Legion World Forums LEGION CLUBHOUSE The Legion of Super-Heroes Re-Reading the Legion: Archives #3

That would explain why some of their powers are not very well thought out. Beast Boy and Gas Girl are the only ones whose powers seem to have been developed with some idea toward how they could be used in a story or useful in battle.

By the way, I wonder if DC ever bothered to compensate some of the readers who so generously contributed ideas for characters. This could explain why we saw so little of the HoL. No need to tempt grown-up former fans with the idea of filing lawsuits.

Well, you do have Polar Boy who is a pretty prominent reader-submitted character. I have wondered about the legal question, though. It might become a pretty big deal if there were a Heroes of Lallor movie or something.

I'd bet your $1,000 they didn't compensate them. Hell, $10,000.

Well, if you're betting with other people's money, why stop at four zeros?

^^Best Post of the Day!

I'd take Life Lass or Duplicate Boy over ten of the original concepts for Aquaman, the Atom, Hawkman, etc. any day of the week. Some reader-submitted characters are pretty lame, true, but they rarely hold a candle to the dire nature of some company made characters.

Even compared to some early Legionnaires, like Invisible Kid or Matter-Eater Lad, pretty much every Lallorian greatly outclasses them, when it comes to powers.

But it's not the powers that are a measure of the usefulness of a character, or else Batman and Wolverine, two of the least powerful members of the teams they regularly frequent, wouldn't be so successful.

All good points, Set. Still, powers such as making objects come to life or duplicating any other super-power sound like they might have been suggested by a very young reader. When I was first reading Legion stories at age 9-10, I would create characters with similar powers who sounded cool to me or embodied some concept or word I'd learned. One I remember was Halt Lad, who could make objects stop in motion. (Actually, that's not a bad idea, now that I think about it.) Any power, of course, has potential, but some are just a little too gimmicky.

Of course, there's more to Batman and Wolverine than their powers or relative lack of same, as there should be with all memorable characters.

That's actually a very useful power in a gaming situation, as 'control' powers that stop people from acting (such as Green Lantern grabbing you up in a giant hand, or Wonder Woman immobilizing you with her lasso) can be very useful.

I saw a gimmicky super-duo in a game consisting of a father / daughter team named 'Redlight' and 'Greenlight.' He shot red energy beams that halted objects and people, freezing them in place, and she shot green energy beams that made things move faster, and used them on herself for super-speed, and objects as a kind of one-directional telekinesis (making things fly off uncontrollably for a second).

In comics, that sort of power doesn't work so well because it can seem kind of anti-climactic and un-dramatic. Halt Lad gestures and villain-o-the-week is ready for being handcuffed and hauled away while he's paralyzed. An uncreative writer might feel that the only way to insert drama is to have his paralysis ray not affect someone, in which case, why have Halt Lad in the comic at all, and not bring Bob From Accounting, whose superpower of being able to figure large sums in his head will be equally as useless...

And, in serial comics, no matter how much we wish it weren't so, there will always be writers who don't 'get' the character (or are incapable of coming up with non-gimmicky ways to keep their powers under control), and so someone like Chemical King or Element Lad doesn't get used intelligently or effectively.

I'm actually a little bit impressed with what Claremont did with Kitty Pryde, in that respect. Intangible characters are sometimes considered to be unfairly immune to pretty much everything, and yet Kitty faced situations where her senses were targeted (since she still had to see and hear), where her breath was targeted (since she still had to breathe) and, of course, ye olde telepathy, which scoffs at incorporeality as a defense.

Well, I did say I was 9 or 10 when I created the character.

But you touch on one of the reasons why I feel the HoL powers, created by fans, are more limited than most (not all) professionally created Legionnaires of that time: their powers have little practical use in most stories. Duplicate Boy, for example, can duplicate any super-power. That pretty much makes him a god. Was it ever established whether he can duplicate only one power set at a time or duplicate any number of powers at the same time? For example, in duplicating Superboy's powers, he already has a wide range of abilities (flight, speed, invulnerability, etc.). If he combines this with the powers of Triplicate Girl, Chameleon Boy, and Phantom Girl, for example, he's unstoppable.

Evolvo Lad's limitations were discussed previously, and I think Adv. 324 really shows how hard it is to write someone who can only move himself backwards and forwards on the evolutionary chain. He basically can do two things: become an ape for strength or become an advanced intelligence. In a story with Beast Boy, the former power is redundant while the latter power requires the writer to be very creative in demonstrating it (a problem many writers have also had with Brainiac 5).

I don't wish to disparage the characters or the fans who created them. Such characters show how much fans felt connected to the Legion's world and how the Legion inspired their imaginations. More power to them.

But the powers of Matter-Eater Lad and Bouncing Boy, by contrast, were shown to be very useful in most stories. M-E Lad tastes alien food to make sure its safe for other Legionnaires to eat and he eats out the inside of an asteroid so the Legionnaires can hide in it and land undetected on a planet. Bouncing Boy is a human billiard ball who bounces into enemies and becomes, as per one story title, an impossible target. Their powers may have looked silly, but they written with an eye toward how their powers could be assets in a story.

A talented writer could have done the same for the HoL powers, but there's no indication Hamilton or other writers ever tried.

I enjoyed the intro of the Heroes of Lallor pretty well.

I DO however, think someone should've pimp-slapped Superboy for his comment to Lyle, Thom & Vi, though. NOT cool, Clark!

It was interesting seeing Vi's relationship with Duplicate Boy blossom. I often found myself thinking back (ahead?) to their eventual breakup which occurred during the era where I got hooked on the Legion and had no idea of the details of their prior relationship. Seeing Dupe and Gim duke it out for a few panels was definitely echoed many years later when they had it out over "Vi"'s love. (All the more ironic as we eventually learned it wasn't Vi.) I wonder if Paul and Keith picked Gim for his role as paramour so that they could echo the original Gim/Dupe fight in a big way. probably not, but it's an interesting thought.

I honestly found it to be a pretty well-done story. It's not so hard for me to understand the HoL's gullibility in this story, given what we were shown of their background. It looked like they were raised by those doctors, so they probably weren't all that "street-smart". Feeling rejected and homeless, they were eager to trust this guy who offered them a place to stay. Plus, they'd been treated poorly on their planet, so they'd be inclined to distrust the Legion under those circumstances.

The main thing that I could have done without was that the dialogue expositions seemed even heavier than ever in this one. As the four Legionnaires flew into their mission, we get some clunky explanation of their powers. Really? Is it that hard to figure out what a guy called 'Invisible Kid' might be able to do? Plus, the word balloon near the end which pointed apparently to a random member of the adoring crows explaining that the eveil PM was deposed was actually kind of hilarious! "Hey, I'm gonna shout out from the audience and make sure everybody knows that guy's out of power!" Really? Ahhhhh....the Silver age!

Also, yet another example how easy Kryptonite was to find in the Silver Age! It's a wonder Kal-El EVER saved the day, right?

I'd like to know more about how Diplicate Boy's powers work. Did he have to be in proximity? The appearances in the Giffen/Levitz era I mentioned made it seem like he could activate those powers whenever he wanted to. Specifically, I remember when he used telescopic vision to discover "Vi"'s infidelity. If so, he's potentially one of the most powerful characters ever created!

Still, it was a good, entertaining story. It's a shame that the HoL rarely got to do much. The Wanderers eventually got their own shot at a series. The HoL? Not so much. But I aklways enjoyed seeing them when they turned up (usually in a cameo). And I look forward to their next appearance which we'll get to shortly.

On the other hand, I do recall several LSV members reacting in shock and distatse when Sun Emperor killed that poor waitress. Urgh. I hope Sun Emperor eventually got his comeuppance.

I do agree with your assessments on Duplicate Boy and Evolvo Lad, but Life Lass' powers seem fairly formidable. Perhaps too formidable in that sense - even an unarmed opponent would be at her mercy as long as they're not naked! I don't think she's quite as restriced as the other 2, of course.

Later writers like Levitz would help justify Duplicate Boy's "god" powers by making him lack creativity and imagination. Still, that makes Evolvo Lad even more useless - his high intelligence should have made him more than capable enough of coaching Duplicate Boy to usre his powers to the fullest.

Then again, maybe in his evolved state he could see the consequences of a moron like Ord having that much power. It's possible that he even took subtle steps (such as instilling mental blocks) to insure that Duplicate Boy never realized his potential.

Hmm. Now that I think about it I'm sensing all sorts of story potential involving Evolvo's shenanigans.

Even though Evolvo Lad was a fan suggestion, it's a bit surprising to me that Hamilton doesn't develop him more, because he fits in very well with themes Hamilton was fond of. See Hamilton's The Man Who Evolved for exploration of a similar concept.

Just because they were shocked does not mean they had good character. Many real-world criminals who think nothing of robbing, for example, will draw the line at committing murder.

Life Lass's power is interesting and original, but also ill defined. For example, just because she can make objects come to life, does it follow that she can control their actions? Suppose the chair had decided to simply walk away instead of wrap itself around Marden King? And when she turns her power "off" does that mean the now living object dies?

Adv 321 a couple of belated thoughts

- great cover! At least they gave him some books to keep him entertained.

- whoops there goes Bouncing Boy on his first "found em/lost em" power bounces

- At first I wondered why TT was holding a baby's rattle until I realised it was a microphone LOL!

- Glad Luornu's triplicating shredded the metal and not vice-versa

- With the speed spaceships seem to travel in these stories I wonder that they still needed psychological and physical testing of would-be astronauts.

- Was there ever any other mention of the other lifeforms on ME Lad's planet? I only remember the vegetation becoming poisonous so the humanoids "evolved" the ability to eat other forms of matter.

- Poor Vi. Thank goodness the writer's learned that she was tougher than this.

- Boy how do crooks have a chance if the SP have thought reading helmets? Maybe they are very rare or only work on thought-casters like Imra. Otherwise why couldn't he use it on all the other Legionnaires?

- Go Colossal Boy defeating an alien armada with a butterfly net! (well a REALLY big one!)

- Wow Supes and Mon-El really were superpowerful back then with only the NUMBER of dark stars being too much for them.

- TT was incredibly powerful to hurl those stars.

- It was nice to see a little of the effect of the Concentrator on other planets.

Those are good questions that a writer would have to explain in the character's first introduction, alright.

With Kinetix, at least we knew that she controlled the objects' actions, and it was heavily implied that when she relinquished control, the object would return to its inanimate state.

I like that idea. That much power in the hands of one person... brrrrr. And an evolved being might see it that way, alright!

WF 142

- love the splash page - took me a moment to realise that the long arm belonged to Elasti-Lad.

- Supes tries to use his Xray vision to see behind CM's half mask? I guess it looked like either more Supes or Bruce Wayne!

- Ha! Using Triplicate Girl's power to become three super-powered beings isn't used again until TMK and BION - a very clever use of multiple powers, too tricky for Tweedlesupes and tweedlebats.

- Trust Brainy to create a Duplicator machine that works better than he realises.

- When everything looks grim who you gonna call? Dick! The only one not to give up.

- While our heroes come off pretty poorly this story is very clever in how it uses multiple super powers - in fact they are better used than many regular legion stories.

LL 50

- Another guest star story very much in the same vein as the recent Jimmy one. Once again the girl Legionnaires shine.

- Ha! I was fooled by the time-bubblish cover too.

- PG can see through regular matter? That's a new one. I wonder if it is ever used again? Nevertheless it was wonderful to see her cure the Vet. If only it could always be done that way.

- Good to see Vi not shrinking away from something but bravely venturing into the drainy depths.

And on the first story in the issue, so Lois wears dark glasses so Superboy won't remember and recognise her when he grows up? Seriously Lois, you honestly think that just wearing glasses will make you unrecognisable? Who could be silly enough to think that?

ROFL!

I've always assumed those are some of the differences between Life Lass and Kinetix.

Kinetix is at core a telekinetic, which means she has to actively concentrate on controlling objects. Life Lass, by contrast, bring objects to life, which suggests that they are independent of her and presumably continue to live until something kills them. It is unfortunate that this is never really made clear in the stories, however.

Adv 322

Presenting the Legion of Absent Heroes starring Proty II!

This was a really good yarn. In spite of my opening comment the Legionnaires appearances are interesting and fit well with the story. It's great to see the TT plot advancing, the Subs using their powers effectively to help, and Ayla's new costume emblem (even if she is a bit pointed about it).

Proty II does a terrific job here and I doubt his "master" Chameleon Boy could do better. I love the thought that goes into how Proty can complete his missions. We really feel that he is in tricky situations and go along with him as he figures out how to solve them.

Everything has already been said about sentient pets, arrogant LSP, and Brainy's day off. I will always remember this story fondly.