Legion World Forums LEGION COMPANION The Anywhere Machine New Star Trek! (spoilers possible in subsequent posts)

Things that probably won't happen in the new Trek timeline:

1) No Gary Mitchell/Jim Kirk friendship. It seems pretty clear that in the new timeline, Kirk enters Starfleet Academy at an older age. As a result, he and Mitchell never form a friendship that leads to Mitchell becoming Kirk's first first officer on the Enterprise.

2) No David Marcus. Likewise, it seems like Carol Marcus was one of Kirk's girlfriends at the Academy in the "Prime" timeline. A later-matriculating Kirk probably means no hook-up with Marcus, or even if there is, no hook-up at the same time/place to lead to David's conception. As a result, no David Marcus, no Genesis device.

3) Khan Noonian Singh remains in cold sleep for eternity. It also seems clear that in the new timeline, Kirk and the crew come together on the Enterprise BEFORE they did in the prime timeline. As a result, it's highly unlikely that the Enterprise would be in the same exact spacetime location to discover the Botany Bay, revive Khan, and set off the chain of events that leads to the events in Star Trek II, III and IV.

4) No Pon Farr/Koon-ut-kal-if-fee for Spock. Odds are good that T'Pring died in the destruction of Vulcan, which means Spock is single again and can totally hook up with Uhura or whoever!

5) Sarek dies of a heart condition(?) with the voyages of Kirk's Enteprise starting sooner and <span class="spoiler_containter"><span class="spoiler_wording">Click Here For A Spoiler</span><span class="spoiler_text">Amanda dead</span></span>, it's unclear that Sarek will be on the Enterprise with his son and wife to save his life when he develops his fatal heart condition.

Now here's my wild speculation:

Carol Marcus Saves Earth from Vengeful "Whalesong" Probe: Without her affair with Kirk or her son David, Carol Marcus focuses on smaller-scale generation of organic lifeforms from inorganic matrices, with an emphasis on repopulating Earth's extinct animal and plant species from the U.N. gene vault in arctic Norway. Her most ambitious project to date is the re-creation of the humpback whale species, coincidentally completed just in time for the arrival of the "whalesong" probe.

Just got back from seeing it and wow! what a way to reboot a series, or breathe new life into it. Now they can make six sequels! Very impressive.

There were enough nods to the original personalities to please the nostalgia in all of us, but these characters had sufficient difference to not be carbon copies. I thought most of them were improvements over the originals, except for Kirk, who struck me as a bit too brash and daredevilish - although that's easily attributed to youth.

I kept waiting for (1) Nurse Chappel and (2) some reference to a tribble. Maybe next movie.

I know it's Hollywood, but I wonder why the bad guys always have to look like street thugs. Couldn't a shipload of guys in grey flannel suits be scary?

Anybody seen Dick Cheney lately?

Sorry, terribly ot but hanging curveballs and all that...

At one point Dr. McCoy calls for Nurse Chapel.


I just saw it today too and really really like it. I do like the alternate time line so they can do more movies. Maybe even a series???

I wanted to see Chapel and the Majel Rodenberry character from the original pilot too. Pike's no-nonsense executive officer would be natural to use if they needed an older woman character in a position of experience and authority.

Speculation on the net was that Carol Marcus was in an early draft of the script. Possibly To be played by Keri Russell? There might have been more academy scenes in early drafts. Its actually quite smart for them to leave a 3 year gap. All of it is fair game for the franchise to fill in if they want.

That explains a lot. I wondered who the kid was and why he was hitch hiking on a deserted road.

I now wonder what was in the scenes that were cut. Did they show George/Johnny having an argument with stepdad? George/Johnny picking on Jim? Something else else that would have provided context to the drive by?

Interesting speculations, dc. Here are some additional thoughts and possibilities:

This, of course, means that Gary never encounters the barrier at the edge of the galaxy and becomes a psionic monster. Of course, it's just as likely that he was assigned to some other ship that did encounter the barrier and that his fate proceeded much the same.

Or David is quite younger in this timeline. (Hm. Maybe Chekov stole his years. )

On the other hand, Jim was trying to pick up Uhura at a bar frequented by Starfleet cadets. He might have had previous encounters with other cadets, including Carol.

Again, it's just as likely that some other starship would enounter the S.S. Botany Bay. (Here's an interesting idea: What if it was discovered by a Klingon ship? How would Klingons react to Khan and vice versa?)

I doubt that we'll ever get to see any of these stories or the others you've proposed, except maybe in noncanonical novels and comics. The makers of ST clearly want to go in a new direction instead of revisiting old ideas. But it's fun to speculate on how things might be different.

Yeah, HWW, I guess my main point was that things are different enough that the key moments of original Trek probably won't happen, which I think most people here get intuitively. I sure hope no one in creative team EVER thinks of reviving Khan. That story clearly belongs to the original Kirk, and was done perfectly, and replaying it is a waste of valuable time and money. Plus, it's not really tenable anymore to have genetically enhanced criminal from the 1990s.

FC, I totally agree that men in gray flannel suits are the ultimate threat to Star Trek. See the original SNL skit with John Belushi, Chevy Chase, Dan Akroyd and Elliot Gould!

It is interesting to think about how this pretty successful reboot of Trek, and our reactions to it, compare and contrast with attempts to reboot the Legion, and our reactions to that. I don't mean to imply a perfect correspondence, of course. Comics characters don't get old, bald, fat and dead unless the creative team says so. But it is interesting to think about.

Well, I saw it last night and I’ll give my full on impression without reading anyone else’s comments and go back and read the thread. I’m not a huge Star Trek fan but I do like the series and am familiar with it, having seen most the movies a lot of the original show and being generally familiar with science-fiction. But I’m not a diehard, so take that as you will.

So what did I think? I thought it was utterly magnificent. And Star Trek fans that don’t think so are seriously screwed up in the head and outright crazy

It had everything: action, tension, character moments, likeable actors, moments that were truly moving and a heightened sense of grandeur that hasn’t been seen SINCE THE TV SHOW. I would say this is better than almost all the original Star Trek movies with the one exception being Wrath of Khan. Yes, its even better than Star Trek’s 1, 3 and 4.

A huge part of that was the sense that this was the beginning of an epic saga that has so much more to offer. It grandiose and yet grounded in humanity, which is continually played up in the movie. JJ Abrams also uses several skills to create a heightened amount of drama during the sequences aboard the Enterprise which sometimes can be so damn boring.

Star Trek has this longtime habit of hitting you over the head with themes of tolerance and anti-bigotry (kind of like recent versions of the Legion) and its so heavy-handed that you want to punch the movie screen. Well, that is all gone here. Those themes are still there, seen quite obviously in the Spock sequences on his home world, but they are not the major aspect of the movie, which was a welcome relief.

The universe of Star Trek was presented quite well, without getting too bogged down in the complicated inertia. That can come in future movies when applicable.

The actors / characters were extremely well done in my opinion, and I’ll give each one a brief review:

Chris Pine as Captain Kirk – I thought he did an excellent job and he had quite an uphill battle. But he was likeable, daring and captured what I believe is the essence of Captain Kirk. And rather than go the obvious root of having him be the ladies man to end all ladies men, they purposely made sure to show how likeable he is to both males & females alike.

Zachary Quinto as Spock – I think he did a wonderful job too. He conveyed the pure awesomeness of Spock that I think will get a whole new generation to appreciate it after about 20 years of basically no one caring anymore. He also layered every scene with emotion bubbling beneath the surface.

Karl Ubran as McCoy – to me, this was the best performance of the movie. Every time he stepped on screen I was beside myself with glee, and it made me realize how much I love the character of McCoy. And he used so many of McCoy’s traditional phrases without sounding the least bit corny. The Kirk/McCoy friendship, complete with continual animosity and disagreements was perfect. So were the Spock/McCoy scenes.

Uhuru – she was amazing. I’m so pleased with her performance, and I disagree that she wasn’t played as a strong character. She appeared to be smart, strong-willed, naturally one of the leaders of the Enterprise and incredibly sexy as well. I found the green girl a little ‘meh’ myself, but thought Uhuru was incredibly attractive here.

Sulu – Sulu rocked like never before. I was so happy with this performance too, and his kick-ass sequence with the sword was funny since they always used to show him fencing in the old Star Trek. I couldn’t be happier.

Chekov – I thought it was kind of cool that they played him as so young, even mentioning him as being only 17. I liked it, and I’m looking forward to seeing him grow in future movies.

Scotty – Simon Pegg rocked like no one’s business. He dominated that role and the audience craved more scenes with him.

Captain Pike – awesome, they couldn’t have done a better job.

Nero – probably the weakest character of the movie, but when it comes down to it, I’d rather see the various Enterprise characters interacting more for the first time than focusing on Nero anyway. I figured we all knew that coming in, that Nero wouldn’t be on the level of Khan, since this movie wouldn’t be all that much about him. If they make a second movie, that villain will have to be the one stepping up to the plate.

All in all, I thought it was fantastic. My parents saw it too the day after it opened. They remember the TV show from when it came out and have been fans for over 30 years, and the crowd they were with was basically the same—the crowd gave it a standing ovation at the end. My parents haven’t been this excited about a movie since I don’t know when.

Star Trek has been in a dire cycle of decline in both popularity and also quality for decades; I think that’s simply a true fact. And now a turning point has happened and this film has done a wonderful job. I’m truly impressed with it.

Some additional comments:

<span class="spoiler_containter"><span class="spoiler_wording">Click Here For A Spoiler</span><span class="spoiler_text"> Leonard Nimoy’s scenes were superb. His presence really added a level of authenticity to the movie but they were also very well done. His telling Kirk they have been, and always will be friends was moving. Not blurry eyed moving, but a welcome sense of poignancy. BTW, he and Abrams must be becoming buddies…he’s become a major character on Abram’s show Fringe, which really rocks.

I really liked the Uhuru / Spock romance. Not sure if Trek fans will lose their minds over it, but I think it’s a welcome addition. It didn’t seem forced at all and drew me right in so I cared about how the romance would turn out.</span></span>

The reviews I read suggested Bana would be at least decent, but I doubted those from experience. He turned out to be quite un-engaging.

Why does evil have to be so... obvious? When the tether supporting your platform is all spiky, you know something's wrong. And why did they make these Romulans reminiscent of Remans?

I liked the joke about Uhura's name, a little jab at the original series. But another joke, if it was intentional, was much smarter. Her roommate. A popular myth is that Kirk bedded a lot of girls (not true, at least from the evidence we have) and that one was the "Green Skinned Space Babe (TM)". So, this time, we see Kirk actually getting it on with an Orion - and getting interrupted. Referencing the myth, but proving that it's an exaggeration.

A couple little things reminded me of Galaxy Quest, though. For the first time, we get a starship launch not going right, and since when do you fly the Enterprise with a lever like that? Also, the transporter has to be targeted the same way as the digital conveyor.

Didn't like making fun of Scotty's alien buddy.

Spock/Uhura shipping. What the sprock? Particularly as it's not a well-done romance. Too much kissing, not enough making us care about it. And I can't see Spock letting himself get into a conflict-of-interest situation like this. Or, what I'm trying to say is, he wouldn't reassign Uhura to the Enterprise.

Telling Kirk and Spock they have great destinies, then saying their destinies have changed - far too obvious. Give the viewer some credit.

When I read reviews saying the science was bad even by Star Trek standards, I wondered how that could be. It was surprising to find they were right.

I'm trying to read lightly hereto avoid too many spoilers, but...should I stay thru the credits, i.e. for any secret scenes?

This is EXACTLY the stupidity I would like to see them avoid:


Fan Demanding "More Khan"

Jeez.

"Legionnaires" and "Legionnerds"?

lol

Yow! I never thought about surprise scenes in the credits. I skipped out as soon as they started to beat the parking lot rush.
Yeah, I tried to get a seat in the back rows but they were all filled with (other) grey-haired geeks by the time I got there.

More Khan? No thanks. Maybe a cameo, or a reference to him, but they would do better to tell all-new stories rather rehash the old ones, IMO. This movie provides a very solid base on which to build.

Regarding the science - the only thing I kept wondering about was why the black hole didn't continue devouring other stuff after it destroyed Vulcan.

Somehow I can't see that being an issue until Legion fandom is in imminent danger of being at least half the size of Trek fandom.

As the saying goes, those are the kind of problems you want to have.

I agree: no more Khan. We want new stories, not old ones.

(Though I still think it would be cool if Khan were revived by Klingons.)

The article linked by doublechinner does make a good point: ST movies need better villains. Nero was virtually interchangeable with the last movie's Picard clone, who was himself as one-dimensional as villains come.

But I'd rather not see the mirror universe or even the Borg revisited. As the writer of the article pointed out, those threats mirrored (pun not intended) real anxieties in the world. It shouldn't be very difficult to find monsters in today's world. (How about the dreaded Lay-Off Monster?)

On the eve of galactic war with the Klingons, A sentient STD.... of SPACE infects Kirk controlling his mind. It's goal is to spread groovy free love all over the Federation. But can the Federation survive pacifist hedonism in the face of the warlike Klingons. Or will the herb that was the real Vulcan heritage Spock wanted to save when he beamed down to Vulcan keep the Klingons giggling and asking for the nachos.

I'm definitely seeing Ashton Kutcher and Sulu's buddy from Harold and Kumar as Klingons... DUDE?!? Where's my bird of prey?

Hey man, like, didn't they already do that with Spock's brother, man? I mean, I was kinda diggin' his groove in layin' off those bad vibes and eas'in on down the road, man.

Ooooh, hey, instead of tribles, Cheech and Chong reunite as leaders of the lost tribe of Mar'i Jaynes, a bunch of funlovin' guys that accidentally release a groove gas on the new Vulcan.

Just imagine, Spock high! Now theres something that would be fun to watch.

Highly illogical (but soooo beautiful)!

Since marijuana and Cheech & Chong are associated with the '70s, we need to update this. How about Star Trek II: The Wrath of Meth? In this film, the Enterprise tries to defeat the crystal meth entity which destroys colonies. Hilarity ensues when we learn that Scotty is dealing drugs from the engine room (with a nod to Harlan Ellison, who proposed the same scenario for "City on the Edge of Forever").

I'm struggling to envision meth and funny in the same plot. Pot, not so hard. Super munchies of space.

Random things I really LIKED about the new movie:

1) Lens flares. Yes, everyone is complaining about them, and I agree that there are some scenes where they are over the top. But I applaud Abrams trying to make the interior of the ship seem more real. It's hard for something that shiny to be believable, but the Lucas/Ridley Scott approach of old, encrusted and grungy wouldn't be the Enterprise (this approach did work on the Academy shuttles, tho). So, a worthy try.

2) Toward more realistic lower decks. Again, many fans may complain, but I like the idea of the engineering/hanger bay areas having little/no interior finish to them. Why add mass that you don't need for function, or cover up critical systems that you need to access quickly in an emergency? Abrams may not have got it exactly right (is it a brewery or an engine room?) but I think it's a good and logical approach. Plus, let's face it, a Scotty played by Simon Pegg SHOULD have an engine room that can function as a brewery, distillery and warp drive!

3) How smart everyone is. I liked that in the movie and even more in the associated materials, it's very clear that the main characters are the best of the best.

4) Minimal technobabble. The characters can show how smart and talented they are and resolve daunting problems with a minimum of TNG/Voyager technobabble. Hurray!

5) "I am relieved." For some reason, my favorite line in the movie, uttered by new Admiral Pike as Kirk takes over as Captain. It's brilliant because the actor's delivery is perfect, conveying his relief that his faith in Kirk has not been misguided. It's also the ideal personification of the fan's reaction.

6) The use of the classic Trek music at the end. I thought Abrams and Giacchino handled this perfectly. I appreciated that they didn't have some elegaic version of the classic fanfare at the start of the movie. Saving the classic theme until the end emphasizes that this was the origin, and the real Star Trek is just now beginning. Also, the fanfare/classic theme was elegaic nostalgia in previous movies. Here, it's fast-paced, rousing and optimistic. Just like the movie.

I think you missed the ironic tone of my post.

On the other hand, M*A*S*H, for one film, made good use out of humor and topics that had previously been verboten, so anything's possible.

Once again... Legion World is ahead of the curve when it comes to trends in Pop Culture.

We\'ve already got a soundtrack....