Legion World Forums LEGION COMPANION Dr. Gym'll's Cultural Rarities Countdown

Looks like at least one of them might be. Or at least operating in some quasi-heroic capacity.

I'm enjoying this storyline the most in COUNTDOWN's early days.

Though I'm more curious about the Ray Palmer stuff.

The multiple worlds is exciting and somewhat worrying. DC could *really* screw things up here.

The Monitors need some names or something. They're beginning to be a bit tedious in their slight physical differences.

Sort of like the Wanderers and Terror Firma, exasperating in their anonymity.

Seeing some nameless figures arguing about universal purity isn't very engaging. It's almost breaking that fourth wall, since a lot their comments have been repeated in the CBS since the first Crisis. Sort taking the baton from the Supernova story in 52, this is likely going to be the least interesting story for me.

The Rogues are sort of wasted here. All their powers and skill, and they are torturing money from an old guy? I really enjoyed John's "Rogue War" story in FLASH a couple of years back, so I'm looking forward to seeing them shine here.

Jimmy Olsen bores me. The New Gods have never really grabbed me either. Seeing Jimmy become one of the new New Gods is going to be my least favourite storyline.

The Jason Todd plot could be interesting. I don't like him, and the idea of his redemption is revolting. But how it plays out would certainly make for an exciting, and gripping story.

And Mary Marvel- this is going to rock! The solicit for August, with her in Black, has me tingling. The Black Adam confrontation will be a hoax- it has to be.

Hm. Read the first three issues now and though I am not very excited about it, I probably will keep on getting it... because...

- Unlike 52, Countdown has a very 80s like feeling to me, resembling the original Crisis a little bit. I also like the fact that the big guns are going to appear in this book. 52 was too much about characters I never heard about in 20+ (!!!) years of reading DC comic books.

- I have always like the Multiverse and am quite sure we will be getting some looks into the new parallel worlds

- I definitely have the feeling that we will be reading about the classic Legionnaires (not only Karate Kid) in the pages of Countdown. I won't miss any important developments concerning my all-time favorites

What I did not like was the fact that Jason Tood seems to be getting a whole lot of "screen time". To me, Jason Todd remains dead even if he is jumping in my face.

I also don't care much about the Flash rogues - I never was a Flash guy even as a kid.

I also hate the fact that there seem to be about 500 characters flowing around in the DCU and you have to know them all to get the whole story. I hated this in 52, and I fear that there will be many moments again in Countdown when I'm reading it - and then I'm suddenly totally out of touch with what's happening. They certainly should be adding some "What happened before" chapter every now and then...

I was prepared to dislike Countdown (and reserve the right to do in the future), but against my will I enjoyed the first 3 issues. Flash's rogues have been very entertaining. Jimmy's been fun. Mary Marvel seems promising. Overall, the character work here seems better than much of 52.

The Monitors need numbers atleast. They call themselves Brother 19 or something???

Mystery Lad, I agree that DC can really mess things up if they don't control it. I can see issues arising with the Hawkman of Earth 24 which in time can complicate the other Earths. Trust me we've seen it.

To me Jason Todd is dead as well...but part of me is pulling for him. I have to admit I'm interested. The prodigal son and all of that.

To be honest, this hasn't grabbed me the way 52 did off the bat. I have to disagree with the majority of my fellow posters and say that while I understand that these three issues are mainly set-up, they've been kind of flat. I do have high hopes though and its still good enough to keep buying, but I demand nothing but excellence and make no apologies for it

That said, I'm glad for the inclusion of Piper and Trickster, and hope that there is indeed a plan, to go along with their past 15+ years or so of history, especially John's Rogues War. I hope Piper is indeed on the side of the angels, but I'd prefer Trickster to be somewhat more blurry. Not a 'villian', but definately not a hero by a long-shot. I feel like we'll see that. The Rogues are my favorite of DC's villains, only outmatched by Spider-Man in all of comics. Mirror Master was great. Weather Wizard was actually in character by saying so little--he's more interested in the ladies.

Karate Kid (the real one) is intriguing, and that he *is* the real one makes his storyline a personnal favorite.

Glad to see Madame Xanadu and suddely Black Adam again. Mary's story is moving slowly right now, and I'm almost ambivalent towards the character, so I'm interested in a blank-slate sort of way on where she's going.

So far, Jimmy's story has intrigued me the most, except for the utterly ridiculous notion that he might know any Robin's identity--which better be cleared up ASAP.

The Monitors are interesting me and I can't wait to see Ray Palmer. Really hoping to see Ion and Donna make their entrance into the main story too! The New Gods as well.

Jason Todd...I reserve the right to applaud gleefully should you be butchered before our eyes.

About Trickster-- maybe there'll be a plot twist wherein Piper and Trickster are *both* working against the Rogues (Piper for some Flash or other, Trickster for Mr. Bones?), with each suspecting/working against the other.

Didn't Didio or someone hint that Neron wouldn't *always* be imprisoned? Which would probably hack off some Elongated Man fans, but I don't think Ralph really died to imprison Neron-- he died to rejoin Sue.

Anyway, if and/or when Neron shows up again, James Jesse's gonna have some 'splainin to do (assuming previous bargains with Neron hold true post-imprisonment).

Maybe we could a Molly Mayne story out of Neron's return, too... (Her role in UNDERWORLD UNLEASHED was the best part of it-- along with Trickster's).

I would've preferred *not* to see Black Adam for a few months, but I can't blame DC for striking hot irons.

Mary Marvel apparently receiving (stealing?) Adam's power is a storyline I'm looking forward to-- the cover looks great.

Jimmy Olsen is the most puzzling character, so far. Stretching, super-speed, knowing people's ID's he's not supposed to know... *what* is up with the cub reporter?

Donna and Ion-- I wish they weren't linked together, as their 'coupledom' is the least interesting thing about each of them... and something I don't want to see revisited. I don't really understand how Nightwing falls in 'their' category, either.

So, when's somebody going to start searching for Ray Palmer?

More and more, I'm thinking those promo pieces were artistic and not representational of the story. I'm not expecting to see Piper and Trickster literally handcuffed together and on the run.

We might see Piper and Trickster save the Flash though. Cause things are not sounding good for the latest Flash.

Brian Hibbs on sales of Countdown in his shop: http://www.comixexperience.com/savblog/2007/06/my-first-thought-of-day.html

[NB: Reminding you that chart estimates are of sales to North American comic shops, not sales in comic shops]

Okay, maybe I missed this, but HOW can Black Adam have his powers? Capt Marvel stripped Adam of his powers at the end of 52 and changed the access word from Shazam to something else that Adam would "never figure out."

Now he's back a couple weeks after 52 ends with everything just fine (albeit without wife, family and home). What's up with that?

he found Isis's Scarab

:WTF:

That would be way funny if, in order to change to Black Adam, he had to say "Oh Mighty Isis". A little something about zephyr winds would be cool too

I'm very disappointed with Countdown so far. I may just drop the comic book if it doesn't get better. I give it three more weeks to hook me.

These first few issues are a bit padded, but I'm liking the story. Jimmy's story didn't get much advancement (certainly nothing I hadn't already figured out.) Mary's big moment this issue would have fit much better with Jimmy's big moment. The Trickster/Piper conversation was good, getting me more interested in these two. And the Holy Gibson story started off well.

I'm not giving up on the series yet, but they do need to pick it up a bit.

I'm a Lightray fan. I hope he's all right. You know I'm starting to echo others...this is losing me a bit. It's a tad boring. This is the first issue I noticed it.

Da Ordster weighs in on Mary Marvel's part in Countdown.

I take contention with the comments poo-pooing fans "knee-jerk" reaction to what is being hinted at with this or any character. Comics are a fan driven interactive medium still. If they weren't, then they would be all graphic novels, not monthlies.

Fans reaction to this is justified because there is a history of "creators" wanting to distort, not grow a character for what seems no more than eqo (cough Giffen, Byrnes cough).

This reaction puts the writers and if not the writers, the business people on notice that something is being hinted at here that's unacceptable.

Funny how some "fans" will poo-poo the reaction of others but fail to acknowledge they are simply attempting the same, to influence the direction of the story by putting what they hope will be weaker willed fans on the defensive for being sensitive to established canon. Instead of supporting the proposed "darker" direction, they attack those fans who wish the character's established persona to take the day. That's weak.

I weighed in on the Ordster's thoughts over there.

I honestly think Mary Marvel is going to come out of this as squeaky clean as possible.

But I think if DC wants to use the Marvel family in this DCU New Earth they need to update them. For all all the Marvel Family purists give them the Fawcett universe.

(the quote about what David and Giffen did or wanted to Mary Marvel is a bit disturbing...i agree with Jerry there)

In the novel Superfolks, Mary Marvel had been raped or something awful like that. I found it distasteful, although it fit in with the overall degeneration of that story. At this point, we've had so much of that stuff that a dark Mary story is just sort of a yawn.

I've flipped through the Countdown issues (not the latest) but haven't purchased them. The idea of people being in the wrong universe is captivating, but the story just doesn't grab me much. Those monitors are sure boring!

This should be a graemlin!

Well said, BB. Very well said.

After reading Morrison's 7 Soldiers, where he basically handed us a critique on the degeneration of super-heroes and super-heroines (especially the latter), particulurly the unneccesary 'sexing up' of icons, I can't help but create a comparison to all future attempts to do so. So if Mary's story is basically going to give us a chance to see her brought to her lowest point, in a way to exemplify the industry trend of the last thirty years, well, that's all well and good, but its already been done, done recently, and done quite well.

I'm not opposed to such a story, but it had better be damn exciting and interesting to justify yet another attempt at it.

Here's another difference b/t Countdown and 52. I like all of the Countdown writers, and I trust Dini because of Detective, Bedard b/c of Crossgen, GrayPal b/c of multiple things, etc. But I trusted in Grant (and a lesser extent Geof, Mark and Greg) to 'WOW' me with mind-blowing stories that pay homage to the past but 'move the DCU forward'. I have no reason to have that kind of trust right now, though I hope it can be earned.

Cobie- I have to disagree with you there. Whoever the writers are shouldn't have any bearing on how you read the story or what kind of leeway you give them. Back when we all fell in love with comics, we didn't know who wrote what.

Ah, Forerunner a new name for the new Harbinger?