Legion World Forums LEGION CLUBHOUSE The Legion of Super-Heroes The return of the kings: Rereading the Retroboot

So the newest Legion #1 is coming closer. After finishing my Reboot reread, I decided to dive into Geoff Johns revival of the classic Legion, mostly due to the fact that I lost overview of what exactly has happened in all those stories.

Storylines included should be: Lightning Saga, Action Comics ##858++, L3W, Mon-El in Superman and the new Adventure Comics series (minus the Blackest Night issues which I did not buy). NOT Countdown (though the few Karate Kid appearances should be quick to read).

I started yesterday with JSA ##1-4, cause as far as I know, it was there that the first glimpses of classic Legionnaires were seen.

Even though those really are only glimpses - except for Starman whose gibberish gives a lot of information about the upcoming Lightning Saga - I really thought those issues showed how good a writer Johns has become in the last five years. His JSA really is fun to read, and compared to the lousy Titans / Legion special he co-wrote finishing the Reboot, this is pure gold. The few pictures showing Dreamys mole or Dawnstars feathery costume made me cheer back then, and I really think it was perfect to wet your appetite.

Are you sure you want to submit yourself to this...?

I'm game for rereading and discussion. I'll register my objections early to the use of words and phrases like "return", "classic" "original" and "retroboot" to describe this version. To me, it's another reboot. The use of those other phrases strikes some of us as insincere and automatically puts off fans of some of the other eras.

Is this what you are referring to, Lash?

LOL, not interested in a flamewar - I stated before that for me personally, the current para-classic / whatever version of the Legion is close enough to the original to enjoy. That's what counts in my books - and I want to reread it to get into all the subplots again, not to nitpick.

So let's leave out the small print and take the books at what they are - some new Legion yarn using characters pretty much resembling the old guys. If this turns out to become a revival a la JSA in 1999, we can all be very happy...

...by the way, had no time to get into the Lightning Saga yet - those Promethea Trades are just too awesome to dive into, what terrific artwork!

I'll play along and reread when you do.

The Lightning Saga:

Five issues by four different artists - not what i call "consistent artwork", though some of the stuff was beautiful to look at (like Ed Benes rendition of Dawnstar on the last page of JLA #9 - wow!). Some of the dialogue was a little bit too cryptic, especially the stuff Brad Meltzer was doing.

During the first reading, of course most of the fascination of this story was coming from those old costumes returning - and not knowing who would be the seven Legionnaires featured. As i said before, to me those characters were close enough to the originals that I felt it to be the return of my childhood heroes - albeit continuitally challenged.

During this second reading, I found some stuff I must have been overreading the first time around. The Wildfire / Tornado connection (totally useless!) I simply ignored back then, now it just seemed forced and totally out of meaning. Dawnstars lesbian adventure I can live with. Starmans mental illness was explained well enough for my taste, especially bringing his Kingdom Come appearance into continuity. But all in all, my impression is that the team got not enough screen time, which is no miracle due to the fact that those were the books of the ever overcrowded JSA & JLA anyway - the Legion was nothing more but an exciting supporting character. There was no space for character development, though some smaller moments like Karate Kids "I ducked" really had the smell of something great

The story got better as it developed. I thought that the first issue with the endless melee between JSA & JLA was boring, whereas the last issue managed to get quite exciting. Still, I can't see why seven Legionnaires would travel back in time to sacrifice their life for a Flash they never met in person - just cause Brainy was telling them to? Hm. The basic premises of the whole story seemed far-fetched, but we all know that they needed some official twist to reestablish this para-classic Legion back into the DCU - and compared to the twist they used to replace the Reboot with the Threeboot, this was still done way better...

Some things remained unclear, like Supermans allusion as to "Legion of Three Worlds" (as if it already happened), like Karate Kids resurrection (a story which still hasn't been told and probably never will considering Vals fate during "Countdown"), like all those Flashes being brought back (never was into the Flash books, so I don't know their status quo as per "Lightning Saga" except from the fact that all were presumed dead).

So: I liked it, but the fascination and excitement of the first reading was obviously gone.

The four artists did nice work for “The Lightning Saga”. I became a fast fan of Shane Davis when he did the Mystery In Space mini in 2006 so I was delighted to see his work on the first issue. The Meltzer/Benes team really clicked on the Justice League revival. I know a lot of fans disagree, but all of their issues were solid for my money. The JSA artists did a fine job too. The end result may have been inconsistent in look and feel, but the quality was consistent. The artists succeeded in giving the Legion a very sleek commercial quality. They showed that the Cockrum /Grell era costumes could work in a modern book without looking dated or silly.

The story itself, was much more exciting to read the first time around than it is on a re-read. As Chemical King points out, that was largely due to the anticipation of figuring out which Legionnaire would appear next and trying to put the mystery together. In retrospect, though, I can’t figure out for the life of me what kind of planning went into this story. Maybe someday we’ll get some interviews with some behind the scenes moments. Was the intention to use the pre crisis Legionnaires in a modern story for a nostalgia effect and a little bit of fun? Was it to reintroduce the pre crisis team in order to replace the threeboot team? Was it a set up for events in the Countdown and Final Crisis? Was the story just meant to test the waters a bit? Whatever the answer, it ultimately served to create some pretty high expectations.

Some of my favorite bits:

Batman reporting how skilled a fighter Karate Kid was. This wasn’t the silly “super karate” that Shooter created and Giffen later derided. This wasn’t the faddish martial arts of Karate Kid’s own magazine. This was a hero for a new century ready to be taken seriously in a battle with the flaming Batman.

Brin in Gorilla City. For some strange reason this worked and seemed so cool.

Dream Girl’s clever dialogue with the golden age Flash.

Dawnstar’s return after a good two decades. What took so long?

The use of those funky Adventure era lightning resurrection rods in serious way.

The interaction of the JLA and the JSA. The Roy, Kendra, Kara, Carter star crossed lovers bit.

The return of Wally and family. His tears and telling Jay how bad it hurt, The hug from Roy.

I’m tempted to add the Legion statues from the Fortress as a favorite bit. The excitement was quickly dashed when I realized that Chemical King and Tyroc weren’t there. The story raised a lot of questions. This can serve to create suspense for future stories or leave infuriating loose ends. We can address how well those questions were eventually answered (if at all), as the reviews continue.

I need to reread these in the next couple days myself. Once I do, I will post my thoughts...

The lightning saga makes NO sense. The whole premise is that one life has to be traded for another. Not only did Val NOT give his life, but 4 people were brought back instead of one. And what does Wally have to do with the Legion anyway?

And why on earth Val was revived just so he could pretend to sacrifice himself for someone who died a thousand years ago and then die again anyway will never make sense to me.

And don't even get me started on Wildfire as Red Tornado. Hello? Red Tornado is an android. Wildfire is a human who's been transformed into living anti-energy. How the two could be one boggles even comic book logic. And how did Drake conceal the utility belt inside his suit without it being destroyed by his own energy?

The whole Wildfire/Red Tornado thing was a poorly thought out way of trying to tie the Legion to the DCU. Dream Girl and the Dreaming was another example.

Really the whole Lightning Saga premise was about re-introducing and making the Legion relevant. In that way it was very much a fore-runner of the way Johns did Lo3W. If the Lightning Saga is read from the point of view of a JLA/JSA fan who knows little or nothing of the original Legion it makes more sense.

As far as I understood, Wally return plus his family was rather a side-effect - unintended at all cause Bart was the one they were chasing. (still, I don't see any connection between Bart and the classic Legion. The connection Bart had was to the Reboot Legion, which was living in limbo at that given time)

And Karate Kid ducked. As I said, I liked that one: Corny, but cool (he ducked death - hey, that's something to tell the grandchildren).

As for Wildfire, once more: not only did the connection not make any sense, I also felt that the dialogue was so garbled and cryptic that I actually did not get it at all during the first reading - only learned from it here on this board. This was most poorly done and clearly is the weakest element of the whole Johnsboot.

What I also liked with the LS is the fact that the classic costumes were used. The next storyline, playing only six months later, most costumes had been updated, some of them like Wildfire and Ultra Boy for the worse...

My interpretation is the same as Chemical King's. The return of Wally and family was a side effect and not the intention of the mission. Remember, Brainiac 5 was surprised by it.

The old one life for another from the Garth/Proty story didn't apply here. Perhaps because Brainiac 5 changed the technology of the rods. They didn't really revive anyone, but instead captured Bart's essence in the rod and took it to the 31st century.

The Bart thing is still strange. When next we see Brainy in Action he cryptically says the wand can't do what he needs it to (or something like that), implying it was meant to help against Earthman and the "Justice League". How was Bart supposed to do this?

Then when Prime shows up, it all works out as Bart is one of the people he's (nonsensically) afraid of. But that's NOT why they brought him back, as Brainy didn't even know about Prime.

We still don't know what the point of it all was.

But they all talked about volunteering for a suicide mission. So what? They were ALL planning to duck? Not everyone's fast enough to duck lightning.

So lets step to the next story: Action Comics ##858-863

I remember that I was terribly excited about this story during the first reading, and it still was a very good read the second time around. I really cared for the characters, and that for me is always a good sign (by comparision, I did not give a damn for the characters in "Final Crisis" - and it's that emotional bit that basically makes a story good or bad for me).

The story takes place about half a year after Lightning Saga (just one month has passed for Supes, though), and the few characters which appeared in both - Wildfire, Dawnstar and Timber Wolf - somehow have gone though costume changes. Some not for the better: I don't care much for Wildfires new look and thought Dawnstars rendition a la Ed Benes looked way better than the new look with the Bolero jacket... in general, I rather like those of the new costumes which have gone with fewer changes like Tinya and Tasmia, while the sleeveless shirts worn by Garth, Brin and Jo probably won't stand the test of time

Anyway, Gary Franks artwork I liked a lot, but I'm a fan of his stuff since his Supergirl days and really loved his Squadron Supreme run. So I'm more accustomed to his way of doing faces than many others here seemed to be (I remember there was a lot of complaining).

The setting of this story was slightly reminding me of 5YL again. What most reminded me of it was the fact that like back in 1989, you had to start to track down the heroes. What has happened since Crisis? Where are the Legionnaires, who has disappeared or died or joined? I really liked that bit. What I did not like was that so many of the team were captured, and rather easily, by the rejects, but I know this was a story element so Johns could focus on a smaller team to start with. Unfortunately, thus many of my favorites like Tinya, Jacques or Jo did not play a large part in the story.

My personal favorite was Polar Boy. I always liked his character, but not only was his part very heroic, but his character was very cleverly established as a counterpart to the other rejects which blamed the world instead of themselves. Not only is Polar Boy kind of unbreakable, he also never looses his optimism and thus shows the reader how you can deal with disappoitments. I salute that.

The story as a whole was much more consistent than Lightning Saga and provided a good start, some interesting story development and a satisfying ending. Nothing much to complain about it. Xenophobia will always be an important topic as long as mankind won't take a giant leap forward - and based on the current state of the world, I can't see this leap happening in the next 1000 years.

So all in all I'm stull very pleased with this story, which established a 31st century that to me in some ways seemed like a parallel 5YL reality. It certainly is an interesting setting for many stories to come. It resembles the classic continuity close enough that I can see it as a sequel to the 80s - and I could not see any major inconsistencies that could not easily be "written away" by a skilled storyteller.