posted
If I'm understanding you correctly Rick, you don't like it when celebrities 'come out' for three reasons -
1. you think the only reason they could ever do so would be as a cheap 'Hollywood' publicity stunt.
2. you believe it's insulting to real gay/lesbian/bisexual people when celebrities pretend to be one of us.
3. you're not gay/lesbian/bisexual so you don't really care about that kind of news and it annoys you when you have to read/hear about it.
As examples to prove your point you used -
* Anne Heche (whose sexuality hasn't been newsworthy in about 15 years) * Portia di Rossi (who has been out for more than a decade and married to Ellen for nearly as long) * Neil Patrick Harris (whose sexuality has been no secret in the theatre scene for years) * Ricky Martin (whose coming out this year suprised exactly no one) * Sean Hayes (see Ricky Martin) and * Anna Paquin.
For point #1 - I'll just repeat what I said earlier, that by that rationale - no actor/actress/musician/whatever celebrity can come out until they have retired lest they be seen as publicity seeking. That's unfair on them.
And essentially forces them to stay in the closet. Which as I'm sure you know from reading that long, other thread - is a very unhealthy place to be.
For point #2 - I get where you're coming from here and I agree with you. I think you just used bad examples.
If Portia di Rossi or Ricky Martin or Neil Patrick Harris are just 'pretending' to be gay for publicity then they're certainly very committed to their roles.
I wonder if, while having sex with their long-term same-sex partners, they're thinking 'I'm totally not actually attracted to you but my agent thinks this might get me a role in that new Michael Bay movie so... <grimace>'
Better examples of annoying 'fake' gay/lesbian/bisexual behaviour would have been Britney Spears or Christina Aguilera or Miley Cyrus and any of their completely-a-publicity-stunt same-sex kisses at recent award shows and concerts.
But none of them actually 'came out' so they wouldn't be pertinent to this conversation.
For point #3 - that's your right and I'm certainly not going to try to change it.
My main purposes in kick-starting this discussion were just to point out that -
a) there really haven't been that many celebrities who have 'come out' in recent years. You've only mentioned 6 and though there are probably a few we've forgotten that is still far, far, FAR less than the number of celebrities who are still hiding in the closet out there.
and
b) when those celebrities do come out it can be for reasons far more important (to themselves and other gay/lesbian/bisexual people) than a mere publicity stunt.
...
As for the bisexual thing - well, I'll just say I would never presume to tell you what your sexual attractions/proclivities are based on watching/talking to some completely different straight people that I happen to know.
From: Australia | Registered: Dec 2003
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posted
B, I don't know what to say here, man. I've tried to explain it. You seem insistent on making it out to be that I think ALL gays/lesbian/bi's that come out are only doing it for the money effect. That isn't what I said, and I'm not gonna try and explain it any better than I have already. YOu asked for people that have come out recently, I named a few. I never said they did it for the fad, I said they have come out. I don't follow the scene. I don't have a handy dandy list of "who's in and who's out in hollywood". Nor would I care to. I also don't carry around a list of "Known Straights". Its something I really don't think about...at all, until I have the news reports literally right in front of me.
And even then I don't care to know. I don't wanna know their politics (Celebrities and politics, attention whores on speed), I don't wanna know their sexual proclivities, I don't wanna know who they are married too, how many babies theyve adopted from russia, africa, south america, poland, new zealand...I dont' wanna know.
For one thing, I don't care. For another, it takes away from the fun of being able to see the work without having a bias about the person. I didn't like Tom Cruise for years. I thought he was a phoney and a flake. Then I saw the couch jumpin'. Havent' seen anything by him since. Same for Mel Gibson.
As for the whole closet thing..again, see my responses there. I think it their choice, as they are adults. Look at the Dr. Quinn, Medicine Woman kid. He made his choice. I respect it. Same for Neil Harris. But others have a right to their choice as well. (If what I heard is true, I particularly respect Harris. That was tough enough.)
Man, this has bummed out this entire thread for me.
"Next, on a very special thread, we all learn valuable life less...." ewwwwww.
-------------------- Damn you, you kids! Get off my lawn or I'm callin' tha cops!
Never one to pass up a trend (especially a raging one), I hereby proclaim myself a bisexual.
cleome, put on your prettiest outfit and get ready to go dancing on boxtops for hours! Or, since you'll probably pick out something completely ghastly, let ME pick out your prettiest outfit. Either way, be prepared to be objectified just as if you were a really hot guy.
Registered: Dec 2006
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Set
There's not a word yet, for old friends who've just met.
posted
quote:Originally posted by rickshaw1: For another, it takes away from the fun of being able to see the work without having a bias about the person.
Whether or not I agree with anything else Rick has said, I totally get this.
Sometimes I like the *work* of an actor, writer, artist, etc. and then he opens his big trap and outs himself as an anti-Semite and I can't admit to liking Lethal Weapon anymore or goes off on a rant about the great psychological conspiracy on Oprah and I have to make sure nobody is looking before I pop Risky Business into the VCR, or make the socially-contracted-caveat of 'of course Tom Cruise is a nutjob, but...'
Drew Barrymore has stated that she finds women beautiful, and that's cool. I don't like her any more or less than I did before. Fifty First Dates is still hilarious. Charlies Angels 2 still sucks ass. Life goes on.
Angelina Jolie remains incomprehensibly erotically hypnotically sexualized, no matter how many orphans she adopts or causes she endorses.
Julia Robert's face (particularly her smile) remains freakish and disturbing to me, and her marital shenanigans don't affect that perception.
The obsessive fascination with celebrity has become the religion of America (and, really, that's nothing new. Marilyn Monroe, James Dean, Ginger Rogers, etc. all had their cults of personality) and the presence of reality shows and Dancing With People You've Probably Never Heard Of But Are Better Than You and E! shallow-bitchy-celebrity-gossip-network has just exacerbated that.
And I'm just as much a victim of this culture, since I'm often excited to see interviews with my favorite comic writers, authors, rock performers, etc.
Shallow is me.
If Anna Paquin likes the boys and the girls, that really doesn't matter to me, since I am not ever gonna be in her bed.
I vaguely recall a psych study of bloodflow to measure arousal in the viewing of 'erotica' that demonstrated that while many males where only slightly aroused by viewing porn of their non-prefered gender (and more so upon viewing their prefered gender), the majority of women tested become equally aroused regardless of the gender of the performers or their stated preferences.
If there's any significance to that research, perhaps Anna Paquin is just voicing an unspoken caveat that, as a woman, the act of lovemaking is more stimulating to her than the presence or absence of a penis.
Registered: Aug 2006
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cleome46
or you can do the confusion 'til your head falls off
posted
quote:Originally posted by Ram Boy:
quote:Originally posted by rickshaw1:
But, its the rage to say that they are "bi".
Never one to pass up a trend (especially a raging one), I hereby proclaim myself a bisexual.
cleome, put on your prettiest outfit and get ready to go dancing on boxtops for hours! Or, since you'll probably pick out something completely ghastly, let ME pick out your prettiest outfit. Either way, be prepared to be objectified just as if you were a really hot guy.
And so, yet another political scandal rocks the very foundations of Legion World.
-------------------- Hey, Kids! My "Cranky and Kitschy" collage art is now viewable on flickr. Drop by and tell me that I sent you.
From: Vanity, OR | Registered: Dec 2008
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cleome46
or you can do the confusion 'til your head falls off
posted
quote:Originally posted by Sarcasm Kid: Robert Downey Jr.
That man rubs me the wrong way and I ain't ashamed to admit it.
I think he mostly elicits the same I tend to produce anytime a roomful of she-fans are going on and on about this week's "sexiest man alive."
He's okay, but I don't break out in a cold sweat just from seeing his picture or anything.
-------------------- Hey, Kids! My "Cranky and Kitschy" collage art is now viewable on flickr. Drop by and tell me that I sent you.
From: Vanity, OR | Registered: Dec 2008
| IP: Logged |
quote:Originally posted by rickshaw1: B, I don't know what to say here, man. I've tried to explain it. You seem insistent on making it out to be that I think ALL gays/lesbian/bi's that come out are only doing it for the money effect. That isn't what I said, and I'm not gonna try and explain it any better than I have already. YOu asked for people that have come out recently, I named a few. I never said they did it for the fad, I said they have come out. I don't follow the scene. I don't have a handy dandy list of "who's in and who's out in hollywood". Nor would I care to. I also don't carry around a list of "Known Straights". Its something I really don't think about...at all, until I have the news reports literally right in front of me.
And even then I don't care to know. I don't wanna know their politics (Celebrities and politics, attention whores on speed), I don't wanna know their sexual proclivities, I don't wanna know who they are married too, how many babies theyve adopted from russia, africa, south america, poland, new zealand...I dont' wanna know.
For one thing, I don't care. For another, it takes away from the fun of being able to see the work without having a bias about the person. I didn't like Tom Cruise for years. I thought he was a phoney and a flake. Then I saw the couch jumpin'. Havent' seen anything by him since. Same for Mel Gibson.
As for the whole closet thing..again, see my responses there. I think it their choice, as they are adults. Look at the Dr. Quinn, Medicine Woman kid. He made his choice. I respect it. Same for Neil Harris. But others have a right to their choice as well. (If what I heard is true, I particularly respect Harris. That was tough enough.)
Man, this has bummed out this entire thread for me.
"Next, on a very special thread, we all learn valuable life less...." ewwwwww.
Rick - this whole thing began when you referred to bisexual people in a condescending way.
When I brought that to your attention you then claimed Anna Paquin was a "poser"/publicity-seeker just because she came out as bisexual and later stated that you were irritated/suspicious when other celebrities came out too.
All I was doing was pointing out that there are plenty of other reasons why a celebrity could come out.
Sorry if this thread has bummed you out. Maybe it's like the way gay/lesbian/bisexual people feel when they read condescending comments made about them?
From: Australia | Registered: Dec 2003
| IP: Logged |
posted
No, I didn't refer to bisexual people in a condescending way...I refered to hollywood posers in a condescending way. And I still do. And yes, I do believe that it was a form of getting attention for AP's show.
There are an infinite multitude of reasons why a celebrity may come out. Harris didn't do it to promote a show. And I never claimed that they all do. I said that the current fad of starlets pretending and posing as for publicity is irritating and irksome. And IT IS.
I would really appreciate it if you didn't attempt to tell me what I meant by what I posted as I do not attempt to do the same to you.
And given how much I have spoken up for gay/lesbian/bi's right here to live and let live, to have the same rights as anyone else, I would have appreciated a bit of the benefit of doubt.
You may not have liked how I said something, but you cannot make everyone happy all the time. I ain't gonna even try. I'm done with this thread.
-------------------- Damn you, you kids! Get off my lawn or I'm callin' tha cops!
I just think in general you aren't big on much of any kind of celebrity/Hollywood stuff. Nothing wrong with that.
For what it is worth, I did find it odd that Anna made her announcement after the announcing of her engagement to her male TRUE BLOOD costar. Weird timing, I think most would agree.
cleome46
or you can do the confusion 'til your head falls off
posted
...the nostalgia Olympics. It's impossible to find a YouTube video of any old song without some commenter having to proclaim how much better the song in question is than everything that's coming out now.
I love old music and I love new music. Every era has its diamonds and its dross;its craftsmen and its hacks. Can we, just once, enjoy something for its own sake without loudly running something else down in the process?
Pretty please?
-------------------- Hey, Kids! My "Cranky and Kitschy" collage art is now viewable on flickr. Drop by and tell me that I sent you.
From: Vanity, OR | Registered: Dec 2008
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