Legion World Forums LEGION CLUBHOUSE The Legion of Super-Heroes Long Live the Legion! LSH wins "Most Disapponting Revamp" Award

For years and years I was one of those Legion fans who just couldn't get over the loss of the Levitz and TMK Legion. But the last issue (#6) really and truly helped me to get over this and move on.

That's not to say that everything about this incarnation pleases me, but simply that this version of the Legion finially "clicked" with me. In fact, matters of characterization or situational setting aside, I'm literally on the edge of my seat waiting for the next issue to come out for the first time in years.

My only real criticism, I suppose, is the idea that the creative staff may have their own list of favourite characters that they wish to use to the complete exclusion of other ones. In a comic as old and well-establshed as the Legion of Superheroes, I think that they have a duty to please as many fans as possible--even ones who like characters that they themselves dislike. After all, if they want to be completely original, then they should simply create a book of new characters rather than subjecting long-standing Legion fans to their personal whims.

I myself, for example, really liked the "Sneckie" version of Princess Projectra, but began to refrain from voicing this support when I realized how many fans of her previous incarnation were deeply offended by the re-boot version. Maybe the creators should reconsider making their own personal preferences less apparent when making plot and character decisions about the book, too. Just a thought anyway.

I wasn't offended by Jeka but I didn't like her much. I'm not sure what it was about her. She was almost too syrupy sweet except when someone really pissed her off. Or am I confusing her with Monstress? Then again, I wasn't fond of the reboot Legion as a whole and she was just one more thing not to like.

Another thing about Jeka is that I don't think anyone objected to a giant snake member of the team, but not one who was the new incarnation of Projectra. I think she strayed too far in appearance and temperament to be a rebooted version of Jeckie in the eyes of her supporters.

That was my only complaint with Jeka. It had taken me years before Paul Levitz finally got me to love Projectra (starting with the first Baxter arc, but more so with Sensor Girl). So when she was returned in the reboot, I was at first excited. But then she was shown to be different... radically different. It wasn't a new hair color, or simply a sweet disposition. She went from being a humanoid woman to a giant snake. That was just a bit too radical a switch for me.

Now, if they had introduced a new snake character, perhaps a telekinetic or a hypnotist or something, then I most likely would never have minded the character. Even an illusion-casting snake that was not royal and called Sensor I could have dealt with. But not as a reboot Projectra.

I doubt many fans would of other Legionnaires would have felt the same way if they had introduced: Saturn Squirrel? Lightning Lizard? Cosmic Koala?

I think that it's one thing to tweak a character when you reboot them, so long as, when the day is over, there is still enough left of the original to keep you comfortable. It would be like rebooting Dawnstar as a dragon. Sure, they both fly, and dragons ARE cool, but would any Dawnstar fan really find that reboot satisfying?

At least with this reboot, the Legionnaires are still more or less recognizable. Sure there have been tweaks to origins and skin color, but they are still similar enough (so far) to the originals that I can deal. And maybe in a year or so, after we've gotten to know this new Legion better, they won't seem very different from earlier versions at all.

I'm sorry for my mistake, I forgot the first preboot run was for Waid (again) and mcgraw. Correct?


One question to the fans.
Is this revamp really necesary?
Why don't simply kill all the bad characters from the reboot (Sensor, Jarth, Shikari, Wildfire, Kid Quamtun, Dreamer, Leviathan (Vi)Apparition & Cube) and bring back in a time ship from another alternative reality all the good ones (Projectra, Garth, Jan, Gim, Drake, Dawnstar, Block, Dirk, Nura, Mysa, Tenzil,Chuck, Tinya and Salu)
And the we keep the best of the reboot (Triad, Umbra, Saturn Girl, Cosmic Boy, XS, Kinetix, Gates, Mon'el, Star Boy, Gear,Invisible Kid, Brainiac 5, Andromeda, Chameleon, Spark, Ultra Boy, Ferro, Karate Kid).
What do you think about my idea?

I love having Gim, Jan, and Jeckie back, [and having Kinetix, Kid Q, and Gates gone] but so far I've seen nothing that justifies yet another reboot. It seems to me that the last Legion could've moved in a new direction by having a youth movement rally to their cause without rebooting the whole series. When the Legion made its comeback and saved the day after being outlawed by Ra's would've been a good time for this to happen IMO.

I agree that this could easily have been shoehorned into the previously existing incarnation of the Legion, especially with Gail Simone's arc already establishing very similar themes to Waid's Legion.

Emerald Empress wrote:

"Is this revamp really necesary?"

Necessary for a good stories? No. Absolutely, positively not. The DnA Legion had plenty of good stories left in them, imo. Necessary for better sales to ensure the future of the franchise? That's debatable because the long-term benefits remain to be seen. But the choice was never ours, nor even Waid's. The initial decision to revamp came from a higher authority in DC (Dan Didio), who was concerned with the viability of the Legion as a *business* property. From Didio's perspective, it was necessary. Like it or not, commercial interests will usually prevail over purely creative ones. Like you, I hate the idea of the reboot, but I'm also relieved Didio gave the Legion a chance for a new life instead of wrapping it up in mothballs.

"Why don't simply kill all the bad characters from the reboot ... and bring back in a time ship from another alternative reality all the good one"

That's pretty much what Waid has tried to do, at least in the cases of Projectra, Garth, Jan, Gim, Tinya and (hopefully) Salu. You may or may not agree with the outcome. For example, I don't think 3boot Sun Boy or Element Lad measure up to the classic originals, but I'll give them both a chance to evolve. The still-missing characters you mention have not been ruled out.

"And the we keep the best of the reboot"

The "best" is open to interpretation. For example, I can't agree that postboot Brainy, Saturn Girl, Cosmic Boy, Ultra Boy, Triad or Karate Kid were significantly better characters than the 3boot ones. It's still early, but the 3boot versions now seem equally good or better to me (not so sure about Imra, however). In other instances - Umbra, Mon, Gates, postboot Chameleon - I agree with you. I miss those guys. I hardly think that Ferro, Gear, Andromeda and Kinetix should be included among "the best of the reboot", but opinions vary.

I hope so, because they sure weren't USING them. I didn't enjoy any of their stories after the first Ra's arc. I wish they'd left with Olivier so we weren't subjected to stuff like Foundations...

What I meant (as you well know) is that the same characters and continuity could have been used by a new creative team to tell good stories, if not necessarily good-selling ones.

DnA *were* going to leave with Olivier, but Steve Wacker persuaded them to stay to do the anniversary issue. Vomit on him if you like.

Well, I can't believe FIRESTORM didn't win this "award". Talk about disappointing fans of a character! And then there's a 2-issue flash of hope that's then smashed into a million peices. Bleah.

As for the WaK LSH, I'm still grooving to it. The reboot in general just wasn't cutting the space-cake for me.

I think this reboot is missing the point. The legion is about old fashioned values of doing the right thing and being something bigger then the self. But this legion are a bunch of random strangers working in the same office to fill time.

Except that the last Legion didn't really have those values, either. They were simply a para-military organization directed by the UP. At least this team has banded together to seek positive change.

Although I didn't want to see Another Legion reboot, I like the idea a bunch of old characters (Gim, Dirk, Jeckie) are back.

I agree with Blacula completely. Cary Bates had more action in 13 pages than what we've seen so far in 30. I plan on giving the title at least 12 issues before making up my mind, but after 6 issues (which have 30 pages each) it's time to stop laying the foundation and start building the house. Compare the action in the Legion for 6 issues to the last 6 issues of the Teen Titans, and you understand why the Titans still outsell the L.

PS - There's no point in introducing 'new' Legionnaires until the others have something to do.