Legion World Forums LEGION CLUBHOUSE The Legion of Super-Heroes Return of the Levitz/Giffen team for LSH in 2013

So exciting!

Tinya's costume is SO boring IMO. People may say the bell-bottoms are out-dated but at least they give the eye something interesting to settle on. Other than the obligatory boob window, there is nothing about Tinya's costume that elevates it above that of a random background character's in a crowd scene.

Other than that, I don't mind the drawing of her here. People don't tend to look their best when they're jumping in pain/fright. Nice to see Jacques too.

Actually, I'd rather see them develop a friendship without it having any kind of romantic connotation (the long-term couples straining/breaking apart has been done enough lately, imo). It would be a nice throwback to the never-really-developed friendship between Tinya and Lyle. Maybe she could be the "big sis" that gives him advice on approaching Glorith or whomever?

SO TITS!!!!

To this non-fan of Giffen, it's some of his best art of the last few decades. I'll take it over his 'everyone has square faces and botox lips' phase any day.

I am confused as to why the intangible woman and the invisible man seem to be running from a hand. (when powers may be useful)

BUT I DO want to see Tinya and Jacques hand the Fatal Five their nasses!!! all by themselves.

Wow PG...those are some manly shoulders you've got going on there.

I can't say I'm really digging the Tinya on the cover, but, man, this is pretty exciting!

Hmm... could the giant hand be Modo?

Love it! Very dynamic. Jacques looks awesome. Tinya - Here's a term I've never used before - "Kirbyesque boob window."

I think this Tinya looks very much like she is using every ounce of muscle she has to pull Jacques away from harm... love it, a LOT!

This is going to be nothing short of complete kickassery.

The hand: I imagine is meant to evoke what happened to the original IK.

So... odds seem to be good that one or more Legionnaires will be dying to make room for the returning Lost Legionnaires...

Lame, if true. Unless its Harmonia. *titter*

Well I guess Val Armorr won't be coming back anytime soon! If Paul needed a co-plotter Jim Shooter would have been my 1st choice, I would love to see the two of them play off of each other with the Legion caught in the middle, if he needed an artist Steve Lightle would have been my 1st choice out of all the great artists that have worked on the Legion, other than those two gentlemen I would love to see Paul do something Legion related with Alex Ross, Jim Starlin or Alan Davis and Mark Farmer.

For me (and many others), Giffen has been partially responsible for the best and the worst moments in the Legion. But I must say, I am looking forward to him to return even if it's only for a short time. He and Levitz do work well together.

If this is the cover of LSH #17, it's nice to see Phantom Girl finally making a cover, just as Violet finally makes the cover of #16. Now if Shadow Lass and Lightning Lass can finally get some attention....

well I am still waiting for XS and Quislet to grace the Legion pages.

I don't know about the "love triangle" thing, but I want more Legion friendships in general. And that cover looks great to me.

(Also, I've mentioned it before: But it's time they amped up Jacques' skillset. He should be able to do more with invisibility, just as Sue Storm-Richards was eventually given an expanded skillset.)

Now what did Tinya and Jacques do to rile up Gim?

I hope Giffen ignites a spark with Levitz, but when their couple of years come to an end, I hope DC either lures Hickman from Marvel or entrusts the LSH with an unknown writer who's age-equivalent to the characters he or she is writing.

I really think the LSH needs fresh voices evoking the future.

Paradoxically, I hope Levitz becomes editor of LSH for life, whenever he decides to stop writing. That fresh vision of the future still needs a through line to the voices of the past.

Keith's time as part of TMK had the awful 'black shadowed nose and mouth' phase, too.
ugh

I'm looking forward to this arc.

Definitely. And it would certainly be a shocking development, for any sort of media, to present a friendship between a male and a female character that *isn't* all about sexual tension or subtext or will they/won't they.

(Tinya, Cham, Vi and Jacques, in particular, as members of the Espionage Squad, should be shown as having their own friendshippy moments, IMO.)

It's gotten so ridiculous that today's comic book writers can't seem to even write a story about siblings, like Pietro and Wanda, or Johnny and Sue, without some sort of creepy romantic vibe sneaking in, let alone write a non-romantic friendship between non-siblings of the opposite sex...

Jacques definitely needs something. Even if he just, non-power-wise, studied and trained his butt off and became hyper-competent (like an awesome spy or secret agent, or a brilliant tactician, or a martial artist), making him more like 'Batman, who also has a super-power!' instead of 'mostly helpless dude who happens to have a pretty un-spectacular power.'

Building off of invisibility, which is all about manipulating light, is problematic for a Legionnaire since developing the ability to generate light would duplicate what Sun Boy gave up doing a long time ago, developing the ability to alter frequencies of light turns him into Color Kid, who was rejected for not having a good enough power, developing the ability to shape light and make patterns and images makes him a much weaker version of Princess Projectra, and developing the ability to negate light replicates Shadow Lass. Even if he could eventually do all of those things, it's hardly a unique niche for him.

A different tack might be for his ability to become invisible be defined less as messing with light, and more as messing with the properties of his body (in this case, making it translucent). By exploring that angle, he might instead develop the ability to alter *other* properties of his body, like it's PH (making himself acidic) or it's vibratory rate (allowing him to slowly phase through matter) or it's electrical potential (allowing him to shock people) or it's temperature (making himself incredibly cold or incredibly hot).

Or he could just use his powers intelligently, and stop A) forgetting to turn invisible during combat and / or B) blabbing and giving away his location while invisible.

Perhaps he could even wear invisible body armor, and use Lyle's invisibility formula to keep it invisible, even when he's totally visible, allowing people to mistakenly believe that he's blasterproof and can punch steel walls without hurting his hand.

An invisible dude who never announced his presence on a team (except to his teammates), but remained invisible 24/7 could be super effective, as enemies would never think to look for him, and always be surprised when random things just 'went wrong' for them (thanks to invisible dude they don't know even exists unplugging their equipment or jamming their weapons or slamming a door in someone's face or tripping one of them or pushing one of his fellow heroes out of the way of one of their deadly attacks).

If Tyroc got an upgrade in power and design, Jacques could equally benefit from some changes as Set describes.

A body breaking out of the soil makes me think of Mordru - and maybe some magic is preventing Tinya and Jacques from using their powers.

Tinya with short hair - I don't know....

+1 to making Jacques an awesome martial artist...Vi and Dreamy became kickass fighters to compensate for their non-combat-related powers so why not give Jacques the same treatment? (though Vi at least should be ridiculously dangerous purely based on her power, but that's another topic I guess..)

If there's one thing that has become really obvious looking at the other Legion reboots, this version of the team is the least efficient. The other Legion teams used their powers in ways that this team never does, and the Legionnaires with less flashy powers were generally way better fighters. Triad and Umbra would kick their counterparts' asses eight ways from Sunday...

Jacques always forgets to use his powers, so this is hardly something new. Tinya, on the other hand, may be staying tangible deliberately, so that she can help rescue Visible Kid.

(A nice upgrade to *her* power might be the ability to phase someone else out of danger or through a barrier...)

Even a basic understanding of human(oid) anatomy should make her freakishly dangerous. Even using non-lethal tactics, such as zipping into someone's semicircular canal, in the inner ear, and expanding to push fluid against the entire interior, would make someone flail on the ground helplessly, as their body is utterly convinced that they are falling in every direction, at the same time.

Similarly, she could be-bop herself into the base of someone's spinal column, and expand to the size of a grain of rice, gently pushing aside nerve cells in the spinal cord and paralyzing her subject from the neck down. The effect would last only as long as she remains there, and she could leave at any time, without having inflicted any lasting effect other than a tingly sensation as feeling returns to the no-longer-paralyzed-person.

Agreed. And that's not a Legion thing, either, it's a comic-book thing.

The Silver Age was loaded with examples of something dire appearing to happen on the cover, and inside the pages of the comic, the heroes *did something clever* to trick villains into thinking they were winning.

The last time I remember that sort of thing was in the introduction of the League of Super-Assassins, where the Legion fooled them into thinking they'd succeeded in killing a bunch of Legionnaires, or in the second issue of the Wolfman/Perez Teen Titans, where Raven spun an illusion to allow the Ravager to believe that he'd fulfilled his contract on the Titans.

These days, the heroes just go in blasting and take it on the chin (and often need ever escalating degrees of power, to allow them to accomplish anything despite their utter lack of tactics), and anywhere from dozens of civilians to entire *universes* end up getting destroyed, while the 'heroes' pretty much let the villains dictate the terms of every encounter.

I've always and still do prefer the "get creative with powers" over the power upgrade or get better with powers plots, though I guess it makes sense to get better with powers. Likewise I guess I would expect all the Legionnaires to have non-powered combat proficiencies above the norm, that they'd be consistently training their martial arts.

I would expect more of them to show artistic skills if for no other reason than to get "it" out of their system. They see some horrific stuff.

i really don't like Griffin's style at all. but i'm hoping that the stories will get better with Levitz having a co-plotter again.