Legion World Forums LEGION COMPANION The Anywhere Machine Superman Returns!

edit: zee dreaded dbl post

"Hey Luthor remembers where the Fortress is from the final fight in that movie? Why didn't Supes kiss Lex and make him forget? You'd figure thats more dangerous than Lois knowing the Secret ID."


I just thought of a parellel with the very-recent, "controversial" IDENTITY CRISIS thing, where the JLA brainwashes several super-villains to make them forget their secret identities. And here, Superman was shown doing such a thing in the 1981 movie. "Hollywood", huh?

Wiping memories to conceal secret identities was a standard Silver Age plot device! Green Lantern did it constantly!

Ok, maybe not so 'hollywood' now that I know the backstory, thanks for clearing it up for me

I'm going to see this tonight (it was only released here today) and I am almost peeing myself with exitment.

My dad took me, my brother and sister to see the first three Superman films when they came out (we never saw the fourth one for some reason, can't remember why) and now, twenty years later we are all going to see this one together.

I feel like I'm 8 years old again.

i went to see Superman Returns last Friday at the 10am showing and i absolutely loved it !!

i had a few minor gripes but in the most part i loved everything about it !!

the MUSIC/THEME [ made the hairs on my arms, stand up ] the TITLES [ resembling the original ones !! ]

all the supporting cast, i thought they were all really good, JIMMY, PERRY and RICHARD were great [ glad nothing serious happened to him ]

i liked LOIS [ she did seem a 'little young' but i still enjoyed her performance !!

the scenes in SMALLVILLE were a lot shorter than what i was expecting [ and that was fine IMO, as i thought it may have slowed the film down, by going over his origin again !! ]

i've seen a few scenes with the young CLARK on a special DVD that came with our weekend newspaper, so i guess we'll get some expanded scenes on the DVD !!

wish we'd seen more of the BLACK costume !!

finally onto CLARK KENT / SUPERMAN, i thought Brandon was great, his Clark was very good, still bumbling, but not over the top !!

and his SUPERMAN was great, i thought he had a really good presence, liked they way he floated, and spoke, he had a majestic air around him !!

i liked the MAJOR plotline, that was a total surprise to me [ glad that i avoided the spoilers ]

i thought the film had quite a religious feel to it [ not sure how much SINGER had intended some scenes to be !! but i thought there were many inconic images !!

Supes lifting the land structure into space, he looked ATLAS lifting the world on his shoulders, and then when he falls back to earth, he looked like he was being crusified !!

and the talking of father and son, etc [ has a God and Jesus feel to it IMO !! ]

can't wait for the sequel !! wonder who the villain will be in the next one !!

Matthew.

Loved it, LOVED IT, LOOOOOVED IT!!!

I've been to see this three times now and I still think it's amazing.

I even liked the kid. For a change the obligatory child actor in every Holywood film wasn't an annoying little git who I wanted to slap.

Brandon Routh was great. Like Matt said I liked the way he kind of floated when he spoke to people. It did convey some of the "Godlike" charisme of Superman. And sometimes when he smiled he looked a lot like Chris Reeves.

Another bit I liked:one of the criticisms about Superman is "How hard is it to be brave when you can't be hurt and you're stronger than anyone else?" Good point.

I think they addressed that in this film. He had just had the c**p kicked out of him, he had a sliver of Kryptonite stuck in him and he was STILL prepared to go back to some place that, by it's very nature, was lethal to him and face men who wanted to kill him.

OH YEAH! He IS the man!!

There was a lot of nice touches for the fanboys. The "recreation" of the first cover.

The "It's a bird, it's a plane" bit.

The "Son becomes the father" speech.

Marlon Brando.

The bit at the end when He smiles to the camera just like he did in the first one.

I loved it.

Funny story: SPOILER ALERT!!!

The second time I went to see it, the place was full of children. Then it got to the part when Superman fell to Earth.

He's falling all the way in slow motion, the sad music is playing and the whole audience is holding it's breath and muttering "C'mon, come ON!! WAKE UP!!"

Just before he hit the camera switches back to full speed and he slams into the ground with a huge explosion sending shockwaves out through the city on screen and the audience in the cinema.

In the cinema there is total silence, you could hear a pin drop. "Is he dead? Is he alive? What's happening?"

Then from the front row, the voice of a small boy broke the silence.

"FUCKIN HELL!!"

Kids, don't you love them?

I finally saw this yesterday, taking advantage of a Friday off and a free ticket coupon enclosed in my Superboy series one DVD set.

The John Williams theme started, the big red "S" appeared on the screen and I had tears in my eyes. I was nine years old again, watching the first movie.

Brandon Routh impressed me quite a bit. Physically, he is an incredibly beautiful man. About halfway through I reminded myself about his relative youth. If it was an issue at all, it evoked Superman's alien nature.

He has an unenviable task. When Christopher Reeve played the role nearly (*gulp*) thirty years ago, he only had George Reeves (and, to a lesser extent Kirk Allyn's) performances to which he could be compared, neither of which was much more than a cartoon portrayal. Routh has Reeve's iconic performance--generally considered to be the definitive portrayal--plus that of four other actors who have played the role on television in the interim--including one still in production. In the end, he proved himself more than equal to the task.

Kevin Spacey was wonderful. He hammed it up beautifully.

Kate Bosworth, though, was disappointing. Lois Lane isn't supposed to be "cute".

Frank Langella and Parker Posey were perfect.

Superman's vulnerability was played up a little too much, but I understand the reasons why.

Overall, it was an enjoyable way to spend an afternoon.

Superman Returns was a hit and miss movie for me. Some of it was enjoyable, but there were far too many "tributes" to the previous movies for my taste: Superman and Lois flying, Superman lecturing about the safety of air travel, and Lex's girlfriend betraying him. There were times when it wasn't clear if Singer was making a remake or a sequel ... perhaps some strange hybrid: a requel?

After reading the above posts, I also realized that something else was bothering me: the plot holes. Superman loses his powers on the kryptonite island, yet later he has enough strength to push the island into space. Lois doesn't remember that Clark is Superman, but does she remember her liaison with Superman? (The speculation posted above, about Supes' selective hypnosis sounds plausible, but the movie doesn't address this.) Perhaps Lois really did believe that Richard was the father.

The comparisons between Superman and Jesus Christ (particularly the falling-to-earth-while-crucified bit) were too obvious. Several times, it was mentioned that earth doesn't need a savior, yet that's precisely what Superman becomes. Subtlety isn't one of Singer's fortes.

I did, however, enjoy James Marsden's portrayal as Richard (who could have been the stereotypically wimpy "other guy," but instead acted even more heroically than Superman, since he had more to lose). I also liked Kevin Spacey as Lex; he can't hold a candle to Michael Rosenbaum's fully developed and tortured hero-villain on Smallville, but Spacey was still fun to watch.

Routh's Clark did seem more natural as a klutz than Chris Reeve did, and Routh's Superman was a dead-on (pun not intended) channeler of Reeve's hero. No real complaints here, though nothing new was added to Superman's character.

Kate Bosworth's take on Lois was different than what I was expecting (I like the spunky actress who plays Lois on Smallville), but no less credible. Langella was fine as Perry, and Jimmy, though annoying, was at least a redhead. Eva Marie Saint's quiet strength as Martha Kent added a welcome dimension to the role.

So, overall, the elements of the movie I found appealing were in the performances and not in the story itself. It's as if Singer set out to make a safe Superman movie, one that would make us feel good without challenging our perceptions or expectations of the character -- the perfunctory Big Plot Twist notwithstanding.

That's why I much prefered X-Men: The Last Stand.

I didn't like it. Man, there was so much I didn't like, I've taken this long to get this post done.

I suppose I should just start at the beginning.

1. What a slllloooooooowwwwww start! Yahwn! Took forever to get anywhere.

2. There was never really any evidence that a world without Superman was a terrible place, or at least worse.

3. I didn't care for ANY of the casting! There. I said it. Superman/Clark was too pretty. Lois was too young. Lois' boyfriend/partner was cooler than Superman, and I could NOT get over the fact that he's Cyclops. Sorry. Lex was Kevin Spacey, not Lex. Same with Parker Posey. In fact, I kept thinking of Lash everytime she came on screen. (Hi Lash!) Actually, I kept wondering what kind of Lois Parker would make.

4. They kept showing Superman laying around in space. Yawn. I mean, it looked real, but yawn.

5. Lex's plan was just way too over the top, even for a comic book movie.

6. Superman got beat up by flunkies, henchmen! He NEVER kicked any @$$! That bugged me.

7. HATE that the kid is Superman's! Gross!

That pretty much sums it up. The flying looked real. I'll give that. I was not into it.

Yeah!!! Somebody kvetching! Now I won't feel like Downer Lad by jumping on what could have been.

Agreed, they niether got across that the World didn't need a Savior why trying to make anologies to the Savior nor did they get across that the World did need a Savior after making a premise it didn't. Either way, they blew it.

Simple formuala could have solved this.

Superman tells Lois, hey, I gotta check out if my home planet's still there, see you next movie. Why? Because Superman would do that. He doesn't screw and leave. He makes the breakfast in bed, makes the bed, showers, then leaves telling where he's going. I could also make the conservative case, he's married first. Eh... I don't want to argue that, I'm hoping to get some myself sometime in the year.

Next: the movie starts. Why did Superman "crash" back to Earth? No explanation given. I'll tell you why. Because even though Earth has decided it doesn't NEED a Superman/Savior, the big S on his travels discovers an inter-galactic baddie is headed for Earth and gets his butt handed to him fighting them all the way back so scoots way ahead to warn and help Earth prepare.

Then, the story takes one of two routes.

Earth NEEDS a Savior.
Earth has gone all Old Testiment, the acts the thing, faith means nothing. Because of this, Earth cowers from the coming invasion as no individual could do a thing and basically kicks up heels. S-man is so inspiring and just before he dies, they join in adding just that oomph to put the battle in the favor of the home team. In other words, Independence Day with the big S.

Earth really doesn't NEED a Savior.

S-man battles the baddies taking all upon himself, gets his butt handed to him but Earth comes back to save him and together they work for a hometeam win.

What we got, did neither. It was uninspiring and if anything makes players like Superman and Captain America unique amongst superheroes, they inspire others to be superheroes.


And the bullet in the eye? What? Why? STU-pid. For "gringe" factor? I did like Routh, his acting was good and as a teacher of people his age, he came off older though not the 30 or so he probably should be. His Clark came off 30ish (to me).

Parker as Lois! Doh! How did they miss that? It would have been a great choice. It's so obvious and face it, she doesn't have the boobs to play a henchwomen.

Yeah. It's a good thing Lex couldn't inherit his fortune and put his scheme into motion until after Superman returned.

I don't watch many movies, so I've never seen Parker Posey before. Based on her performance as Kitty, I can't imagine her swapping roles and becoming Lois.

Lois is a very self-assertive, smart, and resourceful person, whereas Kitty was insecure, weak, and turned on Lex only when the opportunity (literally) fell into her lap. In this respect, I thought Parker excelled in the role of Kitty; she was much more convincing as the bad guy's girlfriend than Valerie Perrine's Eve Teschmacher, who didn't strike me as the sort of woman to ally herself with a self-involved loser like Lex.

Miss Teschmacher.

Good memories there.

I said "mEmories." Dirty minds.

The Divine Perrine!

I saw the movie 3 weeks ago, and I still can't decide what I think.

Roger Ebert made a great point in his review -- the movie had NO humor to speak of, so it came off as heavy, leaden, sullen. You can introduce humor without it being self-mocking camp--look at Michael Caine's Alfred in "Batman Begins," or Bale's Bruce Wayne, for that matter.

There were TOO many nods to the first Donner/Reeve film. One would have been fine, but they went too far. It makes Singer and his writers look LAZY, dammit! Come up with some new bits, for Pete's sake! You're paying paid enough, right?

Superman had virtually no dialogue. Routh clearly isn't a bad actor, so what's up with this?

There were a lot of things I liked about the movie. Amazingly, I LIKE Superman having a kid, and the final scene in the kid's room? As a Dad, with a son, I was fighting back tears. I didn't even mind that the kid was kind of a zero. Lot's of kids are that way. One of things I experienced, becoming a father, maybe lots of guys have, is the burden of having to be "Superman" to your kid -- keeping him safe, rescuing him from danger, watching over him, giving him someone to look up to.

I think the filmmakers made a movie about a different question than they thought. The movie's dilemma isn't "Does the world need Superman?" The question they made the movie about was "Does Superman need the world?" Why does he HAVE to be savior? With Lois otherwise "engaged," why does he care? Waid and Ross made this the centerpiece of "Kingdom Come." Singer and crew should have made this more central to their movie.

It's funny. The whole movie I felt a real tension, unease. Perhaps this was unavoidable and intentional -- Superman returns to find Lois DIDN'T wait for him. Ouch! Man, that hurts! Awkward! Can't bear to look. Will Supes fight for his woman or let her go? Will Richard White die conveniently at the end? There was real drama here, but the filmmakers blew it, I think, by not giving us more insight into how the characters were feeling by having them, you know, TALK. It's like Singer, who seems like a real introvert, and apparently feels like an outsider (join the club!) made a movie about how HE feels, not how Superman feels.

But after Superman "acknowledges" his son, and he finally smiles, and you know that he again has a reason to care about the pathetic lifeforms on this mudball, I breathed a sigh of relief. It was like he was finally Superman again, dammit. And a Daddy, to boot.

I wish the film had centered on these issues. So much of it was just a total muddle. Maybe Donner can direct the next one...

In the comic adaptations and I'm sure the extended DVD version there is a scene in Smallville where Ma Kent announces she's engaged to Old Man Hubbard and that they are moving to Montana. Evidently his mother moved on too.

Superman's crisis is that in trying to find Krypton and his 'real roots' he alienated the only people in the universe that he had a chance to be close to. His return is about re-establishing a connection to the people of Earth and more personal scale to the only family he has. Ma Kent, Lois, Jimmy and his son.

i went to see this for a 2nd time [ about 2 weeks ago, now ] and i completely LOVED it again !!

i plan on seeing it a 3rd time this coming Wednesday, and it's in IMAX this time !!

Matthew.