Legion World Forums LEGION COMPANION The Anywhere Machine LOST - season 3 BE WARNED!!!

I'm kind of disappointed with it if there isn't anything more done with Nikki and Paulo.

As far as I can see, there were two basic things accomplished in the episode:

1. The Losties now have an Others walkie talkie.
2. Sun finding out who was responsible for her kidnapping.

Neither of those really seemed to justify the focus on these two characters who basically just red shirts.

Unless the spiders play some important role later...

Brutal end to those two... whoever they were.

I love how Sawyer thinks the way we all have everytime we've seen Nikki & Paulo not knowing who they were.

I usually hate all the flashbacks in Lost but tonight's were pretty good since we got to see old dead cast members.

I knew what was going on when they first showed us the spider in the flashback and kept their eyes open for most of their 'death'.

One of the better 'filler' episodes tonight I think even though it didn't actually move the main story along. It didn't really need to. I was entertained enough.

Wow, way to do a 180 on a storyline with no clear pathway, backtrack and kill off new characters whom viewers never took to. I think we basically witnessed what happens when two atttractive people get put onto a cast with no real sense of direction, just for the sake of bringing in ratings, and the public dosn't take to them. Perhaps if they had been put in with an actual purpose?

This is the one thing about shows like this that always makes me uneasy, They hit with a bang with all these convoluted plotlines and we're all hooked, then when the buzz starts to die down they go off and try introducing new thigns just to get the buzz back, leading us to believe that the writers are now essentially "winging it". They may know where the story will end, but apparently have no idea how to get there.

Do any of you spoiler-reading internetters know for a fact whether or not they planned this all along with these characters?

I don't know -- I think the show reminded us (in case we forgot) why Jack, John, Kate and Sawyer are our heroes. These 2 LOSERS could have prevented much pain, suffering and death, and they were just too narcissistic to even notice and do anything about it.

There's also a meta-message here from the writers that a failure to engage with the island and its story is ultimately fatal.

Rosencrantz and Guildenstern Are Dead!

Brilliant!

YES! This episode is two seasons late in coming.

I've been wanting stuff like this since that explosive opening scene. We've got almost 50 survivors, let's see all their stories. And this was one creepy story.

That said, maybe Sayid and Sun should sit out a few episodes, now that we're getting close to the season finale (the Deathwatch has begun.)

No foreshadowing that someone close to them will be reveled to be a villain. Just like in the show Expose Nikki was on?

I liked this ep. It shows that everyone else also has secrets that they are trying to keep also.

Boy this episode really seems to have split people into two camps. Well I'm firmly in the camp that LOVED it!

I actually think it was one of the best episodes this season. Sure it didn't really move the main plot forward but who cares? It was hella enjoyable and a fun little insight into what goes on behind the main Losties backs.

I definitely don't think the writers caved in and wrote these two characters out because of fan pressure or anthing. This episode would've been written and filmed months ago - long before most people had even had a chance to register an opinion about them.

Favourite parts -

* that "Razzle Dazzle" at the beginning. Totally using that from now on!
* seeing Boone, Shannon and Arzt (and Vincent - loved the way he tried to pull N&P's blanket off knowing they were still alive!) again. Wish Boone and Shannon had had more to do tho.
* all those shoutouts to Season 1 locales and events - the crash, the waterfall, the smuggler's plane... FUN.
* Charlie confessing to Sun. Junkie's one of my fave characters so glad to see him being redeemed somewhat.
* the whole murder mystery/noir vibe. Love a good mystery and while this one was pretty obvious it was fun to see them at least try one.
* seeing Nikki and Paulo get fleshed out a bit and being such amoral characters to boot. That was a surprise. I kinda wish they hadn't been killed off now 'coz the Losties need some more antagonistic characters now that the Others are getting a little played out.

The one thing I was a little leery of was that ending. Being buried alive is one of my biggest phobias so knowing it was coming a couple of minutes before it did and then seeing it happen was a bit uncomfortable. Was a nice twist tho.... if they're really dead? I can't see how they could possibly have survived that but something Locke said earlier in the episode seemed a little foreshadowing - "Nothing on this island stays buried forever." Hmmm.

Hmmm - maybe I was wrong about the characters being written out because of their unpopularity with the fans? ---

"People hated them before they even opened their mouths to say anything significant because it felt like they were crashing the party," exec producer Damon Lindelof acknowledges of the characters who were abruptly introduced last fall. "The easiest thing would have been to just write them out and forget they ever happened, like the cougar on [Season 2] of 24. But that's not Lost. We should at least own up to it."

From - http://community.tvguide.com/thread.jspa?threadID=800011706

(Love that shout-out to that much maligned Kim/cougar subplot on 24!)

Still, if it is true that Nikki and Paulo were quickly written out because of a vocal minority of fans then I don't know who I'm more annoyed at - the fans for being so impatient that they're going to judge characters before we get the chance to know them; or the writers for caving in to their pressure and not telling whatever story they had in mind for these characters.

Oh well - whatever the reason, I still enjoyed the episode and Lost is still on a roll with me so at I guess it's not all bad.

I think the annoyance had more to do with the number of new characters added, not the quality of the characters. A lot of people were feeling that some of the original characters (Sayid, Sun, Jin Claire) weren't getting enough screentime, and that these new guys were making the problem worse.

Those people still have a baseless criticisim though Arachne, since these 2 characters had at most, what? - 4 lines?, before this episode.

I definitely agree that Sayid, Sun, Jin, etc have been a bit neglected this season but that's definitely not the fault of Nikki and Paulo. That problem lies with Jack, Kate, Sawyer and the Others getting so much screentime.

I think Nikki and Paulo's downfall was caused by a number of things -

* they were introduced at a time when people were looking for ANYTHING to criticise about this show.
* they were introduced in the same episode that a long-neglected but very popular character was killed off.
* their introduction seemed to come out of nowhere and could've been handled a bit more smoothly.
* until this latest episode we've been given no real reason to feel one way or another about them (like/dislike - nothing), they've just been kinda there .

I think if these two had hung around a bit longer (maybe even in the secret villain capacity) a lot of people's opinons about them would've changed. Same as people eventually came around to liking Shannon and to a lesser extent Ana Lucia. Oh well - c'est la vie.

They had more scenes that got cut, I think. Their first scene was supposed to be in the second ep, IIRC.

They didn't bother me, but I can't blame people for being upset. The cast is just too big, to be adding people if they're not going to play a role that's important to the story. I can't help thinking that if Nikki and Paulo were really intended to be that important they wouldn't have been cut.

I agree that they spent too much time on the love triangle early on. Especially now that TPTB are hinting that it's not over, after all. I hope they're just being misleading.

I wouldn't mind having new characters, but not at the expense of some of the others. The focus on JAKASA has been so much that I feel anyone else is stealing away from my favourites.

That said, I don't think the writers tried to make Niki or Paulo likable. The interaction they had was a little whiny ("You always say you want to be included.") Desmond was introduced and I think most fans like him. So it's not purely the viewers that didn't take to the new characters.

Had we seen a backstory when they were first introduced, we'd probably take to them more.

Not to mention that people seem to LOVE Juliet (me included.) I think it was just new character overload.

Now what this does or doesn't have to do with Miss Clue, I haven't a... well, clue.

It seems obvious now in hindsight that they were doomed from the start. Purposely made kind of 'blah' and then BAM--mid season we get a kick-ass story that does a LOT of things for fans:

(1) we get to see old Lost members long gone and revisit old scenes from new angles

(2) we get to see the much requested 'what are the other 40 survivors doing?'

(3) we get a return to the far-out, trippy full-on horror of the first season when the Island was completely new and potentially scary.

(4) and we're reminded yet again that nothing is what we truly think it is. And no one is what they seem.

I think that worked out well and gave the viewers a break from Kate/Jack/Locke, while giving some screen time to Sun, Jin, Desmond, Charlie, Hurley, and Sawyer, who is at his best when interacting with the other members besides Jack and Kate.

I only wish we could have seen Michael and Walt too. I hope they come back soon.

I wonder now if the 'Expose' story will be reflected in Lost? That someone we've seen all along could end up as the big bad? I'm looking at you Bernard

There have been a lot of great scenes lately and most of the episodes have been addressing the main storylines and moving the plot along. But its good that they interrupted that with something out of left field. We’re not that close to the *series* finale yet, so they can’t make us feel too safe in knowing what could be next

Cobbie, you may be right about "Expose" being foreshadowing. Apparently, the creators have codenamed the finale "Snake in a Mailbox." And what was the name of the Billy Dee Williams character? Cobra.

Of course, it might just have been there to make Hurley suspicious of Sawyer in this episode.

I can't wait for next weeks episode. Although I'd rather Kate decked Jack not Juliet. (I like Juliet, too, KP. ) I'm really hoping this episode ends the triangle or at least shows Kate reestablishing an identity outside of her love life. Her identity should affect her love life not the other way around.

so after last weeks amazing WHAT THE HELL !!!??? ending [ did we get to see more of JOHN's Dad, and how he's appeared on the island !!??

Matthew.

No - that'll probably be next week when we get back to the Others storyline.

P.S. Personal theory - that's not really John's Dad, Ben has just learned to control the 'monster'.

Nope, not a bit, and from the sound of things it's going to be awhile. There's some theories that he'll be back in Sawyer's ep, but no one's confirmed if Sawyer has another ep this season. If you're interested in Cooper, you might want to visit this thread. It could be considered a spoiler, though.

My theory is that it's really Cooper, but he's not really a prisoner.

Interesting and weird. I can't imagine, though I would certainly like to see more of the smoke monster explained (I've taken to calling him "Roger" after the sentry in "The Prisoner", but that's just me). Still, I can't wait to see what "the man from Tallahassee" (Locke's dad) has to do with any of this.

Well, what'd'ya know? I just came across a translation of the Russian conversation from Enter 77. I wasn't looking for it or anything.

Hmm, Mikhail and I share a birthdate.

After reading through all of those wikipedia pages, I've come up with a theory:

At some point during LOST, most likely towards the end of the finale season, we will see that Desmond and Penny (who will be on the island by then) go back and time and become 'Adam and Eve', the two skeletons from season one.

It just seems like we could end up seeing something similar to that and it would be hella-kewl. But of course, I could be waaay off.

Just b/c I'm all looking at Lost stuff all morning