Legion World Forums LEGION CLUBHOUSE The Legion of Super-Heroes JSA/JLA/Legion Crossover (spoilers)

Actually, and as Michael has pointed out at the Omnicom , it says: Tle Villain Is tle Lero in Lis Own Story. The "h" and "l" seemed to have confused whoever put the Interlac together.

Ok just read it.

So the Legion start off looking like manipulators. To me this is the old school Legion "traitor" tradition. I've been looking at the Adventure covers over at the Encyclopedia section and the word "traitor" appears in more covers than I can count. And we recently talked about Levitz's Conspiracy. So i like that.

Superman going ape-crazy mad about it was cool also! Love pages that have multiple shots of the character moving fast. Then ofcourse he got duped by Jeckie and felt guilty. I found it hard to believe he shattered her shoulder myself.

Jeckie always had two hearts?

Loved the force-rings. I just started a thread recently about letting the rings do more stuff. I like how they explain some of the "silly" Legion stuff as advanced 31st century technology. The rings, rods, etc. I like that alot actually.

Seems like I'm not the only one who thought it was going to be Barry coming back. Bats and Brainy did as well I think. Wally is my Flash so I was glad it was him. He seems a bit older?

Starman mentions Kal-L! Who was that shadowy figure that told Val to stay? He had a hand (no gloves I saw a fingernail). Pretty muscular and it seemed short hair? I can't think of any Legionnaire save...Kon-El?

And who did Brainy want? Barry or Bart? Imagine Bart AND Kon-El joining this Legion?

Quick question. I thought I read years ago that Val may be originally from the 20th century? Or am I wrong?

The good news is we have Starman in the JSA and Karate Kid in the JLA!

I thought the story was kind of dull myself. Of course this is from a person with no real attachment to the original LSH.

I liked the Sci-Fi bits. But what does everyone think of the stuff grafted on to the LSH characters. Stuff like Red Tornado and Wildfire being the same guy. Also who was that with Val at the end, Nura?

McDuffie can't take over JLofA soon enough in my opinion. I haven't liked Meltzer's run at all. A 10 issue montage of freeze framed JLofA iconic fanboy moments while well executed isn't really a good comic book.

I'm not enthusiastic about the Wildfire/Red Tornado thing. I don't see where that gets us at all. (I do, however, wonder if it has anything to do with the 'Red Inferno' T.O. Morrow mentioned at the start of 52.)

And another thing that ticks me off:

It's not 'Dreamgirl'! It's just not. Two words, Brad: 'Dream Girl'. Would you call him 'Karatekid'?

Is it Wild Fire? Or Wildfire? Super Boy or Superboy? You say tomato I say...just messing with ya!

I disagree. Look the JLA was never known for its character development. It was always an iconic fanboy book IMO. Atleast we got some serious character moments with Red Tornado. (And Red Arrow I think)

I woke up with a horrible thought in my head this morning regarding the interlac quote. It could certainly apply to Superboy Prime. What if the Legion we just met turns out to be Superboy Prime's Legion and they turn out to be the villians of the final crisis, with Barry as a weapon? God, I hope I'm wrong, but it makes a certain amount of sense when you think about it.

Well, I can't believe nobody's mentioned any of the points I'm about to mention, but this issue didn't make any sense to me at all.

First, I don't read anything but Legion, typically, so I have no idea what's been going on with Wally. Is he married now? Who are those 2 kids who are dressed like the Tornado Twins? They're obviously too old to be Wally's kids. How were they "killed"?

On with the nothing making any sense:

1. Timber Wolf said it was a suicide mission and Dream Girl predicted the death of a Legionnaire. Hello? Nobody died. Okay, so I'm relieved but WTF?

2. How were the Legionnaires supposed to be electrocuted if they were using force shields?

3. Where did K Kid's force shield come from? Did it activate when he said "Lightning Lad"? How come nobody else had to say "Lighting Lad" to activate theirs? And how could he have ducked when the artwork clearly shows the lightning bolt ripping right through his body?

4. If Wally wasn't really dead then why use the resurrection devices to "revive" him? And if he was dead, how did they revive him without sacrificing anyone's life force? And there just happened to be storms occurring simultaneously in every city that Wally ever spent any time?

5. Dream Girl (or Starman?) said that the JLA gave them their costumes but each of the Legionnaires was found already in costume when the JLA met them. And I wish they'd quit "Marvelizing" the Legion by giving Timber Wolf a "healing factor" and Karate Kid the ability to sense weaknesses. Hello? That's Karnak, not Karate Kid.

6. For what purpose would Batman tell the Legionnaires that he had to examine ALL of their flight rings? It seems like examining one of them would be the most he could get away with without arousing their suspicions. And he never had the chance to examine Dawnstar's or Sensor Girl's as they both took off with the other Legionnaires immediately after they showed up.

jim, i am guessing because Wally wasn't dead is the reason a Legionnaire didn't die. If they were trying to ressurrect a dead hero (Barry) then a life would be needed.

oh wow. that is scary. Superboy-Prime's Legion? ouch.

If Waid had pulled junk like Red Tornado Wildfire, schizoid Star Boy, and undead Karate Kid, people would have screamed bloody murder and threatened to burn down his house. If you're going to apply double standards, at least be honest about it. Meltzer and Johns are no better than any other writers who screw around with the Legion to satisfy their own geek fantasies.

Bottom line review of the JLA/JSA/LSH crossover: terrific artwork, lousy, incoherent story. As for The Flash, what they did to Bart was absolutely despicable. I never liked Bart that much, but this was senseless, stupid waste of a character. I couldn't care less about the return of boring Wally.

This was my last issue of Flash and JLA. JSA is tettering on the edge. Awaiting news of further attempts to screw around with the Legion.

Okay, but that doesn't explain Dream Girl's prediction or T Wolf calling it a suicide mission. And if they thought Wally was dead, K Kid shouldn't have ducked. And they said they intended to pull this mission off without Superman or the JLA finding out about it so there was no need to try and trick them by pretending it was a suicide mission when it wasn't. Either way you look at it, it makes no sense.

Wally and Linda are married. They had twin babies right before Infinite Crisis. Wally, Bart, and Jay disappeared into the speed force shoving Superboy Prime during Infinite Crisis. Jay and Bart later emerged. Wally was somehow able to take his family with him.

There is a theory floating around on other boards that the "Lightning" the rods were meant to attract was actually the speed force, and the Legion was sent back to the point in time when Bart died (yesterday - Flash #13), and was pesumedly sucked back into the speed force.

The Legion was, perhaps, trying to pull Barry from the speed force, but released Wally and family as a by product.

It's not clear if the kids aged because they all spent several years in the speed force, or if they somehow aged unnaturally while they were there. At any rate, they will be the new Tornado Twins. Mark Waid will be the new writer on Flash which is supposed to focus on Wally and the twins.

Something else else like that any way. I don't read Flash on a regualr basis, but that is what I have been able to pick up from what I have read.

I think a better title for this arc would have been much ado about nothing.

jim, i agree it makes no sense unless there is something we will find out later. I doubt it though.

I am glad my geek fanatsies are similiar to the their own! Mark Waid's geek fantasies? Unless Grant Morrisson is writing I have no interest.

No, that take on Val's powers is true to (some periods of) original Legion continuity. I think it's kind of silly too, but Johns and Meltzer didn't make it up.

I don't recall the "senses weaknesses" thing being used except in the post-ZH Legion. But regardless... it's silly.

I always thought Val should have a super-learning-martial-arts power though, to explain how he can actually master all of those fighting skill by the time he's a teenager.

Last i checked, Countdown was only at issue fortysomething. Lots of issues to kill one of the timelost legionnaires.

Jorge, true what you said about JLofA being a fanboy moments. But there's a difference between the historical JLofA fanboy moments and what Meltzer's doing. Back in the day, there was action which drove thrill into the moments. Meltzer's been giving us moments without action and any thrills we feel are coming from pleasant memories we have of the characters. It's in effect a clipshow with all new material. That's why I didn't find Lightning Saga enthralling, I have no reccollection of the Levitz Legion from my youth.

In a sense Meltzer's JLofA is the equivalent of Dancing with the Stars. Here's a bunch of one time celebrities, remember how they used to thrill you? Now let's waste some time while you remember how they used to be.

I think "Dancing with the Stars featuring Celebirty Impersonators" might capture it better...

Maybe, but I hold out hope that TPTB are laying the groundwork for a universe in which there is rational interactoon among JLA/JSA/LSH and (the corpses of former) Teen Titans.

I didn't meant to imply that they did. I know it has appeared once or twice before but it was not part of Karate Kid's original power set and I think it was obviously confused with/stolen from Karnak of the Inhumans whenever it first appeared. Stories like this just perpetuate the inaccuracy, which really gripes me.

Isn't that the old Adventure ploy with Dream Girl and her power? She sees in a dream that the Legionnaires are going to die and it turns out she saw robot duplicates being destroyed.

Yes, but there were no stunt doubles this time around.

Okay, how's this for a theory? They brought back the pre Crisis Supergirl, and she is the shadowy figure talking to Karate Kid as he exits.

Suppose this really is OUR Legion. By that, I mean the pre Crisis Legion. On the last page Brainiac 5 says "But for THIS universe, all I really care about is that we got who we wanted."
If the plan is to revive the pre Crisis universe wouldn't that mean bringing both Barry and Kara back?

When Wally wakes up he says "I'm faster than anyone". Karate Kid responds, "No. You're not." Could he be referring to the Kara moving off panel at pre Crisis level super speed so as to remain hidden? Doesn't the reflection of the lightning in Val's eyes right before it hits look like an "S"?

The shadowy figure leaving with Karate Kid appears to be female. She refers to "Brainy" in the way that someone familiar with him would, so she must be Legion. I'm sure there are a lot of holes that can be shot in this theory, but you never know.

Jerry, she was a bit muscular to be Supegirl. It was defintely male.

Brainy wanting Kara back makes perfect sense. I also think it might be Bart Allen.