Legion World Forums LEGION CLUBHOUSE The Legion of Super-Heroes Long Live the Legion! LSH #40 ... SPOILERS!

There was one line that got me curious during the big Twolf/Saturn Girl blowout. When Garth was telling Brin that it was his call and Brin basically saying Garth wouldn't do anything about it no matter what he said. Garth line about "Legionaries have been expelled for less". Does that mean that maybe a few preboot members have been part of this Legion in the past and kicked off the team for one reason or another? We know that Wildfire/Erg 1 was with the team in the past before they thought him killed, and that line makes me think there might be others.

It would be an interesting thing to follow up on if they ever show the orgin of this version of the Legion.

I really enjoyed this issue, though I have some qualms about feral Timber Wolf. I didn't understand everyone referring to him as a maniac and a killer. Have we seen anything to support that? I was especialy baffled by Brainy calling T-Wolf a maniac, since it seems so at odds with Brainy using Brin to run errands and whatever past connection there seemed to be between them.

I'm hoping some of this is a ploy. The whole issue with Saturn Girl getting a "last warning" reminds me of classic Legion stories where characters are expelled as part of setting them up to infiltrate villains. Of all the Legionnaires who could easily infiltrate the UP, Saturn Girl would be an obvious choice because of her mom. So maybe the Imra/Brin conflict is designed to set the stage for one or both to be "expelled."

My excitement for Shooter's lessened quicker than I hoped after the first two issues. They were fun, but something wasn't clicking for me. I enjoyed this issue more than the last, but I was still a little underwhelmed story-wise. The art was still solid, I'm just miffed on where everything is going.

Brainy's personaltiy did seem to leave behind the 'Vril Dox' ways. I recall noticing that before I even logged onto the board, much like when Imra's butt first jiggled with some iron again. I'm a fan of either personality, so I'm fine with him here.

It was great seeing other Legionnaires again, as well as some of their relationship points. I couldn't help but notice Jo trying to get between Brin and Tinya. It's the first Jo/Tinya interaction I recall seeing this boot.

While I don't love Projectra Hilton, I'm typically fine with her. She's had some charming moments since Shooter took over and the first two issues I really pitied her for her plight. By now though I'm starting to feel a little clubbed over the head with her situation more than any other plot point. I imagine Jeckie feels that way too.

Having to rely on telepathy solely for communication, I can see how this Imra could more easily lose control and interefere with someone mentally. She has contact in some degree with everyone, especially constantly broadcasting more than receiving. When she's intentionally manipulative though? I felt she did get off a little easy, even with Garth as her surprising executioner to Brin's judge.

Randomly, I hope we get a mission to Cargg sometime. I've wanted to see Lu make a trip home ever since we were first reintroduced to it.

i'm hoping that the focus on projecta is going to lead up to something to really good, other wise i'm getting tired if it, its kinda not all that interesting

The consequence for Imra in Legion Lost was that everyone distrusted here and they were in very close quarters so they couldn't get away from each other - here she can simply walk away, and her controlling someone has had no impact whatsoever. Timber Wolf being angry seems to be part of his feralisation, not just on that issue alone.

If Legionnaires have been expelled for less, why has she gotten away with something worse?

And if she's promised not to go into his head again, didn't she immediately break that promise by telling him she wouldn't telepathically?

I suppose it's the difference between communicating, which she can only do telepathically, and controlling.

Why has she gotten away with something worse? Because she's essential to the team? Favoritism? Perhaps the legionnaires were overly hasty in the past when they expelled someone and now have better guidelines for what's right and wrong. In any event, sounds like a future story about who got expelled.

The Projectra sub-plot is one of the most interesting developments. It's not just the complexities of the character, but the political and economic questions which arise from her story. I'm thinking now that the bracelet she took was perhaps her own bracelet, repossessed by creditors and placed for sale at Rothschild's (which sounds more classy than Emporium of Excellence). So in her own mind, it wasn't shoplifting a bauble, it was taking back what was hers.

I suspect - or would like to see - that she has been victim of overzealous creditors, fraudulent accountants and corrupted U.P. officials and has been illegally deprived of her fortune - and rights. She might not regain enough to become Legion benefactor again, since Orando, the source of her income, is toast.

It certainly is good to see Brainy more sociable - but still annoying people.

you know what i wouldn't mind it soo much if this was the only political thing happening but from the very start, but with this legion alot of it has to do with political backlash there very first issue had to do with treaty's.

as i stated early i am sick of the Up, interfering with the legion, it just feels that there shoving more of it down our throats with the sub plot

on a side note about the princess, for her being one she seams not to know how to handle the political circus, she acts like a really spoiled child

But that's exactly what she is, right?

good point. Projectra seems to be used to the privileges of rank and position, but has not shown any political sophistication. given how high handed she as been with mere commoners on Earth, I shudder to think how she treated people on Orando.

now contrast Projectra's attitude and ineptitude with that of Shadow Girl. she is in effect the Head of State for Talok VII and she has used that before(during the Wild Fire arc). and for a warrior Shady seems to be far better at interpersonal relations than Projectra.

I don't get that at all. Projectra, Timber Wolf, Light Lass and Karate Kid all have been portrayed as nothing like the original version.

I sort of feel like trying to explain many of the characters' reactions to things.

Brainy actually needs the other Legionnaires, and since they have limited resources now, he actually has to ...communicate... with them in order to get things done. He started having to do that with Cos, he's been affected by the Dream Girl incident, so, he's coming along in that department.

Garth turned the comlink onto auto answer. That's why he was relaxed and able to handle the inter-personal issues with Imra/Brin and Brainy. Problem is... that was only a temporary fix, as we saw.

I love that Imra was publicly required to vow to stay out of everyone's head. She easily relented, but she was exhausted and in pain. How will she react to that vow once she's better and rested? Jim G.-- I love that it was Brin calling for Imra to help Jecky! And that he added the "please" on the end. Heh. Good boy, Brin!

That reminds me, one of the best things Manapul has done is change hairstlyes to make the legion of brown haired males look more distinct. Yeah, Brin's got kind of an animae look going on, but at least it fits his feral gig. Jo has his Coipel Coiff again, Gim has his classic side part back. Lyle looks like Lyle! Thank you Francis!

Back to Brin... he's been shown to have a distaste for the Legion, and to have a temper, so the fact that he's not fitting in very well is consistent.

I feel like Jecky's plight is taking kind of a lot of panels/pages. Let's wrap this up, eh?

I also feel like the alien destroyers are very generic. I hope something more interesting is going on there. I mean, I know we'll learn who they are and what they want, but I'm looking for a twist.

I allowed almost all of the post WaK issues to collect in a stack at the CBS before I bothered to go get them. I have not let that happen now that S&M are on board! That says something.

I dunno. I still feel as though I am looking for a character to really like and root for.

I'll give Shooter a grace period so he can ramp up his story, but I'm still waiting after 40 issues and 3 creative teams.

Of all that time, I think the only character that comes closest sometimes is Karate Kid. (And not because he was able to snag Ayla ). And I've never been a huge fan of Val's.

Most of the rest seem to be the Legion of Super Attitudes...

Hey, at least she's not ruling over a bunch of raccoons who make baby talk!

I couldn't agree more!

Projectra harping on about her royal situation - isn't that how she justified Nemesis Kid's death? She may be in a new *situation* but how is she essentially different to how she has been before (except, perhaps that she is being seen as *more* arrogant and it just being tolerated)

Timber Wolf as more feral and angry - wasn't that how he was portrayed originally, right when he was first introduced and was trying to fit into being human again (as opposed to thinking he was an android)? Furball anyone? Post Furball?

Light Lass - again, I don't see a whole lot that's different. What exactly is new? That she's a physical, sensual person? Don't we already know this? How's it different to the long-standing relationships with Brin and Vi? She just seems more open about it.

Karate Kid - calm, assured, spiritual martial artist. Isn't that how he's ALWAYS been portrayed? What's different this time? That he shared a bed with Ayla?

None of these things are BAD, it's just that I could see these things in back issues - I look for something new and exciting in my comics. Granted, it doesn't always happen, but it makes for a better read when it does. It just seems like these characters are VERY familiar, and don't seem like that different a take on what has gone before. Maybe they're not supposed to be different and I'm missing the point entirely! Maybe I just expected more from the change of writer. Who knows? It's not going to stop me from reading about them!

hMMM maybe ayla, and this version of element lad also.

WHAT IF Brin called Imra for help at the end so when she arrives, he can physically assault her?
WHAT IF Projectra really did kill that tourist?
WHAT IF Garth suddenly got competent upon Imra's return because she's secretly manipulating him?
WHAT IF Francis gives us more nude/semi-nude Legionnaires?

1) I don't think Temper Wolf was faking.

2) if the tourist died of shock from seeing a scary illusion I suppose Projectra could be charged with manslaughter. it would depend on intent or whether or not there are psi laws on the books.

3) good possibility, or maybe the jock has a brain.

4) yes. even better if the female members have to go undercover in an illegal pillow fighting ring!

i can only think that that there is something behind the scenes corrupting the legionnaires. Projectra stealing and lying, now possibly killing... T Wolf being aggressive and out of control... SG controlling minds... perhaps it has something to do with these evolving killing machines that are popping up everywhere. but if so, we need to know. i don't know if i have the patience any longer for a 16 part epic that unfolds slowly. i really need these bad guys to show a motive or purpose, or at least to know if they are alive... and the LSH is killing them or not. so far the question hasn't been given even a pause my any character.
a promising start by Shoot/Man but things aren't moving quite fast enough for me. i want the new costumes already. i want the plot to advance. i want a reason to buy and read this series beyond tradition and loyalty. come on shooter and manapul! we're rooting for you!! next issue i need to learn something interesting about the ever-evolving life forms or i need a different plot or adversary.

That's a definite concern for me.

I don't think so. I think she may well have made an illusion that looked like she'd killed the tourist to scare them, and Brin fell for it.

If she seemed to whip out a knife and plunge it into the tourist, I could see everyone involved falling for it, including the tourist (particularly if her illusions include a tactile component, which they definitely seem to, since the guard she sent a giant serpent after was screaming about his legs**).

On the other hand, she could have accidentally killed someone by scaring them so bad that they had a heart attack (or the alien equivalent)...

** That's actually an interesting tidbit. Projectra can cause actual pain, which means that her 'illusions' could incapacitate someone pretty easily...

Gosh, I hope not. I want competent Garth to be the real thing, and not-competent Garth to be the result of three days without sleep and trying to handle a thousand calls a day.

I do suspect that Imra and Garth had a little unseen 'chat' while the others were arguing, 'though. But I don't think it was Imra pulling the strings, since she was clearly beat and distracted at the time, and I don't think she would have been at her best mind-manipulating.

Yes please. More out of costume Legionnaires is always good (and not just nude / semi-nude, I want to see them dressed to do other things, like play sports with each other, or go out on the town). Manapul is an artist who should be easily able to get them into other outfits and still have them be recognizable, unlike some other artists who made them all look exactly the same...

I rarely have carnal thoughts about comic book characters -- especially teenage ones -- but I do appreciate seeing the Legionnaires drawn so healthy and beautiful, like young gods Francis is doing a great job!

Garth manipulated by Imra? That's a devilish plot. I'd prefer to see him just adapting to the job or it becomes, as was posted above, Imra's Legion Lost story. That would have to end in her breakdown and/or her expulsion. The tension we have now over her use of powers is good, realistic but not extreme.

I'd agree that the semi-nude appearances are good, not only visually, but again adding to the realism of the characters. Also, I'd prefer to have the idea of real clothes that one puts on and takes off, rather than the concept of the flight ring instantly changing their clothing. That's probably stodgy 21st century thinking, but there you are.

You are reading my mind ... maybe you're even manipulating my day-to-day behaviour, forcing me to make bad decisions, like buying a giant iced latte at lunchtime. Out! Out! I say.

The closest thing I can think of to the Legion Clubhouse is an Olympic Village. I've known a couple of Olympic athletes and am convinced the the primary tests of physical endurance that go on for all but the top ranked high-profile competitors are tests of the bed springs in the dorms.

I agree that tangible clothing is better than flight ring dressing. Perhaps the transmatter cutback also could limit, indefinitely, the flight rings' ability to produce clothing.

Late to the party as always. I think Matthew E described this issue as the parts greater than the sum of the whole. I concur with that. From a plot perspective, very little moved forward in #40, but man, so much great character interraction.

This is, after all, our first read of Shooter/Manapul/Livesay's Brainiac 5. I feel like Brainy is back, shaking off the possession of Vril Dox's archived programming. Yes, he's still by far the smartest sentient in the room but that intelligence seems tempered, ever so slightly, by camaraderie, even if that bonhommie is mostly an opportunity for Querl to make his teammates hurl. Also, in the opening scene we see a Brainiac 5 who, while still arrogant, is perceptive enough to see the monster's behavior as deliberate rather than vainglorious.

The central scene where all our characters are together for the first time illustrates what's different (and good) about Shooter's Legion. For one thing, we see the Legionnaires enjoying each other's company. I feel like we haven't SEEN that since, oh, issue #3 or so. Next, we have a (now typical) argument between groups of Legionnaires over a very real dilemma -- should Saturn Girl have "tamped down" Timber Wolf? We saw this every other issue with Waid. Here, though, we see some of each Legionnaire's personality come out in their argument (where Waid's groups seemed arbitrarily divided). Also, the argument is legit--everyone has a legitimate point to make, and there is some sense of rudimentary listening. Most importantly, the argument is resolved through the exercise of actual leadership by Lightning Lad to reach a compromise and get everyone to move on. (Glad I wasn't the only one to notice the "coincidence" of Saturn Girl's return and Lightning Lad's improved leadership.) And where was Brainiac 5 in all this? Not egging on one or both sides to gain some momentary political advantage in the group. No, he's trying (and failing) to get the team to focus on the real problem -- the invading marauders. THAT'S the Brainiac 5 we all know and love. There's so much else that is just great in this issue from a character standpoint. For the first time in the 3 boot, all the characters are really coming alive.

Reading these issues gives me something of the feel of the early chapters of the Great Darkness saga. At that time, too, Levitz was taking characterization of the Legionnaires to a new level while a truly epic story began to unfold. It will be interesting to see if Shooter can build to something as fresh and exciting as the Great Darkness was all those years ago.

I was underwhelmed by this issue, but I'm still more than willing to give Shooter the benefit of the doubt on the assumption things will progress.

I liked the idea of Garth laying down the law on the Brin/Imra situation, and thought it was reasonably well executed, but it seemed liek an island that did not fit in the rest of the issue.

The Jeckie story appears to be the most interesting, and not just because it seems I was right about the pragmatic reasons for the UP's action aganist her.