Legion World Forums LEGION CLUBHOUSE The Legion of Super-Heroes Long Live the Legion! S and LSH #16

I liked this issue a lot, including the first five pages. As has already been noted in this thread, the characters are still in the process of maturing, and while their behavior is not always excusable, their defiance does have validity sometimes. I think there's shades of gray to the whole generational conflict, and I'll admit that I didn't see them immediately -- when I first read an issue of the threeboot, I had a very mixed reaction. But as the series has gone on, I've understood the whole point better.

This, along with the more traditional Legion stuff in the middle of the issue, and Supergirl's appearance towards the end...it all clicked for me. I think Mark and Barry should do a Supergirl Annual or Supergirl Special sometime, their portrayal of her is the best I've seen.

And I don't think there's any way this is just a dream...I think the real reason for Supergirl's presence is going to be quite interesting.

Yes, the series is definitely back on top form.

I thought that the attitude of the Legionnaires in the first scene and the police station rang pretty true. It's not nice, but some kids given power tend to act like that. It's the "Power and Responsibility" relationship that plays out in the early Spider-Man stories. Don't some of the scenes where the Legion tries to help only to be threatened with arrest evoke Spider-man?

The scene with Cham shows that he's not going to take UltraBoy's blowing off of the SPs at face value and he's going find out for himself. He's shown himself to be very curious that lovable alien glob of goo.

I think the problem with this issue is the writer, Waid or someone else...
Maybe the adult people believe in a new generation of young people acting like jerks, and the real world is different in many ways.
Not all the youngs hate the adults.
The legionnaires are heroes, people with education, and I can't believe in a Shadow Lass stolen glasses from a inocent citizen.
Again we have the wrong reboot....
Or maybe these is the Legion Of Rebels?
Only the art of Barry is wondeful!

Humph. Went to the comic shop today and they've just transfered their standing orders onto a new computer system. Anyway when they did that everyone who had 'Supergirl' in their pull list got 'Supergirl' *and* SLSH. However, everyone who had LSH on their pull list got... sweet FA. And because everyone who had Supergirl also got SLSH they ahd gone and sold out. Humph. So no Legion for me this week. They did say though that they'd probably get more copies (assuming there aren't any returns as well of course) so i should still get a copy but i am a bit miffed.

Bevis,

That stinks, hope you get your issue soon!

On a good note maybe all those "Supergirl" fans will be come Legion Fans!

Personally, I have already read the issue 3 times, and I hardly ever reread issues immediately. Maybe I will make it 4 times later today!

Anyone else inspired enough for multiple reads??

LLLater!

i liked the issue because i think i'm interpreting the first couple of pages differently. i didn't get the feeling that they're just bullying adults to have fun, but rather they were knowingly goading the assembled tenants of the eadno towers into being passionate and unified about something. they got the adults to reconnect with each other (off screen) and rebel against something they didn't approve of - to break from their disconnected complacency and regain facility over their future.

oh and anyone else want to see element lad do more? i wish he came up more often in mark's deck of legionnaire cards.

I raise my hand in agreement on both counts.

Totally agree with MEL. I reckon the point of the prologue was the reaction of the oldies, and not the over-the-top goading from our heroes.

How a re-emerging society might deal with the legion could be very interesting.

Another agreement with MEL here. Though maybe a bit on the extreme side I thought this showed a good example of the discrimination the Legion is facing because of their age. And being officially sanctioned doesn't seem to matter to the adults.

I do wish, though, that they had corrected the Joseph/Jonathan mistake before going to press. Wacker, you're falling down on the job.

I found today that I had basically the same problem Bevis had. There may be a silver lining, though: my supposedly-cancelled subscription may not have ended yet, so I may be getting a copy in the mail soon. I hope so; I don't like falling behind on issue reviews at Legion Abstract. Plus I want to read the freaking thing.

I agree with MEL too. Nice way of putting it.

No offense but the whole POINT was that they were rude and disrespectful. They wanted the people to stand up against them and also put them in their place...which they did. They weren't harrassing them because they liked to harrass people but because they wanted to say...

"Good God! Have you people no pride!? No sense of dignity!"

And they DID have pride.

I do think that anyone who WOULDN'T stand up to them isn't worthy of respect. They knew that and the person is all the better for it.

If you guys end up pulling a whole "Dallas dream sequence" thing, and it turns out that the preboot Legion is alive and well...it wouldn't be a bad thing!!! I'm still trying to figure out if THIS Supergirl is the pre crisis Kara, or some other manifestation. This is all beginning to get very interesting. I mean in an intriguing way...The Legion has been "interesting" from the beginning!

Yeah but what if the dream she's referring to are dreamlike multiversal memories caused by re-emergence/and remix of the multiverse in IC. We've seen Power Girl remember her E-2 history and the Doom Patrol remember the other version of their origins.

This is the current Kara and the current Legion, the dream Legion she refers to is the preboot Legion as remembered through the original Kara's memories which were recombined in her.

I'm usually pretty good with this stuff -- but you lost me there. I read it through 3 times, and no go. I'm going to take a nap, then give it another try.

I'm with Southtownkid...maybe it's too late and I can't comprehend. Trust me, I'm not mocking at all. But I'm having trouble understanding the reintro of Supergirl/Kara anyway. Who is THIS Supergirl/Kara and what is her connection to the preboot Supergirl/Kara...the one who had a semi-relationship with Brainy which ended with her final 31st Century departure in the old Giffen/Levitz days? Someone...anyone help because I'm confused!!! Goodnight!

I think TL is referencing the fact that most (if not all) of the DCU got to remember all of their alternate reality versions at the end of the their series prior to the "One Year Later" issues.

Thus, Kara (now "OYL") has dreamt all of her various incarnations interactions with the Legion. The stories we lovingly refer to as pre-Crisis, etc. All of the past stories may turn out to be dreams of our post-"OYL" DCU characters now.

?!! I missed that completely... no wonder I didn't get it... I guess that's karma kicking me for my "wait for the trade" behavior.

I've been picking up a few 1YL issues for series I don't normally buy; I guess now I'll end up trying to track down the issues just prior to those.

So now, for example, Batman will remember all of E-1 Batman's experiences, including the original version of Jason Todd? And Superman will remember all of E-1 Superman's Krypton stuff, Streaky, etc.? Yikes. How are the characters going to be able to function with all this extra baggage?

Definitely an interesting compromise for both the people who wanted the return of the Multiverse (like me), and those who were dead against it (assuming I'm understanding this correctly).

Well, I'm not sure how long the effect is supposed to last. The current Crisis is still ongoing.

i hope whoever is the next LSH leader has the guts to rein in any member who bullies a citizen into handing over their goggles. i lost respect for shadow lass with that maneuver. i also didn't like U Boy's throwing of the SP impersonator into SP HQ. although in character for him, Chameleon didn't stand up enough to correct it. they didn't even explain to the SP's why they arrested that guy. so, would the SP's just let him go? these legionnaires need to show some responsibility to go along with the new UP powers. i'm sure that's the point of these scenes but i would like to see at least one of the legionnaires stand up to some of the bullies and say "hey that's not ok. legionnaires are not gang members." another reason why i don't think that much of Cos or Brainy as leader. i would really LOVE to see an actual meeting of the LSH where they discuss these things. hopefully it's in the plans with the new HQ and new leader to first form these basic group structures.

I haven't been able to get a copy of Supergirl, lately. They are always sold out. BTW, who would have ever expected Supergirl to be such a huge hit? I wonder why that is? Her pre-Crisis books were sort of losers, right? A subject for another time, perhaps.

I loved this issue, even the thugish behavior by UB and Shady. We have to remember that, from the kids' point of view, the Science Police, and the adults who support them, are agents of repression, and apparently not very good at protecting the public. We have seen plenty of examples now of the SPs repressing behavior by unconventional but law-abiding citizens while completely missing terrorists, assasins, thieves, masive enemy invasions, etc. The picture I get of the SPs is of a very dysfunctional and arrogant organization. It's been such a long time since they have had to deal with a real threat that they spend all their efforts chasing non-threats (congregating kids) while ignoring real ones. Not unlike the valid criticisms of today's CIA, FBI, NSA, not to mention the Gotham PD pre-Gordon.

Does this mean that the SPs are totally incompetent bullies? Probably not. It would be nice, in future issues, to see the Legionnaires build bridges to SPs who want to do a good job and work with the Legion. But, I can't blame the Legion for having a low opinion and abusing, just a little bit, their new status and authority. I am sure they will learn.

Now, about that Supergirl --- WOW!!!!! Mark and Waid have done an amazing job, and I think this issue demonstrates why, if done right, it is a good thing for the Legion to have some links to the rest of the Superman mythos. As awesome a force as the Legion is, they, like everyone else, are left dumb-struck by Kara's grand entrance. She is simply in another league altogether. Barry's Supergirl is just about the best I have ever seen. He makes the bare midriff outfit look right, rather than too Britney and of the moment (or the moment 2 years ago).

Supergirl's super-arrival got me thinking about the point Brainy made in the Colu issue, that the Legionnaires don't all know how to use their powers to their fullest potential. Perhaps some time around Supergirl will get them thinking about how to reach their utmost, too.

I am not at all troubled by the "dream" thing. In fact, it seemed like a great new take on a common silver age motif. Having not read a recent issue of Supergirl, I thought perhaps Kara was referring to Powergirl's Psycho Pirate inspired dream-like visions in JSA Classified.

Upcoming covers of several OYL books suggest that it may be a lasting consequence of IC's outcome. Look at Superman/Batman 27 and the sillohuete cover of JSA.

I'm thinking what we call pre-crisis stories are remembered by some people and made into comic books which most folks in the DCU think are fictionalized adventures of their real life heroes.

1000 years later those 'pre-crisis' comics still exist and are revered by the LSH even though the truth of the existence of 'real life' Superheroes has been supressed somehow. If so, Supergirl's appearance could change the course of their society.

At least we've stirred up some discussion

I hope you don't mind me not jumping in to correct ideas, or explain things, but it is fun watching the ebb and flow of speculation

Obviously, this Supergirl is another one of Brainy's sexbots gone awry.