Legion World Forums LEGION COMPANION Dr. Gym'll's Cultural Rarities Re-Reads (Now Reading: Swamp Thing: 1971 through 1985)

The second All-Star Squadron 3-parter in a row, running in issues #10 through #12, is not as good as the preceding Steel showcase story-arc, but it's not bad at all. I'd even venture to muse that it would have been great as a 2-parter.

What I speculate is that, because it is a showcase for Hawkman, Roy Thomas's favorite costumed hero of all time, it suffers from the writer's overindulgence -- the hero's elaborate origin, along with the origin of the first villain he ever fought, and a lot of other expository odds and ends, means that one of Roy's greatest weaknesses is compounded here. The heavy exposition slows down the pace considerably, testing the patience of this particular reader, and, I suspect, many others as well.

Artistically, though, it's a treat -- Gonzales & Ordway are both really hitting their stride, and Kubert *really* seems to have gone all-out on the covers, especially issue 12, foregrounding a magnificent full-height rendering of an angry, defiant Hawkman.

Fun Fact: Kubert is, as far as I know, the only artist to have done substantial work on both the Golden Age Hawkman (when he was only about 18 years old) and the Silver Age Hawkman!

I can imagine Roy and Gerry's joy at seamlessly weaving Commander Steel into the Squadron. I don't mind him as a character, and liked Steel and that arc in the JLD. As Ann mentioned, Blitzkrieg and Kung come along to beef up the villains of the time. But having skimmed these issues, he's just too close to Robotman in a book with a very large cast already. There's a scene where Steel loses the woman he loves, declaring himself dead. It's immediately followed by Robotman putting on a rubber mask, which has his new ID, as part of a ruse to show people who once loved him that he'd died. Even their character arcs are as similar as their powers. There's a throwaway where Steel also positions himself at the start of the Golden Age, and it works about as well as Triumph did years later in the JLA. But mainly, like Ann, I'm very wary of the use of death camps, as part of a character's back story. They don't get much of a mention outside his origin story which isn't a good sign. It's an origin story where he gets hit on the head an awful lot so he can get through all his plot hoops, without success - failed Hitler kidnap, death camp & escape, attacking Hitler. I'm a lot less convinced on that one than I would have been reading it as a kid (even in a book that I have to reread with any sense of political analysis surgically removed from my head).

Something else I enjoy more with a reskim, are the nods to classic sci fi movies used for the Hastor arc. I'd not have seen all of them back then. I'm stunned that there's not a Roy story about how the flying saucer didn't end up on our Earth-Prime as the source for all the Area-51/ UFO flaps here. The end of the issue leaves a war winning, and completely intact bit of kit lying around for the Americans to use. Since I mentioned Mr Moore last time, compare Veidt's plan in Watchmen with the plot here.

It takes an issue or two to get used to the amount of text Thomas uses, to keep us up to speed on every event and all of the continuity nods he gives. No stone shall be left unturned, or left without a detailed origin story on it's part in WWII And it's a good thing that he cares so much about Hawkgirl's headgear or endlessly juggles around why some heroes have enlisted and others haven't. Thomas has gone to significantly greater lengths than most other writers who now delve into an X-Tombola or tick a JLA-bingo card to select their team to run for a short-lived, ill-planned tenure.

I wasn't a fan of the Kubert covers. I found them scratchy, with minimal features and iffy colouring. They didn't reach out and grab me. What did I know. Looking at them now, I still think the colouring's a bit iffy. But the grasp of anatomy and dynamics is super, and it's that experience that allows him to use the amount of details he does. It just takes my brain cell that moment to see it, while Ordway's up front detail would win me over immediately.

Thoth, very good point about Steel's excessive similarity to Robotman. I guess I found it easy to ignore mainly because of the awesomeness of the fight between the two. Also because the Golden Age Robotman has never been a favorite of mine. If only he'd had his own Grant Morrison to make him awesome like Grant did with the Silver Age Robotman. Instead, we got "Dark Robotman" courtesy of the notorious James Robinson (in fairness, I think there are still a lot of things about "The Golden Age" mini-series that do still hold up -- but, Gods, it is such a product of its early-mid 90s time!)

Triumph from JLA and Steel? LOL That's a bit harsh, I think, but it sure makes me laugh heartily.

I greatly appreciate your honest assessment of Joe Kubert's artistic strengths and weaknesses, and how he compares to a more immediately accessible style like Jerry Ordway's. I think I was able to embrace him more easily partly because his sons Andy & Adam were making a big noise over at Marvel right around the time I first got into superhero comics (with Papa Joe inking Andy on Ghost Rider.) Also, Kubert was a big influence on his contemporary John Buscema, who is my favorite comic book artist of all time. One of my favorite JB works is Avengers #50, a ferocious battle between Hercules and Typhon, which JB inked himself to very Kubert-esque effect.

By any chance, have you ever seen Kubert's Silver Age Hawkman work? He only did six issues, and they received wildly mixed reactions at the time. Probably not a million miles from the reactions to Bill Sienkiewicz's "New Mutants" work 2 decades hence. Personally, though, I find them a real breath of fresh air amidst the visual primness of the other SA features from the Julius Schwartz stable (i.e. Gil Kane before he found his mojo, and Carmine Infantino, and Murphy Anderson, and Mike Sekowsky.)

Robotman has just had an issue where his fiance is unconscious on his lab floor. But she's not that now, because she believes he's dead. Instead, he's distanced himself from his love by taking on a second identity. He's done that because he doesn't want her to know about the accident and him being Robotman. We're not far away from Robotman's status as a human will be up for debate. That sense of isolation from his life, those he knew and even his humanity are just the things Morrison would pop into the Doom Patrol run. Moore wasn't the only one reading All Star Squadron, and taking cues from it.



Triumph was there at the start of the JLA and Steel is practically next out the door after Superman. Apparently. Both examples of particularly limelight hogging retcons, although Thomas' one was a bit more subtle and is presumably the work of a massive timeline he had scrawled across his home at the time.



Thanks. I think it just says more about my reading style than anything else. Kubert's covers take me that extra moment. Kirby's characters all seemed like pensioners, and Sekowsky also had that issue along with some interesting anatomy. I found Swan's work a bit stiff and dull. They just used to take me a moment. Same still do. Later, Kirby's work would reach out and thump me, Sekowsky's Wonder Woman art was hugely impressive and made me reassess why I'd enjoyed all his JLA work too, and Swan could produce gorgeous art when he had the opportunity to do so. Infantino and Sienkiewicz are other examples too. I can't even say it's a product of my time, as Infantino's work (on Star Wars) is some of the earliest I remember. I'm just a lazy reader




I don't think so. I've some Murphy Anderson ones...although a quick check tells me that I may well have some of the Hawkman/Atom issues he worked on. I've got #44 where he's being trapped in a sarcophagus. I got that *because* of the Kubert cover. That would be a number of years after the Squadron, when I like to pretend I knew better.

Interesting. I really should've been paying more attention to the Robotman subplot. I have to admit I sometimes rush through the scenes with characters who are not favorites. Also, I'm missing issues #16 and #17, which, as you noted, move that particular subplot into the spotlight.

RE: Various artists, I agree with you about Swan -- sometimes his work could be breathtaking in its loveliness (to give one example, the first DC Comics Presents issue teaming Superman with the Legion, the one where they fight Mongul.) More often, though, he really seemed to be phoning it in.

Kirby, on the other hand, is simply not my thing...specifically, I like a generous helping of lyricism with my planet-shaking action sequences. For all of Kirby's innovations, I have never gotten that lyrical feeling from his work, not even when it's prettified (somewhat) by good inkers like Joe Sinnott or Wally Wood.

Sekowsky is, to me, just totally out of his depth on team books...very similar to my opinion of Don Heck (who, oddly enough, also had a run on Wonder Woman that is well-regarded by fandom.) I alluded to this a while ago in another thread, but I kinda wish Sekowsky had taken over Flash as artist/writer instead of Wonder Woman. His irreverent writing, his quirky art style, and his legendary speed at drawing would have given Barry and the Rogues a welcome turbo-charge.

Not that Infantino's Flash work ever lacked for energy -- to the very end of his Flash run, he was doing exciting experiments with page design that soared above his weaknesses as a draftsman; but the writing got formulaic long before he left -- there really was nowhere to go after having all the Rogues team up against Flash...tellingly, Infantino's last 1960s issue was *another* wall-to-wall Rogues Gallery showcase, and not nearly as good as the first.

Back to All Star Squadron -- I will not fail to review issue #13 and Annual #1 tomorrow, and in the most expeditious manner...because I want to spend a long, *long* time savoring the goodness that is the truly epic JLA/JSA/A-SS 5-parter.

Look forward to your reviews Annfie! I'll try to dig out 16 & 17 for a quick summary when they come round.


One of the fun things with rereads, is giving credit where it's due for writers who developed plots used in later works to greater acclaim.



Don Heck would definitely be another one for this list. The JLA I started reading had Perez and Patton on art chores, and I felt that Heck was a *big* step down. But he had some great panels with Mera in the JLD. I recently saw a couple of Avengers issues with his art, and I appreciated his work a lot more. I could probably go back to those JLA issues and look at them with a better eye, rather than the eye that wants an instant return which probably read them first time round. The last Sekowsky JLA story I read left the poor guy with all of two pages to clear up a three team fight. He not only managed that, but you could read little stories within the poses he gave the characters. And that was his regular gig. His Wondy made me realise how different responsibilities, timescales and payments could impact on an artist. I remember it not being a fan favourite...all the way until they tried it again. I've not read his Wondy for a number of years, but I was really impressed. Impressed enough to hunt down his full run on it.

For what it's worth, the Robotman plots are drawing *heavily* upon the actual GA Robotman stories, from what I remember.

The credit where it's due dept goes all the way back. Considering his knowledge and desire to keep all the continuity together, I wonder how many subplots from all the individual titles Thomas used in Squadron. There's certainly plenty of references.

So All Star Squadron #13 is the infamous "Instant Cure for Racism" issue. This sort of thing is not without precedent in Roy Thomas's canon, especially at Marvel during the "Relevance" era of the early 70s that also gave us DC's "Green Lantern/Green Arrow." I can't fault Roy's sincerity, but the end result is all so very trite and simplistic and unconvincing. Also, Ordway is spelled on this issue (presumably because he was busy working on the Annual) by Mike DeCarlo; now, I have defended DeCarlo's Baxter Era Legion work vociferously, but this is a very early entry in his canon, and as such looks borderline amateurish. The rich shading and texture of Ordway's inks is very much missed, although the story itself would still have been a letdown, just a better-looking letdown.

As for the Annual, it's lovely to look at, and Earth-2 Wonder Woman having a guest-starring role *certainly* doesn't hurt it in any way. But the whole thing about the cosmic boxing coach just seems awfully silly to me, and I consider it a prime example of Roy's tendency to overdo the continuity fixes.

There. Done and dusted. Tomorrow we begin our immersion into the dense, complex wonders of "Crisis on Earth-Prime."

#13
Two panels in and Thomas has to get Hawkman to clarify a chairman position issue, that so few would have noticed. Hawk must have been tempted to call a meeting of the Thomas' Avengers for a minute. Then we have to get more clarification on who has, and hasn't enlisted, that month.
Hawkman monthly is interrupted by a rousing, patriotic speech by Belle, while we learn that King Arthur allowed voting and wasn't an absolute monarch as the title suggested. This is also the scene where Conway's Man of Steel positions himself very close to the Superman one, in continuity terms.

I'd forgotten how much like Hawkman Monthly this book was at times. I remember that, as Hawkman had been in all the All-Star issues, Thomas was determined to keep the record going. There is a nice scene with the Hawks though. I'd also not appreciated how Thomas was determined to keep the chronology together, even if that meant keeping the likes of the Atom, Hawkman and Shining Knight prominently displayed, even as they would have to get written out later on. Firebrand seems to have been hit by a race hate ray. I don't recall her having that reaction when she visited her brother the first time, so this might have been a later addition. She's also upset from losing Sir Justin.

This was the issue where Robotman and Steel have very similar life issues a scene apart. Redundant. Mary "Steel" Sue excused himself from the voting. Not because he was a brainwashed enemy agent five minutes before, and that the others don't know anything about him. But because he feels as though he's out of touch. Once that passes, he'll go for that win. Please.

I wonder if Belle getting it is a revisionist way of alleviating the guilt of Wondy being JSA and JLA secretary for so long. There's the fourth wall. Then there's the Thomas Fourth Wall where he gets a character to moralise directly to the readers about events...four decades before.

It's a fill in issue, but one that I find a lot more irritating than breezy.

Oh, yes, thanks for the reminder -- I almost forgot...

STAY TUNED

TBC was because I pressed the submit button for my post above, before I'd finished it...

Oops! Sorry.

I thought it meant To Be Continued, as in the Roy Thomas re-read continuing.

It works both ways

LOL

True, true...

As usual, I've got the Annuals in another binder, and not at this house. From what you say about it, I take it this was the one where Thomas realised that lots of his cast had similarities in their golden age origins. Naturally, he went to connect the dots. A look at the cover online tells me that I would have liked the art. But I can't remember *why* they had a similar origin or who the boxing coach turned out to be.

If Thomas had followed this line of thinking, he could have connected up all the dim, but secretly brilliant, playboy heroes for Annual 2. Batman... Starman?

I definitely applaud Thomas for wanting to do something more with Joe Morgan, who is a super-cool character from GA Atom stories, but connecting him in to Wildcat and Guadrian's origins seemed completely random, and turning him into a weird generic villain possessed by evil magic or whatever was major disservice to the character, imo.

"CRISIS ON EARTH-PRIME" (October through December 1982)

ROLL CALL: Aquaman, Firestorm, Hawkman (E-1), Superman (E-1), Zatanna (as the JLA) - Dr. Fate, Green Lantern (E-2), Huntress, Power Girl, Starman (as the JSA) - Firebrand, Johnny Quick, Liberty Belle, Robotman, Steel (as the All-Star Squadron)

PART ONE: JLA #207

The twentieth of the JLA/JSA gatherings begins routinely, with the JSA boarding the Transmatter Cube to transport them from Earth-2 to Earth-1. BUT some mysterious force throws the JSA-ers off their intended course, instead substituting...all five members of *The Crime Syndicate,* the evil JLA analogs from Earth-3! A brawl erupts within the JLA Satellite, and the villains score a victory in this battle. They then take a space shuttle loaned by NASA for testing. The villains' destination is the planet Earth...but not before they squabble amongst themselves about someone named *Degaton* (as in the time-travelling villain who was the All Star Squadron's first antagonist? But of course!)

Meanwhile, the JSA members find themselves trapped in a sort of inter-dimensional limbo, but not for long, thanks to the combined powers of Dr. Fate and Starman. But their freedom quickly turns sour when they land on Earth-Prime, the one where super-heroes are fictional characters...and which has been devastated by some form of the apocalypse. At least Alan Scott's ring manages to figure out the party responsible for this evil deed -- you guessed it: Per Degaton!

Back on E-1, aboard the JLA Satellite, the humiliated heroes regain consciousness. They decide to prioritize the well-being of the JSA-ers over the pursuit of the Crime Syndicate. And so the JLA members board the Transmatter Cube, which *does* take them to Earth-2. The bad news is, they are out of time (it's 1942 here) and out of place (history has been changed, and the tyrannical leader of the planet Earth is...yep, *Per Degaton!*)

On the opening chapter of their epic 5-part event, Gerry Conway & Roy Thomas really outdo themselves with the script. And if the art were equally impressive, I would rate this issue a complete and utter triumph.

Unfortunately, the artwork is by Don Heck, which means that the layouts are functional but dull, and that the faces are plain, samey, and sharp-featured. At least Romeo Tanghal is on inks to smooth out Heck's rough-edged linework, but he won't be back for Part Three or Part Five.

It is because of Heck's underwhelming interior art on the JLA tie-ins to this story-line (the JLA covers are by George Perez, not a personal favorite of mine but certainly more fittingly grandiose than Heck) that I had underrated Gerry & Roy's monumental achievement. But make no mistake -- on a pure story-telling level, this is truly amazing stuff!

Back later with Part Two, in All Star Squadron #14, courtesy of Roy, Gerry, Joe Kubert, Adrian Gonzales, and Jerry Ordway!

As I've said before, this is a story that I have absolutely zero ability to be objective about. This was the first JLA/JSA crossover I read, and it was my introduction to the whole concept of multiple earths, the JSA, A-SS, the Crime Syndicate, etc., and I absolutely loved it as a kid.

Cheers, EDE I can certainly relate to the feeling of revisiting an all-time old favorite! And also, like I said before, I've learned to appreciate that story a lot better in this re-read.

Gosh! JLA #207 was an excellent read. It even had a time bubble in it! I didn't mind Heck's art in it on this reread. It more than gets the job done. GL's ring might as well have been on his nose, to lead him through the information and plot points he needed to get to. Bit it did free up panel space so that every group of heroes were given plenty of room, and the reader could be taken across worlds and times.

I disagree about Heck's JLA art. I don't think it gets the job done at all. Even if we couldn't have Perez on interiors, surely we could still have had a better yeoman artist than Heck.

He was the JLA regular artist from #201, so it would have been a bit of a kick to oust him from this assignment. Carmine Infantino did #206, so it could have been given to him.

"CRISIS ON EARTH-PRIME" Part Two: "All-Star Squadron" #14

There is *so much stuff* compressed into these 23 story pages that I nearly went crazy trying to sum it up. Therefore, I'll just hit the highest points:

Two well-executed action sequences bookend a lengthy -- yet easy to follow and never boring -- exposition sequence that fills us in on Per Degaton and the Crime Syndicate AND includes a genuinely fascinating history lesson about the Cuban Missile Crisis of 1962.*

I think that A-SS penciler Adrian Gonzales manages to do justice to Roy Thomas & Gerry Conway's script in a way that JLA penciler Don Heck failed -- Gonzales understands perspective, composition, and dynamics far better than Heck. And with the chocolate drizzle of Jerry Ordway's inking, the art in this issue is not merely functional, it's exciting!

Yes, I have been harsh on Heck. Yes, too, I have a personal distaste for the way Heck draws people, especially women -- even on the middle issues of his 1960s Avengers run, where he had superb inking by Frank Giacoia, Wallace Wood, and John Romita, the results were merely tolerable for me. Heck was the kind of artist who did much better at a more down-to-earth style of adventuring than superheroes; for example, westerns! Heck's first two JLA issues, 198-199, had a time-travel plot which allowed him to draw the Wild West for extended sequences (it didn't hurt, either, that the inker was Brett Breeding, who at the time had only recently broken into comics yet already showed artistic chops to spare.) So I don't think Heck was a *bad* artist, rather one who was frequently "miscast."












* Once again, a pleasant reminder that Roy Thomas had been a schoolteacher before he broke into the comics field.

thoth lad:



Infantino did # 206 not because he was ever going to be regular on JLA, but because that issue was actually a Space Museum story framing a JLA story, and Infantino drew most if not all of that Silver Age sci-fi series.