Legion World Forums LEGION CLUBHOUSE The Legion of Super-Heroes Long Live the Legion! Legion of Super-Heroes #15 - Solicitation - SPOILERS!

I agree with you, but how would wamu2 know that? He's not familiar with the personalities and backstories of the previous incarnations. To him and other new readers, many of the Legionnaires are little more than bit players in 'The Cos and Brainy Show', defined only by their powers, physical appearance and a handful of superficial traits. At this stage, I think making every one of the 20 existing Legionnaire come to life for all readers - new and old - is more important than placating fans who are impatient for missing favorites, some of whom didn't join the original team for 15-20 years or longer.

I'm hardly a new reader, but before the Legion is enlarged, I want to learn what secrets lie in Brin Londo's past, visit Trom, Durla and Imsk, see Ayla interact with her brother(s), accompany the girls on night out on the town, and discover why giants walk the Earth - among other things. Bouncing Boy, Mon-El and Wildfire, as much as I miss them, can hang out in the wings a little longer.

I think they've done a great job too, but the characters certainly aren't the same. Colossal Boy's way different. Sun Boy's miles away from how he used to be. Chameleon too. Projectra. Dream Girl's quite different. So are Element Lad and Light Lass and Triplicate Girl. Brainy's not exactly the same. Nor is Karate Kid, or Shadow Lass, or Phantom Girl, or Invisible Kid, or Ultra Boy.

As far as adding characters goes, the only one I think needs to be added is Mon-El. Not because he's my favourite; because he's almost indispensable. The only character it'd be harder to do without, to me, is Brainiac 5. There's a big Mon-El-sized hole in the roster right now.

It's fun seeing Legionnaires like Dawnstar & Blok grace a cover of LSH after a decade+. I've never read a story where Tyroc (anagrammed: To Cry...eerie) and I think it'd be interesting.

Nonetheless, I'm not gonna actively campaign for their return. I think the Legion's in great hands and I think the only way to move forward is by not tripping over the past. Those were good stories, and so are the ones that are being published at the moment.

Amen Brother Lasher, Amen!

I understand the concerns expressed above but I have faith in this creative team and feel they could easily handle a much larger cast. The premise provides plenty of opportunity for Legionnaires to be scattered all over the universe on numerous worlds. Can't wait to see them all!

Not this fan. I don't care to see Dawnstereotype or Tokenroc ever again. Blok I wouldn't mind, but he needs a better name. White Witch and some of the others you mention would be cool too.

What I don't get is this: I've heard TPTB at DC and various creative teams complain for 30 some odd years that the Legion's huge cast is a pain to work with and too inaccessible to new readers, hence the numerous reboots, jettisoning of many characters, etc. etc. Now every teenager in the universe is a Legionnaire. It makes no sense to me.

The Legion should have 25 members (at least in the "core" group). But I'm happy to have that membership change over time.

I'm with Lash and those agreeing with him.

And I think it could be done in a well-written, fun way that doesn't hamper the story by having too many characters, especially with this creative team.

me neither.

what i don't understand is: if DC has rebooted the legion so many times because of new reader's presumptive fear of the series' intricate continuity... then, why do they have to screw it up again with all of that pre-crisis stuff?

i mean, if they had a good idea to untie the legion's continuity (maybe by using the infinite earths), why didn't they just use it with the post-ZH team? i mean, after all they sterted planning infinite crisis at least three years ago, right?

The latest relaunch had nothing to do with confusing continuity. The post-ZH team simply wasn't popular enough to keep publishing it, regardless of whatever plans they had to bring back the multiverse or whatever is happening. I take it what we are going to see in the second year is exactly what happened (in-story) that allowed this new incarnation of the Legion to come into being, and exactly what its relationship to previous incarnations of the team is.

i didn't say that DC relaunched the post-ZH legion because of its continuity, but that possible new readers still associated the legion in their minds as a series with troubled continuity. that's what i remember from waid's interviews about the reboot, at least!

in fact, why did so many new readers approach the current legion? because they new it was a different, rebooted one (again, that's just my guess).
but if i'm right and new readers came aboard for that reason, what if you screw up again with continuity?

that said, i'm just exposing a doubt. lucidly, i agree with you when you say that during the next year waid will explain where the current legion come from.

To me the characters already exist and denying them only makes matters worse and results in reboots. The pre-boot has many members that are intricate to the team and the post-boot added some others that have made it into the legend. Any version of the team that ignores those characters will be considered "unofficial" by the fans. The premise exists in this threeboot to establish a true Legion. The only roadblock that Waid has set is the lack of flight rings.

And IMHO, if fans want a smaller teams to keep track of each member every month, then I suggest Fantastic Four or try a solo book.

So how do the non-airborne members keep up with the others? By flying belts - surely?

Secondly - the book does need a few more members...In fact, a book devoted to the Legion membership with characters from all the versions pre-CRISIS, post-CRISIS, pre-ZERO HOUR, post-ZERO HOUR as a part of a collective force, would be worth forking out a few bucks, for the privilege of seeing my favourite Legionnaires in action and allowing the older fans to feel nostalgic again.

They are rare and expensive to manufacture, not impossible to come by. I'm sure they'll make more if eligible candidates come along.

And here, I think Nighty has hit the nail on the head of the greatest detriment to true Legion success. I truly believe it will always be this way until DC takes active steps to fix it.

as a fan of 100 Bullets & Fables, keeping track of a large cast of characters is not a problem. and some solo books, such as Invincible(Image, Kirkman), have nearly a dozen or so supporting characters.

my problem is whether or not the characters are developed over time. and my perception of past LSH history(based mainly on what I have read here and other sites) is that most incarnations of the Legion have focused on the same few characters while the others were so much window dressing.

I am patient guy. I don't have to know everything about every character right away. but at some point a large cast will be so numerous that giving a character his or her due will be like bailing out a canoe with a thimble.

Have to agree with Nightcrawler and LASH. I want them all or close to it.

Waid is an accomplished writer. We have seen other writers juggle large casts before quite well. Look at the current JSA! Over the Levitz Legion, etc. Sure at the pace we have now it might take 6 years to explore 10 members.

Waid has won us over with his character work thus far on this title. Less heavy on the plot more on the character.

{[...] Any version of the team that ignores those characters will be considered "unofficial" by the fans. }

True enough, although practical limits exist as to how many can be spotlighted in a single title. It's too bad the two-simultaneous-books idea isn't being revived.

The idea of "everyone can be a Legionnaire" was an idealistic stretching that doesn't seem, to me, to be working. If it were, these vivid characters from other "incarnations" wouldn't be brought back.

{ The premise exists in this threeboot to establish a true Legion. The only roadblock that Waid has set is the lack of flight rings. }

Well, apart from communications, Dawnstar doesn't need one!

My thoughts exactly. Although current sales seem to rule that out. At least until an animated series is launched.

I'm one of those fans who would LOVE to see the likes of Dawnstar, Blok, Tyroc, Chemical King, M-E Lad, etc again. Who wouldn't groove to a new Tyroc story if it was done with dignity and intelligence?

When I first heard the new Legion was going to be 30 pages a month, I thought - Waid is going to expand the Legion ranks! He did the job in Kingdom Come with some main characters driving the storyline, and a supporting cast of dozens. The same formula could easily work for the Legion. My suggestion would be the Cary Bates approach of featuring a handful of Legionaires in a short story (maybe two 15 page stories per issue). This would allow for some close interaction between members and feature a few Legionaires each issue. A rotating cast and different settings around the galaxy would make for exciting adventures each month. Every few years, a cataclysmic event or villian could bring the entire group together.

I predict the sales for L*15 will be increased, because of the cover featuring Dawny, Blok and Tyroc. Hopefully, the story won't be some sort of cheesy Hypertime dream sequence, and actually integrate these characters into this reboot.

say....never realized this ---- is that the first time we see Tyroc and Blok together on the same page, let alone on the cover?!?!

My first post!

Two thoughts on issue #15 & what we've heard about #16:

1. If the current Legion was "post Infinite Crisis" from issue #1, and the "Multiverse" is appearing in #15, I guess that means the Multiverse will be back for good after Infinite Crisis. (And about d*mn time! Sez this crusty old fart!)

2. #16 will be released during the month that all other DC books will be skipping to "One Year Later." So Supergirl showing up in the Legion may well explain where she was (is, will be?) during the one-year gap.

superboymddjr: I'm sure it can't be the first time. They must have appeared together in LSH #300, if at no other time.

Also, is it possible - I wasn't a reader at the time - that Tyroc was a member during the time Blok was with the League of Super-Assassins or whatever that group was called? So Tyroc could actually have fought Blok. Someone else will have to confirm or deny that, though.

TYROC's major appearances:

S/LSH 216, 218, 222... then he sort-of vanishes, has 1 line in S/LSH 250-251, and doesn't appear again until the Dagon the Avenger/Brigadoon Syndrome (which ends with his exile until the TMK era) stories, which were around LSH 264-266 (iirc).

BLOK debuts as a Super-Assassin around S/LSH 254-255-ish and doesn't appear as a Legionnaire (applicant then member) until.... DANG my memory... I'm wanting to say LSH 272. -Ish, anyway.

So the 2 have never appeared together. And likely never met.

Lash,
You forgot one of Tyroc's most important appearances! He valiantly stayed behind to be the only Legionnaire on active duty when the entire freakin' team went to the 20th century to figure out what when wrong in time during the Legion tabloid (you know, the one Lightning Lad and Saturn Girl got married in).


And as for LSH #300 Matthew, both Tyroc and Blok are in the issue, but only in different dream sequences had by Douglas Nolan, so they didn't appear together there either.

There was also another near miss, in the Secrets of the Legion of Super-Heroes 3 part mini. Tyroc appears on the cover of #2 and in a few panels of his origin and backstory like they did for all Legionnaires. One of the team even mentions in the 3rd issue that they have limited contact with the other-dimensional Marzal and Tyroc can only return to earth on rare occasions, like when he had been at the hospital earlier (but I didn't see him in any group shots...). The 3 part mini came out during the same time period that LSH 272 did, when Blok joined the team. Blok is never mentioned in the 3 part "Secrets" mini's story and his origin is obviously not covered. However, in the text pages associated with each issue (more backstory) there are stats for each Legionnaire (first appearance, order joined, etc.). Blok is mentioned in the 2nd and 3rd issues in these text pages only.

Close, but no cigar.

And we all know that Blok was tragically killed at the beginning of TMK, before the reintroduction of Troy Stewart, so they missed meeting in that era too.