Legion World Forums LEGION COMPANION Dr. Gym'll's Cultural Rarities FINAL CRISIS (Official Thread)

I'm with ya Drake. I like pretty picutres, and as long as they go well with the story, I don't mind who's drawing them.

Any thoughts about #2?
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-- Things are starting to move along, but we haven't gotten to the world-shaking part just yet. Mister Miracle si recruiting heroes to combat the upcoming evil, the former Monitor's coworkers at Big Belly Burger thinks he's nuts and the heroes are being targeted: Hal Jordan is framed for the near fatal assault on John Stewart and the murder of Orion, Batman is taken away via Boom Tube and Superman has some personal crises of his own after an explosion at the Daily Planet.

Oh, and Barry Allen comes back.

The story's good so far, but certainly there's a lot of live up to with the "Crisis" monniker. I'm sure people expect a lot more stuff to happen, but I'll reserve judgement since this is the calm before the storm. Things are progressing in the story Morrison is able to convey a sense of genuine menace on the horizon.

My CBS was actually sold out of this issue so it will be a while before I get a chance to read it for myself.

I have absolutely NO interest in "Final Crisis" - I tried reading both "52" and "Countdown" and hated both.

The last Crisis containing Superboy's death had great art and story though.

I am really hoping "Legion of 3 Worlds" lives up to the hype.

I feel "Titans" has been a HUGE disappointment - awful story, awful characterization and DREADFUL AWFUL art.

The new lineup for "Teen Titans" from DC Nation looks awful - big mistake to get rid of Ravager/Rose Wilson. The rest of the characters in the books are just b*****s especially Cassie.

I have liked Shooter's run on Legion but now it is starting to feel hollow since it has been revealed he isn't really "on" the book and they are just using his scripts. Plus everything might be null/void once "3LW" comes up.

For awhile DC was much better than Marvel but I think it is starting to swing back to Marvel.

The new Uncanny X-Men and Astonishing X-Men look promising with the new direction the books are taking.

Are slow burns still viable in today's comics industry?. Nothing's really captivated me yet, though Shilo's excursion to Japan comes closest. The new New Gods think is just an added layer of confusion, I think.

The Villains Win- isn't really all that much of a selling point. Barry's return is hard to see as anything but a cynical exercise in manipulation.

um... did they actually let GraMo use the word @**h***? I know comix have been more lax of late with words like bitch, but @**h*** is one of those words made famous (or infamous, whatever... ) in George Carlin's "7 Words You Can't Say..." skit. WhudFXup with THAT?

I'm always surprised-- shocked really-- when I see g.d. in comics. To me, that's about 1,000 times worse than any of the other cuss words.

Pov, that profanity also jarred me. Does the CCA not appear on the cover? I'll have to relook at it.

Mystery Lad, I agree with you too about letting that expletive in comics too.

It's disappointing that language has to be reduced to so base a level to reflect anger. The medium allows violence and battle scenes to do that, but the words should be held to a higher standard.

I don't mind the language. Why should it be less acceptable than limbs being ripped off or heads being blown apart?

Well, not one (on this thread so far) is promoting ripped and blown body parts as good story-telling, so I'm not sure I follow your logic?

I usually find such things quite distracting from a story. Not just the button pushing of them, but they are usually just plain silly in context at best.

I just mean to say that since we've seen many instances of that kind of ultra-violence of late, the word A-hole shouldn't be so shocking, disturbing or distracting. (although I guess it still is)

Unnecessary, mostly, but yeah... distracting.

Okay, I get it, Turpin's doing the "bad cop" beatdown shtick. And if it wasn't The Great Grant writing, his timid "editor" probably would've cleaned it up.

This is just too much New Gods / Apokolips for me. I just saw Darkseid die in Countdown and now here he is, plotting the takeover of Earth. I can't get over that mother of all continuity glitches.

The second issue was a little better than the first one, the fact that I have no idea who all those bnad Gods are nonewithstanding. I dare to say though that this Miniseries won't be among the big ones people will still be talking about in the far future.

Anyone else read FINAL CRISIS: REQUIEM?

I think it was quite moving, but I didn't quite buy into it because I don't *really* think that J'onn isn't coming back.

But I'm less certain than I was.

I liked the central idea of a telepath from a telepathic race passing on their knowledge/history/personality. In this case, the five recipents (Superman, Batman, Wonder Woman, Gypsy and Black Canary) now call themselves guardians of Mars.

How long will *that* last? And will it impact the futures of these characters? Or is it a nice ceremonial beat we read now and are expected to forget in two months' time?

The sight of the mourners being transported to Mars by the Green Lanterns was an impressive one.

The writing reminded me of the funeral of Sue Dibny, which was the highpoint of IDENTITY CRISIS for me (I know some think that story *had* no high points- but I disagree).

*didn't read it*1

Uh... why those five? Gypsy, definitely. Batman, I can understand. But how do the other three make any sense? (beyond DC's insistence that Superman, Batman & Wonder Woman be involved in everything...)

And I think "ceremonial beat/quickly forgotten" is pretty certain.

Substitute Green Lantern for Wonder Woman and you'd be right. (I know DC wants to brainwash us into thinking of the "Trinity" as one, but no, Wonder Woman wasn't included)

The choices kinda make sense to me, though Black Canary would've made more sense if she were still one of the League's founders. (which I don't think she is anymore)

I am now totally waiting for the story where the "guardians of Mars" find themselves compelled to come together (like the 4 Cylons in BSG) and do something that ends up bringing J'onn back from the dead. (Preferably a few years from now at least)

So what exactly is the current storyline called? I know there was some lead-ins to Final Crisis but I'm not clear what all and in what order?

The library finally got in copies of the "Infinite Crisis" trade. My most immediate thought is "why?"

Reading a dialogue between creators included at the end, it seems at least in their minds they created a great work of comic art. They got woodies over a head being popped off? That's desperate. Crisis was a great read, without any of that. And like the results or not, it was pertinent and emotional (at least for me).

Also in the dialogue were comments about a scene bringing Legion in from the future to fight Superboy Prime, a scene dropped. Is this the reasoning behind this Legion of 3 Worlds, so that someone can realize this fight even though the Final Crisis is over?

Superboy Prime? Blah and double blah. I guess because it's "Superboy" we're supposed to be all OMG over this baddie but in general, he's uninteresting to me. I've not been given any reason to empathize with the character, it seems they thought there would be "shock value" in this? They already spent that when they cloned Superman.

???

Conner's death was a good comic death IMO and not being a cloneboy fan, I was happy to see him go. The Teen Titans massacre was so silly I was giggling. The Freedom Fighters somewhat better though I didn't realize Bizarro was all that violent. I guess I just read the books where he's kind of goofy.


I'm reading the "companion" now (not bad) and have the second volume of 52, which is hard for me to get into.

Thank you, that's correct. I guess DC's grouping the three together has seeped into my subconscious. Ack!

Should ROGUES' REVENGE be discussed here or get its own thread?

It is a FINAL CRISIS tie-in...

...and, as such, joins REQUIEM as being about three times as entertaining as the 'main' series.

It was a treat seeing Johns and Kolins reunited on a Flash/Rogues title set in Keystone City. In the rain and lightning associated with... well, we'll see if the 'with' is what we all think it is, given what's happening in FC.

Here, we see the return of a beaten-down, tired group of wanderers. This group-- Captain Cold, Heat-Wave, Mirror Master and Weather Wizard-- are, I think, the best-characterized villain group in comics. Individually and even collectively, they may not be the most powerful or effective. But they're the most human, most readable, most specific guys.

At least when they're written as they are here, as opposed to the issues where Bart Allen was killed. Said crime's haunting them is the tentpole of the plot.

Pied Piper, who'll always both be and not be a Rogue, gets good play here, as well. His role in REVENGE will be one I look forward to reading.

What I'm not looking forward to reading is more of this Axel Walker TRICKSTER. I loathe this character and did before James Jesse was killed in COUNTDOWN. I want to see him returned to the Trickster role (actually, coming back from the dead and having a new, spiritual type of schtick would befit the name 'Trickster', wouldn't it?). At the *least* I hope Piper gives this Axel person one heck of a beatdown.

Iris West, Professor Zoom, Inertia (now Kid Zoom?) and some old detective friends from Johns' last FLASH run make appearances, as well.

No Flash book published since Johns left the title has seemed like a 'Flash' book to me. It was nice to read on again.

Geoff Johns' run on Flash is one of the favorites in my entire collection and Kolins' work particularly stands out. Run Riot, Kolins' work on Grodd made that character so believably real.

I think I may take you up on this tip. I didn't know they killed Trickster. He beat Hell once, maybe he can beat Heaven?

By the way, does anybody know why there had to be even more new Superheroes in FC #2? The japanese ones? Isn't the DC universe confusing and convoluted enough without adding ten new characters every event?

I really totally lost the "overview" about what's going on in the DCU. Maybe that's because I never bothered to read any Superman, Batman or Flash books over the last 15 years - so the only recent developments I know about in the non-Legion world is Green Lantern.

But shouldn't a major crossover book be accessible to any reader? And if they have to throw that many new characters (and old ones in new costumes) at us, why can't they at least do some kind of roll call? Reading DC is no longer fun... neither is Marvel, but at least they are starting with a "What happened before" synopsis again...

LINDA IS BACK : Joeboy is happy
Reign in hell <3

Wow, no comments on FC #3, yet?

Well, spoiler-free, I'd have to say this issue is a turn in the right direction, as most of the disparate plot threads are coming together. A lot of nice moments, and it's starting to make some sense.

Seems, in a way, like four more issues won't be enough to resolve everything, though. Yeah, there're the spin-offs and such, but I'd hate to think I'd have to pick them all up to understand everything because I'm not!

Any,how each subsequent issue is better than the last, so that's a good thing!

It's a Grant Morrison story. That always gives me pause. Not that I don't like it, but I get more out of it in one sitting than spread across months (and cross over titles.)

It had some interesting moments with The Question. The super hero draft seemed odd since they always round up the heroes in these cross overs; like they need a reason to gather.

The Wonder Woman/Mary Marvel throw down was nice, but would seem a bit odd if not for Mary's story in Countdown.

The Flash subplot gives us a plausible reason for skipping a month and having the interim stories in all the crossovers.

And Jones' artwork is always a pleasure to behold.

An odd observation, but has anyone noticed that the coloring seems "off" in FC #3?

Perhaps I'm crazy, but as I was reading it, I kept feeling like "Wow, the art in this seems really flat," then I noticed the odd color choices.

It seems like every two pages or so a different "plate" of color is missing. I don't have the book in front of me to do a full page by page breakdown, but I certainly remember that the hospital scene with Clark and Lois seemed to have no magenta in the composition.

Just me?