Legion World Forums LEGION CLUBHOUSE The Legion of Super-Heroes Long Live the Legion! Let's Talk About LSH #4 (potential spoilers)...

As usual, we'll start with the solicitation...

Written by Mark Waid; Art by Leonard Kirk, Dave Gibbons and Mick Gray; Cover by Barry Kitson and Gray

The hot new series continues with the Invisible Kid at a crossroads in a story featuring guest art by Leonard Kirk (BLOODHOUND) and inker Mick Gray! A hero is defined by the choices he makes — but not everyone is cut out to be a hero. Just ask the Invisible Kid, whose fateful decision inadvertently costs the Legion every bit of the good will the team has earned and radically endangers its future. Plus, a second Legion adventure with art by comics legend Dave Gibbons (WATCHMEN, THE ORIGINALS) and Gray!

DC Universe | 40pg. | Color | $2.99 US

On Sale March 30, 2005

And now...a link to the cover:

http://dccomics.com/comics/cm_popup.php?i=2773

...more later!

Didn't anyone pick it up during lunch? What's taking so long?

I read it last week.

But I'll wait to someone has an issue in their hands to talk about it.

Picked it up and read it over lunch. As usual, another stellar issue though I have to say I really missed Kitson's pencils here. For whatever reason, art has always been a secondary concern to me (unless it's really bad, and this definitely isn't bad), but the lack of Kitson really stood out to me.


**** SPOILERS ABOUND - TRAVEL AT YOUR OWN RISK ***


Anyway there's no more in this book on Dirk's
leaving than there was in the preview. After the SP's break in the story takes off in a different direction.

Apparently youthreg 101.72 has been on the books for a while, and the SP's are just using it to make life miserable for the Legionnaires. Specifically, Lyle's dad is using it. He not only wants Lyle back, he wants Lyle's invisibility serum for the SPs to help confront the worsening invasion on the Rimworlds. Brainy apparently didn't mention Lyle's connection to the SP's to anyone, and Lyle hasn't mentioned it either. Cos thinks this is really funny (not). So the Brainy/Cos tension escalates a little more.

After holding back initially, Cos orders what amounts to an assault on SP headquarters so he can talk this over with the Powers That Be, and tells Lyle to "Just do something smart." And Lyle does, though I won't spoil that bit. Cos seems to have considerable clout, aside from the obvious attacking part, with the UP.

All the usual great interaction between characters, especially Brainy/Cos and Lyle/Lyle's dad. I suspect the public at large isn't going to be real thrilled when whatever's going on with the Rimworlds starts to spill over. I wouldn't mind seeing some reference to the info that must be coming out of Naltor.

We do find at that Lyle's got normal Coluan level smarts - that makes Brainy, Dirk and Lyle all noted brains. I like the sense of intelligence that seems to pervade the Legion. I was happy when UB instantly realized that Lyle's power had some interesting limits, but there don't seem to be any dummies in the Legion.

I like the ending to the first story quite a bit. It was completely unexpected (though it really shouldn't have been in retrospect) and very warm. Again, I won't spoil it here.

And that warm feeling set me up for the second story with KK and Tinya. The story is really a focus on Tinya, but through KK's eyes. Almost coaxed a tear out of me at the end. For both KK and Tinya. I will say that Tinya's power, like TG's is manifesting very differently than the old PG's. This group of Legionnaires really do have a different feel to them. There seems to be a focus in the isolation created by their uniqueness moreso than a celebration of their powers. I probably need to give that a bit more thought...

Edited to add: Best funny line in the book comes from Cos, ordering everyone to SP HQ:

"Along the way, you are to defend yourselves at all costs, but you are not to take any egregiously aggressive action against the enemy.

That means you, Ultra Boy."

I'm a little more cool to this issue than the previous ones. I am a little intrigued by Magistrate Lemnos or whatever the title was. The name seems a little anagram-ish to me... He looks to be a power player in the UP though, so I guess we'll be seeing more of him. The story makes me think more than ever that the sneak in the Titans crossover wasn't official continuity. The Brainy/Cos subplot is moving along nicely but I look forward to seeing an issue in the future that really engages the full team.

I wasn't totally thrilled with the PG/KK story... I don't know if I look forward to seeing PG doing weird random stuff around HQ from now on, but it was interesting to see at least one current Legionnaire in a relationship outside the team.

Put your thinking cap back on Matt. Praetor Lemnos is similiar to another 'anagram' used in a classic Legion story. It may just be a red herring but then again it may not.

I thought the same thing LL, but I hope that's not the case (unless of course there is a SON )

OK, it doesn't seem like some people picked out what I found to be something very interesting on page 5. "Colossal Boy. Homeworld: Earth". He's from Earth! How the heck is that possible? Maybe Waid really is going to tie Gim's people into the Biblical giants!

so, what do you all make of Colossal Boy/Micro Lad's homeworld being listed as EARTH on the roll call page? Is this:

a) an error? he is still listed as being a giant with the power to shrink to six feet, after all.

b) indicative that he is still of an alien race, but just happened to be born on Earth - which begs the question, where would this giant alien race live on Earth where they could be at their regular size and not have to exercise their powers?

c) indicative that maybe he's lying about his origins? the issue stresses that Lyle and Brainy have been keeping things from Cos, so maybe Gim is lying too? and there's a fairly extended riff on Micro Lad's annoyance about being called Colossal Boy - in fact this has been mentioned more than anything else in the series so far, maybe he's protesting too much? I can't think of why he would go to the trouble, though... wild speculation - maybe, similar to Lyle's story, his origins are tied into the Science Police (they were preboot, after all), and he's a plant by them to infiltrate the Legion?

thoughts?

b

You think so? Yeah, I want the guy back, but not as a villain!

Well as Vee mentioned, maybe he has a son who has to set things right?

And I didn't even notice the Micro Lad 'error' on the roll call page. I passed it right over last week. Now I'll have to read the whole issue closer.

I thought this issue was much better than the last one. ( I did enjoy #3, except for TG's lame origin) At least the main story was. Lyle has retained his intelligence even though he did hide his secret from Cos. I would not want to be on the bad end of Cos's wrath as Lyle found out. Good catch on the Micro Lad from Earth. I too wonder if this is part of the apparant division in the team. (Gim is on Brainy's team) Is he lying or is it a mistake? I hope Barry can clear this up for us. I liked the bit with Gim and Cham. Good to see Jo is still a hothead! I enjoyed the artwork this issue. To be honest, I didn't even realize that Barry didn't draw the story until around page 8 or 9. Good job Leonard Kirk!! I could have done without the back story as it focuse on my least favorite, PG. Her new origin is very lame like Lu's. I guess Mark wants to make everyone different in some way, but these two power changes really stink! That is one of the main problems with doing a reboot. Old favorites are not themselves. Jan has to touch to transmute, there are a million Lus, PG is a ghost in two worlds at once, etc. Sorry, Mark! The back story could have explored more on Val and left out the boring PG. I hope she is the one to leave for good. All in all, I enjoyed the issue and am looking forward to the rimworld storyline heating up. I wish they wouldn't put characters on the cover (Nura, Garth) that aren't in the story.

I'm actually annoyed by Phantom Girl's new status quo. Partly because it's too similar to Dream Girl in that there's another female Legionnaire walking around seeming like a ditz because her mind is constantly divided between two realities. Another is that she's living two lives and the short doesn't go into many of the real complications that can arise from her dual existence. The same questions I had when the preview pages came out are still valid, I think (especially the bathroom one)-- I'll wait to post them again later to see if anyone else had the same reaction.

Drake I haven't read it but I understand the frustration. I've always been a big fan of PG...she may be my favorite female member next to Violet. It's difficult watching characters that were well rounded and strong go back to an earlier part of their development. It's part of the problem I have with yet starting again.

This book needs a female that is either super strong or can blast something with rays. I'm suprised Invisible Kid isn't a girl.

Ohwell atleast Lournu had a very cool orign and I was suprised by that.

I agree now on the bathroom thing, actually. I didn't expect the rest of the story to confirm that she "defaults" to simultaneous existence in both worlds, but it did. She even remained visible here when she...had a really good reason to be as tangible as possible in Bgztl, which was odd.

I don't have the issue in front of me, but there was a line about her being visible in both unless she was fully in one or the other, so she does have some control over her privacy. Perhaps she was just distracted in the scene with the significant other, and her concentration lapsed.

Happens to the best of us...

Was anyone bothered by the scene in which Lyle's parentage is revealed? I sure was!

It just didn't feel right for a couple of reasons:

1) Brainy comes across as a real a**hole in this scene. His spiteful revelation to Cos about Lyle's father shows exactly how much of a jerk this version of B5 really is. I like him less and less each issue.

2) Cos reprimanding Lyle for keeping the secret just felt wrong also. He SHOULD have exploded at Brainy. It was apparent that this was something Briany knew all along not something he had just discovered. Brainy is who recruited Lyle in the first place! With all the antagonism between Rokk and Querl that we've seen, it would make more sense to me that Rokk's anger would have spewed in Brainy's direction for witholding the info, not at Lyle.

This entire scene grated on my nerves!

Someboy spill for me! Just PM me please cause I don't see it!

Cosmic Boy was a standout for me. I've never seen him as such a force to be reckoned with. I never thought of him as being able to kill with his power, unless of course he dropped a car on you. I'm liking this A-type Cos. He's so much more effective than the brooding Cos of previous timelines.

Phantom Girl - I get the impression that her powers have not totally developed. Maybe I'm wrong, but I thought she could be totally present in our reality only with great concentration. I would expect it to become easier for her as time goes on. As for her default state, I would expect that when she is not using her power at all, it would be her home universe.

Karate Kid - I don't have LSH #4 in front of me, but did he describe himself as EuroAmerican? I thought he was Eurasian. His coloring would suggest that he might be Indian, Thai, or Filippino.

Invisible Kid - He's young, isn't he. I like his independence. I can also see why Brainy really likes him and am looking forward to this friendship based on respect for superior intellect developing. Lyle might also teach Brainy about the value of certain human characteristics.

Everyone continues to develop their own individual personality. I really appreciate that. Lyle's, Cos's, and Brainy's reactions all seemed so unique to themselves instead of just being words pasted in to carry the plot along.

I may want to continue liking/disliking characters based on what had developed of them in previous incarnations, but, more and more, it seems like I can't count on those.

So, Praetor Lemnos isn't Nura's mystery man is he? That was my first thought at seeing him, but I just didn't get motivated enough to get issue 2 out of storage and check.

Micro-lad's consternation continues to amuse. And I loved Triplicate Girl's line--which I can't exactly remember now, or I'd quote it. I'm certainly curious about what Sun Boy has up his sleeve. It's weird that Phantom Girl doesn't completely phase into one dimension or the other more regularly. Maybe she just needs to concentrate to do so. Regardless, I don't expect the point to be harped-on in future issues.

I do hope we get a better view of this evil war thing on the rimworlds in the next issue. I've had enough of the hinting.

I greatly miss Barry's artwork. His pencils create a pantomime story that often eclipses the text itself. Hurry back, Barry. Despite the reverence I hold for my Grell/Cockrum collection, Barry's legionnaires are becoming "the Legion" to me. Without Barry's faces, the characters are just costumes with speech bubbles.

Cos and Brainiac are equally grating to me. Magnetic bullying, intellectual bullying, they could both use a session with Dr. Phil -- nevertheless, they make good comic book characters.

Maybe it's time to speed up the geologic pace of the story of the growing rimworld threat and the introduction of characters. It was kind of cute having Lightning Lad and Saturn Girl out of the picture at the beginning of the series, but jeez, we're approaching the half-year mark for this series.

I was severely disappointed in this issue. Didn't care for the art and the story was lacking too imo.

I thought Cos's beef with Lyle was WAY over dramatized. So he didn't tell them his dad was an SP officer. Not the heinous treason Rokk made it out to be imo.

Also thought the PG story was lame. The "what is she doing?" scenes were silly and I thought she was very rude to both Val and Jarel by not giving either of them her full attention. She even criticized Jarel for closing her out while she was listening to Val with one ear.

I also don't see how Gim could be from Earth and yet also from a race of giants. Does every Legionnaire's planet of origin HAVE to stay what it was preboot? Don't really see that every single character's origin needs retelling either, especially when the new origins aren't as believable as the old ones. I thought both PG's and TG's were really lame.

I agree with you on this! PG has never been a favorite and I don't see liking her any better this go around. She was actually rude to two people on two different planets at the same time.


Again, I agree. I said it in my post that TG and PG had very lame stories! Triad WAS one of my favorite characters and now she seems hokey! Who needs a million Lus running around and a girl that looks like she is crazy on two planets at once. They would have been better left alone. If it ain't broke, why are you going to stick a lame patch on it?

I really liked this issue. I wasn't as good as #2 or #3, but it was still really good. I really like what Waid has done with Lyle. It seems like his character is slowly growing out of his shy shell. And I love that Waid is showing just how smart he is.

And I liked PG's new origin. It was fun.

The SP was attacking the Legion. I thought that Cosmic Boy's anger was justified. Especially since this was a situation that could've been prevented.

Cos is very military! I wonder if his story will include some special training - he's a leader, a drill sergeant, a disciplinarian AND a string-puller who can smooth things out with the UP.

I agree with Vee that Cos should have been particularly angry with Brainy for concealing Lyle's SP connection - B5 has spent the last three issues calculating the odds of things happening, so he must have known that there would be some showdown with the SP. Maybe he's forcing some issue, putting pressure on Cosmic Boy.

Cos' anger with Lyle is understandable, I think - especially if he's concerned about infiltration or sabotage. Remember when they brought the giant robot head into the HQ, his first reaction was to have it checked out for sabotage.

At this point, I can't say I much like either Cos or Brainy, but they're certainly interesting. The look on Brainy's face when Cos sent everyone to the SP headquarters was pretty good.

Lyle's father was an interesting character, as well - split between using his son (for his own advancement as well as the good of the SPs?) and showing concern for him.

Is Xanthu a Quaker planet? Why can't Star Boy fight (according to Light Lass)?

It looked to me like Lemnos was the guy in Nura's dream - if the legionnaires don't recognize him, he could be holding some clandestine position - like head of black ops or running a shadow government - or a hooded inquisitor type, if a Praetor is still the guy dishing out the "justice" in the 31st century.

Dirk's parents are fun. Obsessed, but not overbearing like a stage mom. They must be taking some personal risks by sheltering Lyle, as well - even if the youth reg was suspended. They're walking the walk, and I hope we see more of them.

The Phantom Girl-KK story was a nice classic romance comic story. Broken hearts! Disappointments! Unattainable love for the girl who walks in two worlds! I wonder if Brainy forget to tell Tinya that she's visible in both worlds and should remember to avoid embarrassing situations...? I liked the pastel architecture and winter coats & hats on Bgtzl, while the flowers were blooming. But now we have two sometimes-spacey females on the team...