Legion World Forums LEGION COMPANION Dr. Gym'll's Cultural Rarities Aaaannd it's Gap time again at DC

One Year Gap time for the whole DCU.

http://www.newsarama.com/wwphilly05/DC/WWPhilCrisis.htm

Isn't this (stupid idea) what ruined the Legion back in the day?

Uh, does this "one year later" crap include Legion? In fact, are we even in this whole infinite crisis debacle?

Presumably, since the thing was stressing the "each and every" aspect of it.

I'm wondering how the Legion fits into *this*.

Why ask? You'd probably keep buying it even if Waid did a Team 21.

You can buy and continue to support something even if you don't like every aspect of it.

If Nightcrawler is my favorite charatcer and I want to read all of his adventures, it makes sense that I'm not going to either like or enjoy every single thing a writer or artist does with him. It also doesn't mean I need to not comment on that at a message board. Especially one devoted to him.

Fair enough (although the completest aspect of stuff does get to me at times. Unless a character's really obscure and has consequently few appearances, I can't imagine trying to buy all their appearances non-stop from X to Y regardless of what's happening in the stories)

My impression is from the creator's cryptic comments that this WaK legion is the post IC future of the DC universe. Ergo no need for 1YG in the 31st century. In effect the LSH v5 is the first Post IC series.

Johns also posted hints of a shakeup in JSA in the wake of the crisis. Since Johns is the DCU these days, his Power Girl origin may actually be the first hint of the new DCU timeline.

Looks like the promise of a change in the status quo of the DCU is real.

I only wonder who the winners and losers will be this time.

Blech.

The x amount of time leap is not a device I enjoy.

In serial storytelling, all it does is raise the risk of this reader suspecting that the 'skipped' stories might be far more enjoyable than those in front of me.

Though it seems like a lot of planning has gone into this, you can bet that some characters/creators are going to get the big ol' one-year-later shaft.

Johns mentioned more reimaginings of JSAers in the near future... that must tie into Infinite Crisis.

But Dido did say that these stories will be told. I am sorry to have to disagree with everyone but I like this idea. A new status quo and you have to see how they got to that point.

These things rarely are what them seem. And often things that sound stupid end up working well. Look at Lost and Desparate Housewives. Both premises when written down into a few words sound hooky and cheesey. But these two shows turned out to be so much more then anyone expected. Lost is my favorite show now.

What I am saying is that alot of planning, thought, and delberation has gone into this. This isn't something that was done on the fly and shoehorned in. What is happening in the DC Universe has been building up and gaining steam. After all this is said done and over with we will see the intelligent design in what we see as madness.

And yes- I liked the five year gap Legion.

There is nothing wrong in using a contrived gap creating a new status quo. Nothing wrong with destroying the multiverse in COIE, or restarting time in Zero Hour either. The problem in the past was in the plan for the new status quo.

COIE = No Plan: led to the editorial fiefdoms at DC getting even worse, the wholesale shafting of some important franchises

Zero Hour = Bad Plan: most of the characters that came out of ZH were forgetable; they only had to kill a few beloved characters to get them, trading equal a pound of gold for a pound of coal is bad for business.

Im optimistic that third time's the charm. Seems to be a plan this time and so far, so good. With the Countdown to IC this interesting, I can't wait for the IC and Post-IC DCU to unravel.

What about those fans who either like the Golden Age stories and series set therein, i.e. All-Star Squadron? Or those of us who like the DCU for more than just being a backdrop for Superman, Batman, & Wonder Woman?

We don't seem to be in the "plan."

If you ask me, ignoring or alienating aspects of the DCU because the guy in charge doesn't like them is a bad idea.

And for us loyal fans who have been reading and enjoying the series thus far, starting over again is a slap in the face.

As for the 5-year gap, whether anyone liked it or not, it plummeted the Legion franchise down to an all-time low in sales and stories that forced a wholesale reboot to get it anywhere near to its heart and soul again.

Why would you possibly think that? I quit buying the previous incarnation of the Legion during the Team 20 story, and only returned when I thought DnA might have a chance at salvaging the disaster that was that version of the team. By the end of their run I was only buying issues intermittantly (I still haven't read all of Floundations).

And, incidentally, I don't think the "5-Year Gap" per se had anything to do with the drop in sales of the 5 Years Later Legion. I think it had a lot more to do with the storylines themselves (and the storytelling style), both in terms of the editorial mandated changes in Legion history and certain rather poor choices by the creative team at the time.

And those who don't like the DCU for any other purpose aren't going to be reading non-Superman/Batman books anyway, so you gain nothing by making all the other writers twist their stories round just so the odd passing Batman fanatic won't be offended by a slightly different take on the DCU than he'd find in the Bat-books.

(An aside: why Wonder Woman? Batman and Superman I can see--like it or not, they're the ones with the franchises--but Wonder Woman's never been a big seller. No offense to any fans of the character, but in terms both of fan base and number of stories impacted, the Birds of Prey--for instance--have a much better claim to be the leading ladies of the DCU. Or, I dunno, Catwoman. Then again, they're plugging the WW movie now, aren't they? So they have to act like she's a major force in the DCU...for a while, anyway.)

Naturally, those of us who liked it will disagree with the "all-time low in stories" part. I enjoyed it while Giffen was around, but it certainly lost its direction at the end. That's the danger of moving too far from the classic conception--the writers have to replace it with a very well-defined vision of their own or the whole thing fizzles. If they succeed, it makes for excellent and interesting stories that can grab people who never followed the Legion before (like me); if they fail, they've lost the support of even the long-time fans.

Now since the entire mainstream DCU other than the Superman/Batman bits is apparently becoming The World According to Geoff Johns, I'm not really worried about a lack of well-defined vision in this case...but I don't need to read a dozen copies of the same book every month, each distinguishable only by the names, costumes and powers of its characters. They want to write a book or two with a year-gap and a big focus on S/B/W, great--write those books, let us pick them up if they're good, and do something different with the other properties. Diversity is a good thing.

Agreed, the diversity and changes could be for the good. If the shake-up doesn't work, they just have another crisis. However, I don't have a lot of energy or emotion invested in the current DCU, so might welcome some of these changes.

I wonder if they're jumping a year to avoid dealing with the house-cleaning/downer details of post-Crisis events. By jumping a year, it's like a fresh start; the characters are all back on their feet and the adventures can start up. (I'm assuming the Infinite Crisis is going to be some major bummer of an event and will leave the involved characters depressed/demotivated/dead in the immediate aftermath.)

"The changes will be so vast, Didio said, that he couldn’t rule out dogs and cats sleeping together."

Hey! Is this morally acceptable in today's America?

I let out a whoop of delight when I read the last line of that aritcle - "no Joker or Darkseid for a while"! WOO-HOO! Throw Lex Luthor into the pit with them and we can finally start getting some interesting villains again!

The new LSH has already jumped forward TWO years since its founding. If they lose yet another year they risk outgrowing the underager movement they started!

You know... what would have thrilled me more than anything would've been if the new LSH series has opened up with the words "One Year Later..." and then picked up the story of the preboot Legion...

I'm all for a one year gap, if we get something like this...

That's hardly fair to say. For myself, it was Team 20 that finally broke my 15ish-year stretch of reading the Legion. If the Legion spends too much time in the past on a contuning basis then I have no interest.

I have a hard time with doing what you do. If I don't like the writing I'm not buying, regardless of how much I like the character. I realized that what I like about a character has a lot to do with how the character has been written in the past. If current writing is making the character into someone I don't like, why should I read? As I see it, it's up to the writers to put up quality stories before I put up my money.

This does make sense. IIRC, Waid said something to the effect of being UNABLE to use the Legion in the 21st Century for at least the first year.