan and a xenophobic Andromeda save the day?

Meanwhile, Invisible Kid and Triad react to being left behind in different ways. And for Triad at least, her reaction puts her in danger!



As with the first Tangleweb outing, I appreciate what was attempted here. And, like the first, this story does not come off as well as it could have.

The opening scene is fine enough, as it re-establishes Tangelweb as a serious threat. Ibby complained about the title, “Insect Fear,” being too horror movie-like; this scene provokes my similar complaint. It would work fine in a horror movie, but, here it seems disturbing and out of place. Never mind, though: It does establish who our villain is and why he must be stopped.

Then comes a scene which reminds us of Gim’s guilt and leads into another scene in which the Legionnaires act like spoiled children. It’s never explained why so many members object to being left behind. Are they out to avenge the death of James—a member they barely knew and whose death, they seem to agree, was his own fault? Are they upset because they will miss out on the action? Not only are their motives unexplained, but their volatile reactions come off as cliched.

There’s also a rather clunky page of exposition in which the new members are told of the Legion’s first encounter with Tangleweb. This page does nothing more than tell the readers what we need to know, something all writers should avoid (“As you know, Wonder Woman, I come from the planet Krypton and was rocketed to earth as an infant . . .”). One would expect new Legionnaires to have boned up on the team’s short history.

We are afforded, at least, a couple of opportunities to see Cos assert his leadership, first with Triad and then with Invisible Kid.

I have mixed feelings about Lyle’s depiction. On one hand, he comes off as cocky and arrogant—which fits in nicely with his portrayal last issue as the Great Benefactor who created the flight rings. On the other hand, mysterious comments such as “You’ll need me” and “It’s not like I’m going to survive” are clunky ways of adding to the drama.

Triad’s depiction is surprising. She literally has a split personality, and her argument with herself gets her into serious danger. I can accept this to a degree—it’s a very unusual depiction of her abilities and gives her a significant weakness. But one would think her experience as Brande’s assistant would lead to more self control. Like the other Legionnaires, she just comes off as spoiled and immature.

Once the mission to find Tangleweb gets underway, the story proceeds along conventional paths. Rokk is taken out of the fight instantly, so Gim gets a chance to redeem himself. Laurel’s attitude gets in the way of stopping Tangleweb, but she can be counted on to do her job when she’s given a clear order, such as hauling the Legion’s crippled ship.

And then we end on not one but two cliffhangers, making up, I suppose, for the lack of cliffhangers in the previous two issues.

Renaud’s art is serviceable—awkward in places, such as Gim’s constipated look (as Ibby notes)—but it does the required job and is not overly distracting.

“Insect Fear” was meant to show the Legionnaires experiencing difficulties adjusting to being a team now that they’ve grown so large it is necessary to split them into smaller groupings. It was also meant to show them going after James’s murderer. It accomplishes both but in a way that seems forced and conventional. This reads more like a so-so SyFy movie than a Legion story.

Grade: 72.6 (C-)


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Re: Re-Reading the Postboot Legion!
He Who Wanders #799631 01/22/14 02:31 AM
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You made a good point that issue 67 is as much about the Legionnaires adjusting to working with new teammates in a large team. I think this was accomplished fairly well with the away team.

I completely agree with you on Lyle's depiction; not only are his comments clunky, but the "it's not like I'm going to survive this" line contradicts his cocky and arrogant characterization. Unless perhaps the writers are trying to portray him as an insecure individual who needs to feed his ego?

As for Triad, her Purple personality will consistently (in the Postboot era) get her other selves into trouble because of her thoughtlessness.

Re: Re-Reading the Postboot Legion!
Invisible Brainiac #799881 01/25/14 01:23 AM
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Legionnaires 24
Me, Myself and I

Issue information

Summary:

The Legionnaires on Earth really to help save Triad, though they may not be able to do so without delving into her past and her experience of having 3 different personalities. it turns out that Triad is extremely unique among Carggites.

They also try to track down the thugs who beat Triad up, and learn that there might be a connection both to the Planet Hell case and the attack on the nightclub the Legionnaire girls tried to visit.

Thoughts:

Right off the bat this issue contradicts the last. The textbox tells us, "When Cosmic Boy took the unprecedented step of excluding the LEAST POWERFUL Legionnaires from a mission...". This despite Cos saying it's NOT about powers or who is best, but about who is needed (though of course, Leviathan himself had already contradicted Cos last issue). Not hard to see why many of the Legionnaires left behind were upset.

These "weaker" Legionnaires are certainly NOT comparatively useless: XS, Violet and Saturn Girl display good teamwork and use each of their powers to track an abandoned hideout of the racist thugs, while Brainiac 5 works to save Triad.

The abandoned hideout is disturbing for 2 reasons: the first, that a level of racism and hate such as that still exists in the 30th century; and two, Violet remembered the thugs Andromeda went after - and didn't bring back - also wore the same symbol: a White Triangle. Oooh. Violet's still too shy to tell her teammates though.

The Carggites won't help and Earth's hospitals don't know much about Carggite physiology. Brainy's experiences tell him that Triad's not like the other Carggites, which may be the key. And we delve into a very sad story...

Triad was born with each of her 3 selves experiencing different emotions, unlike the typical Carggite. An unaccepting Carrgite society persecuted her for it. It was so bad that her father left and her mother committed suicide - but a guardian angel came in the form of her grandmother.

Interestingly, Luornu's mom's name is Iruna Durgo. So she took her mom's surname. I'm guessing that Granny Murlu is her maternal grandmother and that Lu's dad blamed her mom's genes for the differences.

It's ironic that Granny Murlu encouraged Lu's differences but didn't exhibit her own to Lu until she died. I'm not surprised that she didn't; her deathbed comments make it seem like she was forcibly taught to not display her differences. And one of her comments is spot on: "You come on! It's easy to preach, but living on this world with these feelings..." It's hard to be yourself when almost the entire world tells you it's wrong. What's surprising is that she didn't share her own differences with Lu, while encouraging Lu to embrace her own. Perhaps she didn't want to display her individual personalities as it would be hard for her not to dredge up the painful memories of her own past?

Triad's differences - and Purple's reckless side - are displayed again when they make their first attempt at reintegration. Sometimes these differences can be a good thing, sometimes they are bad. It's odd that Granny Murlu says they're good for a Carggite's mental health, but we've seen Lu's 3 personalities give her a lot of trouble!

Reboot, Omni, razsolo and I had a really good discussion about they nature of the differences. Our consensus is that the majority of Carggites are born fully identical; for the minority with differences, the degree of difference can vary per individual with some successfully suppressing any outward display and others not being able to do the same.

Triad manages to escape the mental hospital she was put in, and lucky the ship she tries to break into was owned by one RJ Brande!

Saturn Girl has a moment of doubt on Brande's reaction to Triad's differences, but she tests her suspicions and thankfully they are unfounded.

One bright spot in the barbaric way these hospitals are run? It looks like you're only sent there if you're a ward of the state, or perhaps if your parents send you there voluntarily. Lu was able to stay out of them while she was under her Granny's care.

Cue the 2nd attempt at reintegration. Triad Purple and Orange overcome their differences by merging; their personalities are so far apart that it's the only way. Even with their merger, they hesitate briefly upon seeing Neutral's agony. But it works, Triad is safe, and their differing personalities may actually have contributed to their survival this time.

The story ends with Brande vowing to find the thugs responsible, and Violet worrying about Andromeda's possible complicity.

The story is a good allegory for homosexuality. Being born with it; some people thinking it can be "cured" and suppressed; it's something that you can't always tell about a person just by their exhibited behaviors or appearance. The intent is good and so is the execution - the messages aren't hammered into our heads, but rather they unfold through the touching story of someone we have grown to care about (and the parallels aren't too obvious either - I certainly didn't pick up on it when I first read this issue at about 15 years old).

There are 2 inkers for this issue, Tom Simmons and W.C. Carani. You can tell which inked which page; the Simmons pages seem a bit more rough and the characters' eyes are a bit off. The art is serviceable though and the action is very easy to follow.

This is a good issue and it fulfilled its purpose - it made me care more for a character, it moved the overall plot along, and it left me with a good message.


Last edited by Invisible Brainiac; 06/15/14 01:40 AM.
Re: Re-Reading the Postboot Legion!
Invisible Brainiac #799895 01/25/14 08:54 AM
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Originally Posted by Invisible Brainiac
You made a good point that issue 67 is as much about the Legionnaires adjusting to working with new teammates in a large team. I think this was accomplished fairly well with the away team.



Ironically, the job I have now is with a company that is rapidly expanding, taking on new faculty, and even moving to a new building in another state in a few weeks. This has resulted in a lot of adjustment--people moving around, shifts in who reports to whom, new positions being created. There's an opportunity for chaos here, but, so far, the transitions have been handled smoothly with clear lines of communication to keep everyone informed.

I can imagine that a new organization composed entirely of teenagers would have an entirely different reaction to such rapid change. Many of the long-time members who were used to working together as one team--and particularly those who were present when James died--may have felt slighted at being left behind, as teenagers often do. In some ways, this depiction makes sense. However, it still feels clunky and contrived.

The one thing I liked about that scene is that it shows the headaches leaders often have to deal with, and how sometimes they have to stick to their guns.


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Re: Re-Reading the Postboot Legion!
Invisible Brainiac #799919 01/25/14 03:30 PM
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I'm glad your company is handling its expansion well, HWW.

I think one reason the scene felt clunky is how it played out: it didn't feel like Cos and Gim made their announcement in a good manner. After they announced almost half the team would be left behind, Zoe and the other newbies still didn't know who Tangleweb was, and nobody was clear on his logic! Perhaps they would have taken it better if he had started with a background of their first case and pointed out the challenges (i.e. having ten Legionnaires face off against Tangleweb in a crowded spaceship).

Re: Re-Reading the Postboot Legion!
Invisible Brainiac #800042 01/25/14 09:00 PM
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^Good point, Ibby.

Cos is still very young and feeling his way into the leadership role. He probably didn't handle it very well. And Gim needs lessons in tact.


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Re: Re-Reading the Postboot Legion!
Invisible Brainiac #800046 01/25/14 10:20 PM
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Originally Posted by Invisible Brainiac
[b]Legionnaires 24

Interestingly, Luornu's mom's name is Iruna Durgo. So she took her mom's surname. I'm guessing that Granny Murlu is her maternal grandmother and that Lu's dad blamed her mom's genes for the differences.


Iruna could have kept her husband's name after he left.

Of course, this presupposes that Carggite women change their names when they get married. Perhaps that is only an earth custom.

As for Iruna committing suicide, the story only tells us that she couldn't stop being mad at herself. Perhaps she died from an accident or an alcohol-related disease (cirrhosis, perhaps).

Quote

The story is a good allegory for homosexuality. Being born with it; some people thinking it can be "cured" and suppressed; it's something that you can't always tell about a person just by their exhibited behaviors or appearance. The intent is good and so is the execution - the messages aren't hammered into our heads, but rather they unfold through the touching story of someone we have grown to care about (and the parallels aren't too obvious either - I certainly didn't pick up on it when I first read this issue at about 15 years old).


I hadn't thought of this story as an allegory for homosexuality, but it works as such. I assumed it was about any "difference" that is considered culturally unacceptable (which, of course, could include homosexuality). The story works for this reason: It's one of the most "science fiction-like" stories yet--extrapolating from a real world setting into a fantastic, alien culture and showing the ramifications that could happen if fear and hatred win.



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Re: Re-Reading the Postboot Legion!
He Who Wanders #800054 01/26/14 01:11 AM
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Good point in that it could stand for other "differences" besides homosexuality. I did think of it because homosexuality (unlike race or some diseases) is not apparent from physical appearance (not always), plus it is one of the "differences" that some believe could be cured by medication or therapy.



Originally Posted by He Who Wanders
Originally Posted by Invisible Brainiac
[b]Legionnaires 24

Interestingly, Luornu's mom's name is Iruna Durgo. So she took her mom's surname. I'm guessing that Granny Murlu is her maternal grandmother and that Lu's dad blamed her mom's genes for the differences.


Iruna could have kept her husband's name after he left.

Of course, this presupposes that Carggite women change their names when they get married. Perhaps that is only an earth custom.

As for Iruna committing suicide, the story only tells us that she couldn't stop being mad at herself. Perhaps she died from an accident or an alcohol-related disease (cirrhosis, perhaps).




Again, good point. Cargg could also be a matriarchal society, we don't know enough about it.

The line about Iruna hurting herself is what made me think of suicide, but you are right in that the actual cause of death could have been something else.

Re: Re-Reading the Postboot Legion!
Invisible Brainiac #800089 01/26/14 01:22 PM
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Originally Posted by Invisible Brainiac
Legionnaires 24
Me, Myself and I


Summary:

The Legionnaires on Earth really to help save Triad, though they may not be able to do so without delving into her past and her experience of having 3 different personalities. it turns out that Triad is extremely unique among Carggites.

They also try to track down the thugs who beat Triad up, and learn that there might be a connection both to the Planet Hell case and the attack on the nightclub the Legionnaire girls tried to visit.



This issue features one of the most disturbing Legion covers I’ve seen: Triad, bloody and breaten, lies on the ground, a white triangle painted over her body, as three male attackers with blood splattered hands stand over her. This image leads to all sorts of interpretations. Was she raped? Is this a “bondage” cover (without the bonds)?

Obviously, she wasn’t raped in the story—at least not that we were shown. But, given how similar assaults play out in real life, it would be hard to believe her assailants didn't try to go that route.

And that touches on the inherent contradictions of the postboot Legion. The all-ages art, youthful protagonists, and uncomplicated stories suggest DC was aiming the reboot at a very young audience. Yet the series pulls no punches in dealing with mature themes such as racism. There’s an almost fairy tale-like quality to this issue, particular in Lu’s back story. I don’t mean fairy tale in the Disney sense, but in the Brothers Grimm sense—early fairy tales featured eyes getting pecked out by birds and toes being cut off to fit into glass slippers. Fairy tales were originally meant to help young listeners cope with what they already knew—that the world is not a nice place and bad things happen even to children.

Whether or not this Brothers Grimm-like approach suits the Legion is debatable, but this issue, in some ways, marks the end of the reboot’s innocence. Megapowerful villains such as Mordru and Validus have nothing on the three non-powered xenophobes who inflict such damage on our beloved Lu. Not only have they assaulted a Legionnaire, they’ve assaulted the very foundations upon with the Legion was built—the idea that young people could make a difference in the future. The world is indeed not a nice place, not even in the 30th century.

That caveat aside, the story is expertly delivered. The writers made two critical choices. First, they focused entirely on the Legionnaires left on earth—there’s no Tangleweb subplot—and second, they did not include the capture of the three assailants, who, momentarily at least, get away. These choices kept our attention squarely on Lu’s origin and survival. Interestingly, the only Legionnaires featured in this story, apart from Brainiac 5 (who fulfills the needs of the plot), are female: Saturn Girl, XS, Shrinking Violet, and, of course, Triad.

Triad’s back story is the stuff of fairy tales gone Disney. Misunderstood, alienated, branded a freak, and ultimately orphaned, she is left to fend for herself until her Fairy Godfather, in the person of R.J. Brande, comes to rescue her. If I have any complaint about the story, it’s that the writers lay all of this on too thick. Poor Lu is Cinderella times three. Even the moment of doubt regarding Brande’s reaction when he learns that Lu is an “escaped mental patient” seems syrupy. Brande is a man without faults, apparently.

Young readers can, I’m sure, identify with Lu’s struggles in this story—both her struggle to be accepted for who she is and her struggle within herself to trust her teammates and do what must be done. The ending is classic: Against Brainy’s advice, the two remaining Triads merge because they recognize this is the only way they will have the courage to reintegrate with their injured third self. There is strength in numbers and it’s good to have someone to lean on, even if that someone is yourself.

Grade: 97.3 (A)


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Re: Re-Reading the Postboot Legion!
He Who Wanders #800169 01/27/14 03:44 AM
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Originally Posted by He Who Wanders
Originally Posted by Invisible Brainiac
Legionnaires 24
Me, Myself and I


Obviously, she wasn’t raped in the story—at least not that we were shown. But, given how similar assaults play out in real life, it would be hard to believe her assailants didn't try to go that route.



Given that her attackers are rabid racists, whom I assume are like the others in feeling completely disgusted by other races, I doubt they would have raped Triad. Just the thought of getting that close would have disgusted them. And thankfully those portions of her costume remained untouched (as far as we can see anyway).

Originally Posted by He Who Wanders

Whether or not this Brothers Grimm-like approach suits the Legion is debatable, but this issue, in some ways, marks the end of the reboot’s innocence. Megapowerful villains such as Mordru and Validus have nothing on the three non-powered xenophobes who inflict such damage on our beloved Lu. Not only have they assaulted a Legionnaire, they’ve assaulted the very foundations upon with the Legion was built—the idea that young people could make a difference in the future. The world is indeed not a nice place, not even in the 30th century.

If I have any complaint about the story, it’s that the writers lay all of this on too thick. Poor Lu is Cinderella times three.


You bring up a good point - the issue deals not only with oppression back on Cargg, but also with the virulent racism on by the xenophobes on Earth. And poor Triad was a victim of both. At the same time, she also gets very lucky twice - being "rescued" by her Granny, and finding RJ Brande (which paves the way for her becoming a Legionnaire).

Last edited by Invisible Brainiac; 01/28/14 03:53 AM.
Re: Re-Reading the Postboot Legion!
Invisible Brainiac #800180 01/27/14 10:48 AM
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Originally Posted by Invisible Brainiac
Originally Posted by He Who Wanders
Originally Posted by Invisible Brainiac
Legionnaires 24
Me, Myself and I


Obviously, she wasn’t raped in the story—at least not that we were shown. But, given how similar assaults play out in real life, it would be hard to believe her assailants didn't try to go that route.



Given that her attackers are rabid racists, whom I assume are like the others in feeling completely disgusted by other races, I doubt they would have raped Triad. Just the thought of getting that intimate would have disgusted them. And thankfully those portions of her costume remained untouched (as far as we can see anyway).


By "intimate" I know you mean "proximity" and not what it sounded like so before anyone jumps on you for using that particular word, I thought I'd mention it could be easily misinterpreted.

I think I disagree with your conclusion. Their prejudice and hate would be all the more reason to demean, dominate and violate. It was a very real (in a fiction sense) possibility.

Re: Re-Reading the Postboot Legion!
Blockade Boy #800261 01/27/14 07:57 PM
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Originally Posted by Blockade Boy

Their prejudice and hate would be all the more reason to demean, dominate and violate. It was a very real (in a fiction sense) possibility.


Indeed. The movie "A Time to Kill" provides a vivid and horrifying depiction of this.


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Re: Re-Reading the Postboot Legion!
Blockade Boy #800284 01/28/14 03:53 AM
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I don't know, I'm trying to think whether the manifestations of their xenophobia in the Postboot would have let them. In Legionnaires 27 several inter-race couples are killed just because they are couples; the White Trianglists who killed them expressed disgust at the thought of people of two races touching each other. If they had indeed thought of violating Triad like that I still doubt they would have touched her in that way, lest they be "contaminated". I can see them using implements though.

Originally Posted by Blockade Boy

By "intimate" I know you mean "proximity" and not what it sounded like so before anyone jumps on you for using that particular word, I thought I'd mention it could be easily misinterpreted.



Thank you for the correction on word usage, BB.

Re: Re-Reading the Postboot Legion!
Invisible Brainiac #800519 01/31/14 12:18 PM
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Legion of Super-Heroes 68
"Sticky Situation"

Issue information

Summary:

The away team gets captured by members of Tangleweb's species, and learns that they're not hostile. Chameleon is able to communicate with the spider-creatures, and uses his shapeshifting to tell the other Legionnaires their story. Tangleweb is a terrorist on their world, and became intelligent by eating brains.

Invisible Kid catches up to the Legion and (in a major part due to luck) manages to save Cosmic Boy and Spark. Andromeda (with some tough love from Leviathan) overcomes her xenophobia enough to find a way to save the day.

Thoughts:

The issue satisfactorily resolves an "open" story arc that began way back in LSH 62, and gives many of our Legionnaires some good development.

The away team of Leviathan, Kinetix, Apparition, Andromeda and Chameleon are outnumbered 5 to 1 by members of Tangleweb's species. The odds are so staggering that Leviathan appears stunned at first; it's Apparition who asks Andromeda for a quick scan of the situation. Leviathan decides to take the offensive, which is pretty disastrous; Andromeda is the only one who has a chance to win. Despite using only her long-range heat vision, a Spider-person tears her transuit and she collapses. The other four Legionnaires get taken down quickly.

The team's definitely still getting used to working together. Kinetix gets a face full of gunk when Apparition phases right in front of her; and I don't see any of them use their flight rings to give themselves an advantage.

Back on Earth, Triad is conscious but weak. Imra scans her memories and is horrified by what she sees. She also still disapproves of Cos' decision to split the team, though frankly Triad would still have been in danger if she'd gone after Tangleweb too. I give Imra a pass here though, as Triad's beating was definitely traumatic to "see".

Leviathan's team is still alive. Andromeda realizes she merely overreacted; we realize that her attitude isn't just derision and contempt for "inferior" races but also fear and disgust for the stranger ones - particularly non-humanoids. (Now I wish she and Gates had been on the team at the same time; Gates' retorts would have been hilarious). You can't really blame her for her fear, as she'd never left Daxam before being drafted. Likely she was raised that way.

The Legionnaires use their brains, with most of them staying behind in safety while sending a phased Tinya finds Cham.

Next we enter Invisible Kid, displaying little of the cockiness and arrogance he did in previous issues. He mentally admits that he's terrified, he falls into a trap, and he has to constantly reassure himself. It makes me wonder more than ever why exactly he followed the team? Was it to prove something to them - or to himself? Seems to be more of the latter, frankly. I get that the writers wanted him there because he was the only one (besides Imra) who could translate Cham's speech, but getting him there was clumsy. And so was the addition of a captive Science Police officer who did absolutely nothing except provide a blaster for Lyle to use. Convenient, and nothing more.

"Shame Imra or Lyle aren't around to translate... but I guess they're too weak to come along on this mission huh?" Good girl, Tinya. At the same time, a sign that even the "power player" Legionnaires - as Gim put it - don't approve of dividing the team like that. Cham brilliantly uses his shapeshifting to communicate to the others, and Zoe, Tinya and Gim not only do a good job interpreting it but also defend him when Andromeda raises her doubts. Good show.

Cos and Ayla do a good job combining their powers to take out Tangleweb. Cham's strong friendship with Lyle is demonstrated with their reunion, and we learn another crucial piece of info - not only does Tangleweb use technology to become stronger, he uses brains to become SMARTER. Leviathan's observation on Tangleweb's intellect was spot on. The reunited team faces a trio of Tanglewebs.

Gim helps convince Andromeda to work past her fears and end the battle quickly. It's a practical move, though I think the writers overplayed the drama; even with Andromeda reduced to a cowering xenophobic mass you still have 7 Legionnaires and a Sci-Cop against 3 Tanglewebs - far better odds than the opening battle.

Scene ends with Cos reminding Lyle that he's leader, but not punishing him because he did save them. I approve; it's clear that Lyle wasn't following because he had vital information or anything like that. Cos also takes time to praise and encourage Gim, who also thanks Laurel. It's a satisfying ending, and as Cos points out there aren't any new stars tonight. All's well, for now.

Next up? Well, we also get a curious scene on Durla, where what appears to be a living fluid creature escapes confinement and attacks some Durlans. Uh oh.

Some thoughts on the individual Legionnaires:

Leviathan starts to mature. He's a lot less cranky this issue, and he actually deals with Andromeda quite well. It's still tough love, but he doesn't demean or bully her but appeals to reason to get her to fight. It's a very positive and welcome change.

Andromeda also comes through by working around her xenophobia to intelligently fly the Tanglewebs into the atmosphere. I'm glad the writers stopped at that; it was realistic and shows Andromeda has the makings of a smart and effective Legionnaire.

Cosmic Boy continues to grow into his leader role fairly well, asserting his authority naturally. The only poor bit was him yelling at Lyle for following them while Tangleweb was approaching, but the way he admonished Lyle while still not punishing him was good.

Lyle himself is a walking contradiction. He's outwardly cocky, but look at his face when Cos talks to him in the last page. He's clearly worried. He's definitely covering up for - for what, really? We only know he's scared this issue but it doesn't tell us much new about him except his cockiness is a facade for... approval seeking maybe?

Chameleon does a good job here, as his intelligence and craftiness shine through. It's good to know that despite his inability to speak Interlac he's just as capable as any other Legionnaire. The scene with him shaking hands with the Spider-people is good; maybe he could be an ambassador.

Spark, Apparition and Kinetix don't get to do too much, but each has her moments. Tinya and Zoe especially make a good pair standing up to Andromeda. I think these two would make good friends and would love to see them in battle together. Spark doesn't shine at all, and it would have been good for either Cos or Gim to admonish her for staying too close to Tangleweb last issue - that's what led to her capture, after all.

This is a solid issue and gives good development to Leviathan, Andromeda and Chameleon. Best of all, it all feels organic rather than forced.

Last edited by Invisible Brainiac; 08/22/18 03:36 AM.
Re: Re-Reading the Postboot Legion!
Invisible Brainiac #800593 02/01/14 10:44 AM
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Originally Posted by Invisible Brainiac
Legion of Super-Heroes 68
"Sticky Situation"


Summary:

The away team gets captured by members of Tangleweb's species, and learns that they're not hostile. Invisible Kid catches up to the Legion and (in a major part due to luck) manages to save Cosmic Boy and Spark. Andromeda (with some tough love from Leviathan) overcomes her xenophobia enough to find a way to save the day.



Ibby did such a thorough job of reviewing this issue, I have little else to add. One of the strengths of the story, though, is that it seems both old and fresh at the same time. Some of the themes and actions are very familiar: the creepy aliens who aren't so bad, Laurel as the strongest member who is also a coward, Gim as the guy who's struggling to be a leader. Yet all of this feels natural and authentic, even truthful. I do think Gim comes off as too much of a stereotype. He attacks the spiders, calls Laurel a coward and continues to berate himself for not being a leader. All of this rings truthful, but it's one-dimensional.

in other places, the story succeeds by keeping the focus on the Legionnaires and their interactions. Zoey and Tinya's look of disgust at Laurel at the bottom of Page 17 is priceless (even as rendered by Lee Moder), and Lyle's panic when confronted by Tangleweb seems real. It rounds out his personality: he's bold and cocky, but still a sneaky kid who doesn't want to get "caught." Even Imra blaming Cos for what happened to Lu seems real. She's dealing with her own emotions of being left behind and inability to find the attackers, so she blames the person she can blame. Very human.

(This scene also depicts an ingenious use of her powers--getting inside a victim's mind to see what happened from her perspective. If only modern courts had that ability.)

The plot and the aliens are serviceable, nothing more and nothing less. Ibby pointed out the two main flaws: that Lyle is there only to translate for Cham, and the police officer is there only so Lyle can use his weapon. I'm not bothered by Spark's "lack of development," though. Not every character needs a chance to shine; some can be subordinate to the needs of the plot for awhile.

LSH 68 is indeed a satisfying end to the Tangleweb story, with both Laurel and Gim growing as characters, and the villain who killed James being apprehended without much fanfare. The conclusion hits the right emotional balance.

(Cos's last lines seem oddly prophetic in hindsight, though: "You can rest a little easier, Gim. You and James both.")

Grade: 87.6 (B)


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Re: Re-Reading the Postboot Legion!
Invisible Brainiac #800708 02/01/14 10:57 PM
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My only issue with nothing being done about Spark is that she was captured for almost the same reason James was killed - she disobeyed orders and stayed too close to Tangleweb. That was reckless and could have gotten her killed. I do like to think that Cos took time to call her out on it offscreen. I think that would be a responsible thing to do.

Gim in some ways is the opposite of Lyle. Gim is an open book; he doesn't really hide his insecurities about being a leader. Lyle keeps it hidden and everybody thinks he's fully confident in himself. I agree with you that both characters (plus Imra) are very human.

More on Imra next issue wink


Re: Re-Reading the Postboot Legion!
Invisible Brainiac #800780 02/02/14 02:28 PM
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Originally Posted by Invisible Brainiac

Gim in some ways is the opposite of Lyle. Gim is an open book; he doesn't really hide his insecurities about being a leader. Lyle keeps it hidden and everybody thinks he's fully confident in himself.



Interesting observation. I hadn't thought of them that way before.


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Re: Re-Reading the Postboot Legion!
Invisible Brainiac #800781 02/02/14 02:50 PM
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Originally Posted by Invisible Brainiac
My only issue with nothing being done about Spark is that she was captured for almost the same reason James was killed - she disobeyed orders and stayed too close to Tangleweb. That was reckless and could have gotten her killed. I do like to think that Cos took time to call her out on it offscreen. I think that would be a responsible thing to do.



I re-read the scene, and I agree with you. Ayla's recklessness here and in No. 64 isn't given any justification, other than the fact that she's Garth's sister and "machismo" seems to run in the family, as Imra observed in 64. But that's a rather lame excuse. Had Ayla been one of those present when James died, I could see her wanting to fry Tangelweb's ass (if spiders have asses), but there's no real set up for her actions here.

In the end, her insubordination didn't matter much since Cos, who was a pretty good distance away from Tangleweb, got slimed first. If Cos upbraids her off-panel, she would be justified, I think, in pointing that out to him. She was not justified in disobeying a direct order, though.

The more I think about Lyle's role in this story, the more it irks me. He made a big to-do out of coming on the mission and even disobeyed a direct order himself, as if he had some secret knowledge about Tangleweb that would make a difference. Yet he contributes nothing to the story that couldn't have been accomplished by any of the other Legionnaires--except that he translates for Cham. If anything, this makes Cos look bad. Why would he take along a teammate who can't speak Interlac? And why didn't Lyle point this out to Cos in 66 without being all cryptic?


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Re: Re-Reading the Postboot Legion!
Invisible Brainiac #800802 02/02/14 08:31 PM
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Legionnnaires 25

“Skin Deep”


Summary: After Saturn Girl sees the inner workings of a Durlan mind, the Legion gets attacked by a Durlan who imitates all of their powers and has a vendetta against Chameleon.

Review:

It must have been easy to come up with certain story ideas for the reboot Legion. All the writers really had to do was delve into back issues of the preboot for plots and villains and then “update” them for a ‘90s crowd. In this case, they update the Composite Superman, a villain who appeared in World’s Finest and who possessed the powers of the Legionnaires which he gained while working in the Superman Museum, when lightning struck the miniature statues once used to summon Superboy.

In this case, the “Composite Legionnaire” (though he’s not referred to by that name in this story) is a Durlan who has been genetically bred for war by assimilating the powers as well as the appearance of anyone with whom he is in close proximity. The makes him a truly formidable Legion foe as he is able to keep the entire team on its toes, shifting easily from Spark’s electricity to Cos’s magnetism, from Apparition’s phasing to Violet’s shrinking, and then to Brainy’s intellect—the latter ability making him realize that he can take on all the Legionnaires' powers and some of their appearances at once!

Even though very little new ground is covered here, either in terms of the villain or the storyline, what is delivered is expertly done. The story hints at a motivation behind the new Durlan villain, whose warrior caste apparently was at odds with the religious caste (shades of Babylon 5!), to which Cham belongs. So, the villain’s motivation is simple revenge, but it works. He also trumps Cham in being able to assimilate Interlac far faster than the Legionnaire has been shown to do.

The plot flows seamlessly from Saturn Girl’s voyage to the bottom of Reep’s mind to Gim’s visit to the Science Police, where he trades barbs with Shvaughn Erin before being attacked by the Durlan. Watching this on the viewscreen, Cos assembles the entire Legion to deal with the threat—a big mistake, as it turns out, since so many Legionnaires give the Durlan more powers to assimilate. The battle scenes which follow are well choreographed for the most part, though some Legionnaires are simply not shown after the group shots on Page 16, leading me to forget that Brainy and Tinya were even present.

The story feels disjointed, though, particularly in the early parts. The writers try to heighten the drama by creating Marvel-style tension in the ranks, but their efforts are not wholly successful. Saturn Girl muses that “it’s all going wrong,” but this comes across as an overly dramatic interpretation of the past few issues. Imra also feels bad for throwing herself at Cos—a comment which made me think I’d missed an issue until I realized she was referring to their innocent near-kiss a few issues ago.

It’s nice to see a focus on Saturn Girl, but not when she comes off as a drama queen.

Likewise, Imra’s attempt to communicate with Cham’s mind goes on too long and pads the story—which leaves us with an ending that feels like very little has been accomplished. Unlike in previous issues where the plot development has been so tight that the cliffhangers seem natural, this one is too abrupt. It reads like a lot of the old-style Marvel comics of the ‘60s and ‘70s in which very little actually happened in the story.

Legionnaires 25 provides us with a successful update of an old character in a partially successful story that I almost want to grade as “Incomplete.”

Grade: 79.2 (C+)





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Re: Re-Reading the Postboot Legion!
He Who Wanders #800812 02/03/14 12:20 AM
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Originally Posted by He Who Wanders
Originally Posted by Invisible Brainiac
My only issue with nothing being done about Spark is that she was captured for almost the same reason James was killed - she disobeyed orders and stayed too close to Tangleweb. That was reckless and could have gotten her killed. I do like to think that Cos took time to call her out on it offscreen. I think that would be a responsible thing to do.



I re-read the scene, and I agree with you. Ayla's recklessness here and in No. 64 isn't given any justification, other than the fact that she's Garth's sister and "machismo" seems to run in the family, as Imra observed in 64. But that's a rather lame excuse. Had Ayla been one of those present when James died, I could see her wanting to fry Tangelweb's ass (if spiders have asses), but there's no real set up for her actions here.

In the end, her insubordination didn't matter much since Cos, who was a pretty good distance away from Tangleweb, got slimed first. If Cos upbraids her off-panel, she would be justified, I think, in pointing that out to him. She was not justified in disobeying a direct order, though.

The more I think about Lyle's role in this story, the more it irks me. He made a big to-do out of coming on the mission and even disobeyed a direct order himself, as if he had some secret knowledge about Tangleweb that would make a difference. Yet he contributes nothing to the story that couldn't have been accomplished by any of the other Legionnaires--except that he translates for Cham. If anything, this makes Cos look bad. Why would he take along a teammate who can't speak Interlac? And why didn't Lyle point this out to Cos in 66 without being all cryptic?


You make good points here which I agree with. Lyle could have saved himself a lot of trouble just by raising the "Chameleon can't speak Interlac" issue. Same for Ayla's disobeying a direct order; one could argue that she wouldn't have been slimed by Tangleweb if she had kept her distance and that it was just luck she wasn't killed like James was. I think it ties into your observations on issue 67 that many Legionnaires acted like spoiled brats.

It's so easy to forget that they really are just teens because they are being given a lot of responsibility. It's realistic for them to act like brats from time to time. At the same time it's scary that we don't see any adults advising them or giving guidance.

It's also strange that the UP standard age of majority for most UP worlds (as was revealed in LSH 64) is 14. That's a pretty low age, especially compared to the present "real world". We don't see any justifications for why such a low age was chosen. Chu's line in Legionnaires 19 is telling - "But to give police powers to civilians - TEENAGERS, even!" I'm almost surprised that Chu or Winema Wazzo hasn't already pushed for a full-time adult supervisor for the team; though I can see why - from a storytelling standpoint it's an unnecessary complication that would make the writers' jobs a lot harder.

Re: Re-Reading the Postboot Legion!
He Who Wanders #800834 02/03/14 09:14 AM
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Thanks for a thorough review of Legionnaires 25, HWW! Issue information

Originally Posted by He Who Wanders
Legionnaires 25

“Skin Deep”


Summary: After Saturn Girl sees the inner workings of a Durlan mind, the Legion gets attacked by a Durlan who imitates all of their powers and has a vendetta against Chameleon.

The story feels disjointed, though, particularly in the early parts. The writers try to heighten the drama by creating Marvel-style tension in the ranks, but their efforts are not wholly successful. Saturn Girl muses that “it’s all going wrong,” but this comes across as an overly dramatic interpretation of the past few issues. Imra also feels bad for throwing herself at Cos—a comment which made me think I’d missed an issue until I realized she was referring to their innocent near-kiss a few issues ago.



Imra IS a big drama queen here. I wonder, was she so shaken up by going into Cham's mind? Though she also says, "half the team feels useless" - if it had been a reference to Cos splitting the team for the Tangleweb mission, the writers should have made it clear. Or was she so upset at being left behind that she is projecting her feelings of uselessness onto the others? Or are the writers trying to show us the dangers and drawbacks of being a telepath - Imra's open mind is making her feel the negative feelings of the rest of the team?

I think one reason the story appeared so disjointed was the large number of subplots either introduced or developed. In short order, we have a new secret admirer for Spark; Apparition feeling heartbroken over Ultra Boy despite him not even being mentioned for FOUR issues; and Violet approaching (She's so shy I almost hesitate to say confronting!) Andromeda about the thugs. The Spark and Violet subplots are handled well but the Apparition/Ultra Boy one seems abrupt (much like her sudden argument with her mother in LSH 64!).

After rereading, I find the Leviathan-Shvaughn argument an okay scene. Yes, both of them are being a little bit petty, but it's a reflection of the Science Police's attitude towards the Legion and it didn't get out of hand. Odd that Cos and Shvaughn saw through Composite Durlan's first Sci-Cop disguise, but only Cham saw through the second one - I guess Comp Durlan learned from his first mistake.

I agree that the battle scenes were done pretty well (though Comp Durlan loses points from me for not seeing the utility of Zoe's powers! shame!). I love how the Legion ladies are shown in action - Zoe, Vi, Ayla, and even Andromeda's warning to Cos. I give silent thanks that Triad wasn't present - imagine fighting THREE Composite Durlans! Seems like the writers anticipated that and planned accordingly.

Also interesting that Cham knows what "the bodies" in his mind were. Does he consciously analyze these templates? He might, because he instantly knew what Imra (through interpreter Lyle) was describing.

Last edited by Invisible Brainiac; 06/15/14 01:41 AM.
Re: Re-Reading the Postboot Legion!
Invisible Brainiac #800835 02/03/14 09:51 AM
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Legion of Super-heroes 69
Absolute Power

Issue information

Summary:

The battle against the Composite Durlan (C.D.) continues. He reveals that Cham's from the royal lineage of spiritual leaders; and that they kept C.D. and two others like him imprisoned despite them being genetically engineered to be able to copy powers.

The Legion tries, and fails, to use Cham's knowledge to stop the C.D., necessitating Saturn Girl's telepathic intervention. She manages to render him catatonic - at the cost of her own mind.

Thoughts:

The battle continues to flow naturally, and nearly everyone gets something to do. I'm particularly pleased with the good use of XS and Kinetix.

Zoe's caring and "big sisterly" nature is further highlighted here, and it fits in well with her encouragement of Vi and Gim in past issues. She's the one who tells Cham to keep his head in the game, and she's the one you see trying to reach out and stop Imra from entering C.D's mind. Zoe's power levels are also impressive - she (and Cos) were able to stall the C.D. long enough for some important background. Said exposition was also delivered in a way that fit the flow of the story.

XS has grown as well; you can see she's scared, but she barely hesitates to place herself in almost certain danger to save Cham and innocent bystanders, and to buy her teammates time. I love the panel of her telling herself NOT to think so she won't spoil the plan. I also like how the writers referenced her crush on Cos without making it feel out of place. Hey, she thought she was going to die!

It was also nice seeing Brainy and Lyle working together to mix up the chemicals to stop the C.D. Love the contrast between Lyle's greater tactical ability and Brainy's greater analytic ability. Lyle's mistake in translation was believable, and kept the momentum of the fight going. Because of it, I almost didn't notice how abrupt Imra's sudden burst of courage was. We go from her adamantly refusing to enter C.D.'s mind - and lashing out at Cosmic Boy to cover up her own fear - to jumping right in and shutting C.D. down despite the obvious fear and danger it is putting her in. That last page of a catatonic Imra is made all the more powerful because of her heroism.

Let's not forget how heroic Chameleon is as well. He staves off the grief over his father's death to focus on shutting down C.D. He also bravely puts himself in danger and helps keep bystanders out of it.

Cosmic Boy does a good job leading the team this issue. It's good to see him take to leadership so well.

Now let's go to C.D.s motivation. It shows that the 30th century isn't quite as shiny and bright as we thought; much like with the oppression of Carggites with differences, the C.D.s are punished simply for being. They had absolutely no control over their creation. His hatred is understandable (though I wonder why he didn't free the two other C.D.s? but from a storytelling standpoint that would have been undesirable as well - no way the Legion could have dealt with three C.D.s at once).

The art has improved; Lee Moder and Ron Boyd make a good combination. The Legionnaires are a lot less angular and it's easy to follow the action.

All in all, this is a good issue. The action is solid and flows naturally; good character bits are mixed in throughout without slowing the story's pacing; and nothing is shoehorned in. This is much, much better than the first part of the story.

Last edited by Invisible Brainiac; 06/15/14 01:42 AM.
Re: Re-Reading the Postboot Legion!
Invisible Brainiac #800877 02/03/14 09:31 PM
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Originally Posted by Invisible Brainiac


I think one reason the story appeared so disjointed was the large number of subplots either introduced or developed. In short order, we have a new secret admirer for Spark; Apparition feeling heartbroken over Ultra Boy despite him not even being mentioned for FOUR issues; and Violet approaching (She's so shy I almost hesitate to say confronting!) Andromeda about the thugs. The Spark and Violet subplots are handled well but the Apparition/Ultra Boy one seems abrupt (much like her sudden argument with her mother in LSH 64!).



Good point about the subplots, which I forgot to touch on my review. Not only are there too many subplots, but none of them seem to work very well. Ayla's secret admirer comes out of left field. While it's one of those developments one might expect in a comic aimed at kids, it comes across as sudden and pointless. Tinya's infatuation with Jo, which, as you mentioned, hasn't been touched on in awhile, is also poorly handled. Suddenly, he's sending her gifts and she's ready to write off boys altogether. It really does feel like we've missed an issue.

Vi is a character of contradictions at this point. We're told she's shy, but we have very little evidence of this, other than that her speech is presented in a smaller font, indicating, I suppose, that she speaks quietly. But she barges into the xenophobes' lair two issues ago and confronts (yes, I would use that word) Andromeda in this issue. The latter choice is hard to understand--why not bring her concerns to Cos instead of to Laurel, whom she barely knows and has little reason to trust?

Predictably, the confrontation goes badly, but it does afford the readers a chance to see that Laurel is hurt by those words and perhaps feels guilty.

As for Vi, we simply don't know enough about her to know why she does what she does.


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Re: Re-Reading the Postboot Legion!
Invisible Brainiac #800881 02/04/14 01:58 AM
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Good point on Laurel's reaction! I think it ties into her portrayal in recent issues - yes she is xenophobic and racist, but she doesn't hate them, at least not enough to violate their basic right of safety. She does care about doing a good job as a Legionnaire.

As for Vi, you are right. Does she go to Andromeda because she wants to reach out and befriend her? Or simply because she wants to give Andromeda a chance to air her side out first? I do think her characterization is consistent with her LSH 66 and Legionnaires 23 depictions: she had a lot of fire and competence in combat, but has trouble interacting with others socially.




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