Who is the flying guy? Who is the ninja girl? Who is girl squating? A New Harlquien? Spellbinder?
[ October 13, 2005, 09:15 PM: Message edited by: Lightning Lad ]
Posted by Lightning Lad on :
quote:Originally posted by RTVU2: Who is girl squating? A New Harlquien? Spellbinder?
Could they be bringing back Duella Dent?
Posted by Lightning Lad on :
The one with the claws, the 'ninja girl'. Could that be Mockingbird? The new character they've been hinting at?
Posted by the boy with UltraPowers on :
that BLK/WT cover looks great !! i'm looking forward to all 4 of these "INFINITE CRISIS" mini's !!
the preview pages of the "RANN / THANAGAR WAR" look amazing !! i think IVAN is such a great artist !!
Matthew.
Posted by Fat Cramer on :
"A new printing means infect... I mean, entertaining a whole new group of readers," says Simone. " Now if people say I sold out, I can say it 's a good thing! This has been one of the most fun projects I 've ever worked on, and I think people ' s eyes are going to explode when they see the art by Dale Eaglesham and Wade von Grawbadger. Being bad has never looked so good!"
That's for sure - but I'd watch out for those exploding eyeballs. That could be painful....
Cool cover! I think I'll be getting this one instead of the Luthor & co. one. Have no clue who the three mystery villains are - though the flying guy is kinda familiar. He has a Blue Devil villain look about him to me. Or could he be a Parademon?
Makes me wonder though why they bothered trying to keep their identites secret when no one knows who most of them are anyway. I was hoping the woman with the mask would be Shado from Grell's Green Arrow run but the strange weapons she's using in this image make me think not. And since when has Cheshire ever used a sword?
Like Matthew though I'm really looking forward to this series as well as all the other 3. I really enjoyed Countdown and the opening chapter of the Omac Project and am very excited about where DC's headed at the moment. Though I do wish they'd quit with all the killings and resurrections they've got going on. There've been SO many heroes die or come back to life in the space of such a short time recently that both have completely lost all impact for me.
Posted by MLLASH on :
quote:Originally posted by Lightning Lad:
quote:Originally posted by RTVU2: Who is girl squating? A New Harlquien? Spellbinder?
Could they be bringing back Duella Dent?
Duela has already been brought back in the current arc of TEEN TITANS, and I *really* do NOT want her to become a villainess.
Could this be Marcie, the Harlequin from latter issues of INFINITY INC. that caused the team so much grief in the final issues? Oh, I just HATED her. HATED HER!
Posted by ferroboy on :
quote:Originally posted by Lightning Lad:
quote:Originally posted by RTVU2: Who is girl squating? A New Harlquien? Spellbinder?
Could they be bringing back Duella Dent?
I think she is already back, but this one here looks more like Joker's Daughter from Kingdom Come.
Posted by rickshaw1 on :
my bigger question is...why do i always read "United" as "Untied"?
Villains Untied
Xmen 2: Untied
I don't have dyslexia, but for some reason that word just corkscrews in my head.
Posted by Bicycle Repair Man on :
quote:Originally posted by Blacula: Cool cover! I think I'll be getting this one instead of the Luthor & co. one. Have no clue who the three mystery villains are - though the flying guy is kinda familiar. He has a Blue Devil villain look about him to me. Or could he be a Parademon?
I also thought he looked a little like a Parademon; I just hope he doesn't turn out to be the "All-New, All-Different, Grim-'n-Gritty Ambush Bug!" Posted by Lightning Lad on :
How about an updated Kite-Man?
Posted by Outdoor Miner on :
I like that. Because it sounds so funny.
Posted by Portfolio Boy on :
What I wonder is why the title of the book is "Villains United?" I mean, they are beging referred to as "the society."
So, why not "Secret Society of Super-Villains."
That would have been much cooler (at least to my inner fanboy) and more fitting, IMHO.
Posted by superboymddjr on :
nice cover...but an alternate cover to the real ones: Calculator = Deadshot, Parademon Pharzoof = Black Adam (that's my guess on Parademon...okay?), Lex Luthor = Deathstroke the Terminator, Talia = Cheshire, Dr. Psycho = a possible new female Rag Doll or even a Marcie Cooper Harlequin, and Lex Luthor = maybe Shado (no arrow?) or a REAL Chimera (remember Nightshade from Suicide Squad #1 and #2?)
Neat!!!! Can't wait to get them real soon.
Posted by Rurouni KJS on :
quote:Originally posted by Portfolio Boy: What I wonder is why the title of the book is "Villains United?" I mean, they are beging referred to as "the society."
So, why not "Secret Society of Super-Villains."
That would have been much cooler (at least to my inner fanboy) and more fitting, IMHO.
Think man, THINK! How's it supposed to be a "secret" society if it's got its name plastered all over the cover of the book? I mean, really.
Only a LSH fan would think such a long, unwieldy title could be cool. Legion fans are such DORKS. Posted by Vee on :
That female you are all speculating about seems to have snakes instead of hair. Wasn't there a Medusa or a medusa-like adversary of Wonder Woman? Could that be her?
[ April 27, 2005, 07:31 AM: Message edited by: Vee ]
Posted by superboymddjr on :
someone from DC Message Board pointed out that the female with gauntlet claw is Nyssa Al Ghul, sister of Talia, possible? I never knew that Talia has another sister named Nyssa....anyone knows about her and how it came to be??
Posted by Outdoor Miner on :
I believe she first appeared in the Batman: Death & The Maidens maxi-series from last year. Nyssa was a major player by the end of that but it seemed that was being ignored.
Posted by icefire on :
Hey guys I read this at my comic shop today want me to spoil it????
Posted by superboymddjr on :
YES!!!! go ahead!!! but you can hidden them in a special hypertext or something like that. so someone won't get mad at you.
Posted by Lightning Lad on :
quote:Originally posted by superboymddjr: someone from DC Message Board pointed out that the female with gauntlet claw is Nyssa Al Ghul, sister of Talia, possible? I never knew that Talia has another sister named Nyssa....anyone knows about her and how it came to be??
Nyssa first showed up in the Batman: Death and the Maidens maxi-series. The one that was supposed to get rid of Ras forever. She bascially took the place of her father. But she looked nothing like that female on the cover.
Posted by Nightcrawler on :
quote:Originally posted by icefire: Hey guys I read this at my comic shop today want me to spoil it????
Please Icey!
Posted by Star Boy on :
Is this out already? Did you read a preview copy?
Posted by icefire on :
I read a preview copy!
MAJOR SPOLIERS AHEAD
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Luthor decides to recruit all the villians so we have a recritment drive characters such as Cheetah, Mr Freeze, Phobia, The fadeaway Man, Knockout and many others agree but a few refuse
Deadshot Ragdoll Cheshire Scandal The female with Gauntlet The Fiddler Parademon
The decide to take out H.I.V.E and use there base and tec to overthrow Luthor
The Fiddler is killed and new memeber Catman is brought in.
The art is excellent in this book and I have no idea who Mockingbird is......maybe Batman?
Also Cheshire is told that her daughter Lian has been implanted with a small explosive and that if she gets out of line then kaboom!
Also the former Firestorm villans Bug and Byte are seemingly killed by Deathstroke!
[ April 30, 2005, 08:13 AM: Message edited by: icefire ]
Posted by superboymddjr on :
ah....RAG DOLL!!! I was right! :-) AND.....
WHO is the Scandal?? Poor Bug and Byte...I really liked them....*sigh*
Can't wait to get the issues sooon!!!
Posted by superboymddjr on :
second time that the Fiddler got killed and he needs to STAY DEAD!
Posted by Nightcrawler on :
Fiddler is cool! Golden Age Heroes and Villains are the best. I'm going to miss him.
Thanks for the Spoilers Thomas! You're the best!
[ April 30, 2005, 04:12 PM: Message edited by: Nightcrawler ]
Posted by Lightning Lad on :
Thanks Thomas!
Posted by Star Boy on :
Parademon? As one of many?
Posted by superboymddjr on :
any chance of Parademon's name is Pharzoof?
Posted by Lightning Lad on :
Well Pharzoof did appear in Birds of Prey #12-14. But I bet you are talking about his appearance in Cosmic Justice.
Actually the Pharzoof that appeared in BoP was supposed to be a runt.
Posted by superboymddjr on :
heh yeah exactly the one I was talking about! I have him in my Heroclix box. He 's one of the best generics ever! gotta love him!
Posted by icefire on :
I read this standing in my shop and I don't remember them calling him anything but Parademon!
Posted by icefire on :
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Oh and just a heads up it never says that Bug and Byte are dead but it says something like there will be reprcussions and Bug is slumped over in a chair and Byte is against the wall with Deathstroke's sword at her throat.
But the fiddler is definately dead!
Posted by Nightcrawler on :
Posted by superboymddjr on :
so cross out Bug and Byte from the casuality list?
Posted by Outdoor Miner on :
quote:Originally posted by Nightcrawler:
I concur.
Posted by Mystery Lad on :
Wow-- Catman's a contenduh, all of a sudden! I *liked* him (the artist's rendition didn't hurt-- DC needed it's own Ka-Zar...) So, he was contacting Green Arrow? Wonder what that's about-- could Catman be on the other side of the hero-villain ledger, now?
Which leads to my boneheaded theory about Mockingbird-- I think he or she might slowly be trying to 'turn' six villains into a team fighting for 'good'. Or else he/she's bent on world domination, widespread destruction and general merry mayhem.
I felt sorry for the lions that had adopted Cat-man... for their murder (inferred), Luthor & co. should pay!
The Harlequin-esque character I took to be a *male* Ragdoll... don't know if it's a new one or not. The Parademon seemed to like Rags, regardless.
Who is SCANDAL? Have I missed a previous appearance elsewhere, or is she a mystery to everyone else, too?
I liked this issue. Each of the introductions to the CRISIS COUNTDOWN miniseries have been better than the last. Wonder if RANN/THANAGAR WAR will continue the streak?
Posted by superboymddjr on :
ah....got Manhunter #9 and whoa....add Monocle to the casuality list. good book, by the way.
Posted by Lightning Lad on :
Isn't Scandal supposed to by Nyssa al Ghul?
And the mansion they meet at. Is that supposed to be Caine and Abel's House of Mystery?
Posted by Bevis on :
Is that who Scandal is? I kinda felt like I should know who she is but had no clue. A lot of the characters I didn't recognise but most of them were minor appearances so didn't matter. One of the main characters being a mystery when apperently they shouldn't be doesn't quite work. Also, at the end what continent is Parademon getting? Is that Antarctica? Coz if so, who's getting Australia? And could that be some kind of clue as to who Mockingbird is? Who would want Oz for themselves?
Posted by MLLASH on :
Well I guess I should scrap my FIDDLER vs. HORNBLOWER miniseries proposal!
I am currently rereading the last run of THE TITANS before the current series (Faerber's suff isn't so bad years later and I already liked Grayson's run anyway) and Lian is a MAJOR part of that book. I do *NOT* like hearing that she is in peril. I hope that Arsenal and Cheshire lay the smackdown on someone and get this situation resolved ASAP.
Posted by Cobalt Kid on :
Ok, here's some thoughts:
Overall, I liked it. Lots of intrigue, good writing and I like seeing a lot of good villains used in a smart way. The only thing I hated was seeing Fiddler discarded so casually (this seems to be an ongoing DC theme--overall, I like what's happening, but things keep happening to put a small damper on it, like Blue Beetle and Fiddler killed).
'Mockingbird'- not sure if anyone has posed this theory, but here's who I think: Oracle. It *might* be Batman, but there's no way I'd believe Batman would have Deadshot kill Fiddler so easily. I think it's Oracle. Anyone reading BoP has seen how Brainiac has begun to incluence her, and she has the connections to pull it off. So an Oracle/Brainiac combo may work.
Further, 'Mockingbird' seems to not so subtly suggest her if you think about it (almost too obvious, didn't catch it at first) and Gail writes BoP and Villains United. She also is very manipulative of late and I wouldn't put it past her to be using the six with Brainiac's influence. Of course, this might all be too obvious...
However, I have no idea who Scandal is. Has she appeared before? If not, could it be Lena Luthor, who was working side by side with Brainiac 13 for a bit? Nyssa al Ghul may also be a good choice, although I never read the final issue of that mini when it came out.
Catman as a major player is fun to watch. Anyone wondering about how he changed and why he's connected to Green Arrow will have to check out Brad Meltzer's Green Arrow run which featured Catman heavily.
I love seeing Deadshot and Cheshire, and Ragdoll is a big fave of mine after seeing him in Starman. The Parademon is curious though...could Darkseid be lurking? Wasn't there some sort of Darkseid/Brainiac 13 connection, or am I off? (Our Worlds At War was pretty shitty, so I was't too into the specifics).
Deathstroke is still bad ass and I like it. I also really like Calculator's role in the DCU now--he's a big gun! Talia has long been a favorite of mine, and Dr. Psycho is extremely unlikeable, which is what that group needs anyway. Luthor is way overused (like the Joker), but at least he's being used right.
So far, I'm intrigued...
Also- could the 'traitor' in Outsiders be the one who planted the bomb in Lian? Any ideas who this is? Shift? Indigo, controlled by B13?
Posted by Danny Blaine on :
Judging from the spoilers, I am going to love this. Things like this book and the Dark Detective book almost make me sorry that I have to wait to get my stuff in the mail...
Posted by the boy with UltraPowers on :
i really enjoyed this first issue and i have a feeling that MOCKINGBIRD is ... ORACLE !!??
and it was cool to see CATMAN return [ and as drawn by DALE he looked great !! ] so what did he do in GREEN ARROW's book ??
Matthew.
Posted by DrakeB3004 on :
quote:Originally posted by the boy with UltraPowers: and it was cool to see CATMAN return [ and as drawn by DALE he looked great !! ] so what did he do in GREEN ARROW's book ??
For one thing, he gained a lot of weight. One of the things that bothered me a bit about this issue was just how drastic Catman's transformation was. Gail obviously read his "Green Arrow" appearance, but it was still a bit hard for me to swallow. As drastic as the change was, at least she acknowledges it.
[ May 10, 2005, 11:22 PM: Message edited by: DrakeB3004 ]
Posted by Mystery Lad on :
Spoilers for #2:
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This continues to be the Countdown mini I most enjoy. Catman's mystery deepens-- while he's put in a dire dilemma (by design?) at story's end.
My one complaint is that there might be one mystery-id character too many. Mockingbird, Scandal, Scandal's 'beloved'... I'd like to see at least one revealed before another is added.
Then again, the 'SECRET SIX' *is* being featured. I wonder if SECRET SOCIETY OF SUPER VILLAINS *and* THE SECRET SIX will be titles after IC.
I liked seeing so many villains in that splash page, but introductions really were in order.
The opening scene featuring Catman and Deadshot was especially strong-- and weirdly sexy-- I thought. The Cheshire grin of the eavesdropper was intriguing. Looks like Parademon has quite a thing for Ragdoll.
I would've liked to see the results of Catman's letter to Green Arrow-- maybe next issue?
Crime Doctor was a creepy addition, I thought. Hmmm-- wonder if he and Dr. Moon have a practice going?
If a secret sixer gets 'eliminated', will another villain be quickly recruited?
The end of the issue makes it appear we'll find out soon...
Posted by Nightcrawler on :
quote:Originally posted by Mystery Lad: I liked seeing so many villains in that splash page, but introductions really were in order.
Cheetah, Doctor Polaris, Weather Wizard, Count Vertigo, on top - then, Shadow-Thief, Brutale, Knockout, Captain Nazi, Multiplex (A), Crazy-Quilt, Hellhound, Black Spider, Wizard, Fatality, Killer Frost, Multiplex (B), & Hyena. The Six with their backs to the camera are Parademon, Deadshot, Cheshire, Rag Doll, Catman, & Scandal, of course.
[ August 15, 2005, 02:17 PM: Message edited by: Nightcrawler ]
Posted by Danny Blaine on :
What a kewl looking picture!
Can't wait to read it!
Posted by Tamper Lad on :
I finally got into it the story with issue 2. There were just so many introductions of characters that I wasn't familiar with that I couldn't get in the first issue flow as nicely as the other 3 minis.
But reading the first two issues together, it was amazing. The characters and plot are shaping up great. (Though the drunk chimp in DoV still trumps all.) VU is definitely the most informationally dense of the four minis. Can't wait for the next issue to see what happens next.
Posted by Mystery Lad on :
#3's out...
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Put Catman in an ongoing... now!
Ragdoll's origin is explored... Eyeballs are stuck with hypodermic needles... Crime Doctor gets a Crime Nurse... a FIRESTORM villain is sent to his/her last reward... Count Vertigo, Knockout, Killer Frost, Weather Wizard and Sledge have a 'games night'... Scandal devours a sweet little snack... So does Cheshire (sort of-- or at least promises to...)
I still don't even have a guess as to the IDs of Scandal or Mockingbird . I find the Secret Six fascinating and I hope they have a future beyond VILLAINS UNITED. The leadership of the Secret Society is less interesting (though Black Adam is becoming one of the most intriguing characters in the DCU). I don't believe Talia for a second. Doctor Psycho is comedy relief. Luthor's strangely passive (hmmm...). The Calculator doesn't register, at least this issue. Deathstroke doesn't utter a syllable.
The 'rank and file' of the Society are loads of fun, though. I'm wondering how this is going to match up to JLA... with Star Sapphire, the Wizard, etc. tearing things up.
Posted by superboymddjr on :
I am still surprised that Deadshot and Count Vertigo have not met face to face since the last time Count V asked him to kill him off in the last issue of Suicide Squad. I would love to see Deadshot BANG BANG Count V to death, thus filfulling Count's wish!
Posted by MLLASH on :
Hmm... I prefer The Wizard's "super-hero"ey costume in the current JLA arc, but I think it's fine for him to switch back and forth.
Still haven't gotten a copy of # 2 and 3 but they will be pulled for me. Can't wait!!
Posted by dedman on :
I just digging this for all the 'long time no see' characters we're getting!!!
Posted by Jorg-EM on :
I just read a buddy's first 3 issues of this yesterday. Wow. Yes it is the funnest IC related mini! (i read his OMACs and Vengence stuff as well)
Again I like DC using their past as their strengths. Lots of these guys are lame but I'm a big Catman fan now. I believe his new coolness was very well done bu Gail...that is how you make a character popular. I wonder if writers ever think about that...how can I make this one character a fan fave. Gail does.
I've always been a Cheschire fan. A Parademon fan. The clown guy is cool as the wierdo. Always have liked Deadshot. Scandal? Interesting wanna know more.
Mockingbird I think is none other than Lex Luthor. He killed Catman's pride after learning he was a powerhouse now so he can join the Secret Six. He is playing both sides as usual.
Like the art as well.
Posted by Pov on :
Actually, I was a little disappointed that we're getting fill-in art for a finite series-- the same thing happened in DoV #3, but I know Justiniano's overextended himself with that -and- The Human Race mini. What's Eaglesham's excuse? Is he just that slow?
Still. All in all, this is turning out to be a great series. I wasn't sure about 1 and 2, but the third issue really grabbed me. Gail is a great writer... I just wish she wasn't working with hacks like Byrne and Liefeld, or I'd be buying ALL her stuff... Posted by Invisible Brainiac on :
Wow, this does look cool.
Posted by Caliente on :
Is anybody else wondering how the heck Nightwing is supposed to tie into Villains United??
Maybe I'm missing something or something...
Posted by Tamper Lad on :
quote:Originally posted by Pov: Actually, I was a little disappointed that we're getting fill-in art for a finite series-- the same thing happened in DoV #3, but I know Justiniano's overextended himself with that -and- The Human Race mini. What's Eaglesham's excuse? Is he just that slow?
Apparently Eaglesham came down with a case of scarlet fever which is why there was a fill in for number 3. Don't know the status of the upcoming issues though.
Posted by Pov on :
Thanks, Tamper; A poster on another board confirmed this, saying he'd seen it on Geoff Johns' boards. According to that poster, Eaglesham's back at the drawing board, with #4 in the can already.
Scarlet Fever? WTF?! Did he travel to Africa for reference in issue 1??? Posted by Pov on :
quote:Originally posted by Caliente: Is anybody else wondering how the heck Nightwing is supposed to tie into Villains United??
Maybe I'm missing something or something...
There was a villain in it! Duh!
Stupid cheap tie-in attempt, more like... or maybe Grayson was supposed to actually WRITE it so it tied in, but screwed it up as usual... Posted by Tamper Lad on :
quote:Originally posted by Pov: Scarlet Fever? WTF?! Did he travel to Africa for reference in issue 1???
They probably had to burn his Velveteen Rabbit.
Scarlet Fever is a strep throat infection in the skin. Don't hear about it often these days.
Posted by MLLASH on :
Just-- FINALLY-- read # 2 & 3!
I'd always supported the idea of Geoff Johns writing a Secret Society of Super-Villains comic, but...
GIVE THE JOB TO GAIL SIMONE.
This mini has been so wildly successful that I can't imagine there won't be at least ONE VU-related comic after InfCrisis. Will it be SECRET SIX? SSOSV? I must know NOW!
The fill-in was okay but I was disappointed right off that it wasn't Eaglesham.
I was on limited funds and had to pick & choose which comics from my pull to buy this week. As much as I'm enjoying all of the IC minis, it was VU that I chose to get now.
This book is SMOKIN'. Both issues kicked ass.
I was glad Knockout's softer side was played on-- I half expected her to intervene of the Six's behalf.
The Ragdoll/Parademon relationship is interesting. Deadshot has surpassed his SUICIDE SQUAD heyday. Cheshire rocks. Catman is a TOTAL BABE.
Posted by Cobalt Kid on :
Just read #4.
And hot damn! More action, more hints and more 'that was f*cking awesome!'.
Catman has become the man and more and more of his character is being revealed. Loving Deadshot and Cheshire here too, and the consitent reminder that Cheshire is one of DC's worst human beings.
Interested on if Scandal is indeed Nyssa al Ghul, and what secrets lie ahead in regards to her and Mockingbird (Oracle/Brainiac? Luthor? Joker?).
I also like the subtle way that Simone shows us that the torture in the previous issue has now created a genuine bond in the six. They certainly don't trust each other, but they now have a real loyalty to one another despite themselves after going through that together.
Posted by 235 - Andy S on :
absolutely loving this series -- hoping to see more of Simone's lovely nightmares after this mini
RAG DOLL & PARADEMON are priceless CATMAN is sexy as #@)(# (and that's a feat) SCANDAL gets better each issue DEADSHOT is one of my absolute favorites FIDDLER had to go sometime - street villainy is a young person's game
MOCKINGBIRD? the joker probably (or Calculator)
CHESHIRE has been over-used IMO ... and i really wish she'd change that awful 1980s outfit (which is vaguely reminiscent of Patty Smythe's get-up when she was in the rock group Scandal singing "Warrior" .. minus the blue eyeshadow)
ummm... now to read everyone else's posts !
Posted by MLLASH on :
I read # 4. Another winner. I know all this positive reveiws may get dull, but seriously, there isn't much-- if anything-- to bitch about. This $#!+ is freakin' SMOKIN'.
Posted by 235 - Andy S on :
OKAY, i think i've worked out who Mockingbird is: Ra's Al Ghul evidence? -- the biological weapons found by the Secret Society were, in Luthor's estimation, made by a genius ... Ra's has used biological weapons before and he is one of the greatest terrorists extant
-- the actions of Nyssa (with the League of Assassins in Batgirl) and Talia (with HIVE, KOBRA and the Secret Society of Supervillains) could be part of Ra's greater vision in redefining the globe (and its populations) ... whether Nyssa or Talia were aware of it or not
-- Scandal could be an Ubu ... we know that Ubu's are a family of Ra's followers/servants/enforcers (one way to look at her actions with the Secret Six) ... and she did call Mockingbird "Beloved" just as Talia does with Bruce -- it could be the way that this clan identifies their life-partner
-- getting access to the House of Secrets is within Ra's Al Ghul's possibilities (he does use Lazarus Pits and other quasi-mystical artifacts) ... AND it could be the way that he escaped certain death at the hands of Nyssa before
anyways, that's my thoughts on the matter
[ August 22, 2005, 09:18 PM: Message edited by: 235 - Andy S ]
Posted by Lightning Lad on :
Sounds very plausible Andy. Except DC did promise that the last Ra's story would be the Death and the Maidens maxi (did they ever finish that thing?). But it wouldn't be the first time they lied to us.
Posted by Jorg-EM on :
I love this series. Catman is the man!
Great example of a write actually taking the time to think "how can i make this lame character really popular?" versus making this "team" very popular.
Marvel has done it with Wolverine. I am suprised we don't see more characters get a push like this. Doesn't take much.
Anyways, I still think Mockingbird is Lex Luthor but that is just so obvious.
I am in love with Talia and Cheschire...the dangerous women. *sigh*
Posted by 235 - Andy S on :
quote:Originally posted by Jorg-EM: I am in love with Talia and Cheschire...the dangerous women. *sigh*
i know what u mean (Shiva being my fave villain/anti-hero)
the Scandal/Fatality fight was shocking and great
put Scandal right up there with Cheshire IMO
Posted by 235 - Andy S on :
Cheshire = WORSE. MOTHER. EVER.
Posted by ferroboy on :
Agreed, Andy. Horrible. Not that Catman is looking much better as a father.
[ September 10, 2005, 09:28 AM: Message edited by: ferroboy ]
Posted by superboymddjr on :
no one got UV#5 yet? Thought that they are out now?
Posted by Stargazer on :
I have issue #5 and it rocked. Was not expecting the traitor to be who it was..actually had someone else in mind.
( no names were mentioned in this post just in case you have not read the issue)
Posted by Stealth on :
When it rains at my local comics shop, it pours. I bought # 1 and # 2 on schedule, then got # 3, # 4, and # 5 at the same time yesterday.
This is a great story, although it's a little too heavy on the gross-outs for me. And after reading this thread, some of the things I was confused about are clearer.
One thing I'm still confused about: is Monsieur Mallah dead? I hope not, I've always liked all the talking ape characters. I hope Talia wasn't being completely sarcastic when she said Mallah was "fine."
Posted by MLLASH on :
I read # 5.
Stealth, Mallah's very much alive and appears on the last page double spread (complete with bandaged ear).
Well, this goes against Cheshire's most recent portrayals in the last TITANS series, but this Cheshire is SOOOOOO deliciously evil. Still not keen on the danger Lian is in.
So. Scandal's a lesbian. Trendy!!
# 5 was another great read!
Posted by Cobalt Kid on :
Cheshire appears to be very 'Cheshire' right here--what a evil, horrible villain! Despicable, but this makes her so much a better character.
The reveal about Deadshot and Catman: another thing I didn't see coming, and another great, very fitting twist!
But wow!!! Pariah and Lady Quark! DIRECT Lead in to Crisis? Does Luthor somehow remember now? Is he trying to do something involving Crisis (restore the multiverse? Use the Anti-Monitor? He must have some help, right...?)
So who is Mockingbird? Pariah makes mention of another Apex Predator on Earth, worse than Luthor, which most likely is him. It can't be a let down though, which basically eliminates the usual suspects, Ra's Al Ghul, Brainiac, Darkseid, etc. I'm a bit stumped now...
Posted by MLLASH on :
Jillikers! Totally forgot to mention the apparently-retconned-out death of LADY QUARK! YAY, she's back! Although I think she should have given Sinestro more a run for his money.
As for Pariah, the "weepy" comment made me giggle. I hope HE bites it in Infinite Crisis!
[ September 11, 2005, 12:21 PM: Message edited by: MLLASH ]
Posted by Cobalt Kid on :
The 'weepy' comment totally reminded me of Lardy and his Hot Summer Nights execution of Pariah
I'm all for Lady Quark miracously being alive again! I once christened myself as the Lady Quark of LW for a time!
Posted by Mystery Lad on :
Hmmm- if Mockingbird is actually Cheshire, then she wouldn't be quite as eee-vil as she seems at this story's end. Which would be a neat twist, though I agree her despicability was delicious.
Hope #6 ends this mini with a bang.
What about Ragdoll!!!?? Gotta admire the commitment there, in a way.
Posted by Quislet, Esq. on :
Did people see the original Ragdoll in the group attacking the Secret Six?
I just hope that I am not disappointed when we do discover Mockingbird's identity. Hmm Ra's could be cool. That would make Talia a spy in the Society
Posted by SLK on :
From the "were'nt They Dead?" Dept:
Ok, last I saw Lady Quark was dead, but wasn't Shimmer from the Fearsome Five also a goner recently? And where's Gizmo? What, we can't have more than one evil midget in a comic or something? And the last time I saw Psimon he was getting his head blown off by Brainiac back in the Crisis. Heck, the last time I saw Mallah, he blew up in Doom Patrol when he revealed his love for the Brain! (Ewww) Oh well. I don't mind seeing any of them again!
Speaking of the Fearsome Five - isn't that Dr. Light's old team? Since all of the players of the first Crisis seem to be coming back for part two, I wonder if we'll see Psimon try any tricks in taking over this Society.
Cheshire's double-cross was a really unexpected twist. I was beginning to worry that the Six were starting to appear a bit too goody for being villains. Same with Deadshot. His revelation really brought out the fact that even though we might be rooting for them, they sure aren't the good guys.
My only problem with the series, though, is that there isn't enough focus on the six leaders of the Society. I'd really like to know what would motivate a quasi-hero like Black Adam to work with a mercenary like Deathstroke and a serial rapist like Dr. Psycho. In fact, as much as I like the Psycho appearances, just what the heck is he doing with this group? Each of the others seem more civilized and orderly, but this guy is a freakin', twisted sicko. And just who the heck is Talia anyway?
Great series. Can't wait for the last issue, though I have to think that things won't go well for some of these characters. I predict a slaughter of the Six in issue 6 with only Deadshot and Cheshire making it out alive.
BTW - Mockingbird looks like he has a bald head and sort of pointy ears that stick out. My first guess would be Universo, but obviously that just ain't it. Lessee, who else is bald and has funny ears. Could it be...
Sivana?!?!?!
[ September 11, 2005, 07:08 PM: Message edited by: SLK ]
Posted by Outdoor Miner on :
That's an option.
Another possibility is that it's Luthor, playing both sides off against each other for his own reasons.
Posted by MLLASH on :
They would be idiots to off CATMAN at this point. I've a feeling he'll be around for whatever ongoing spins out of this hugely succesful mini.
Sivana-- I hadn't thought of that. Good idea! Cheshire? Another wicked-cool idea.
Shimmer was returned to life BY Sivana early on in the current OUTSIDERS run, and Gizmo was killed by him also.
Posted by superboymddjr on :
well, there was a confusion that Lady Quark were supposed to come back alive in the LEGION series a while back but was cut off abruptly by the crossovers with Zero Hour.
Also Harbinger is expected to come back somehow so according to Jeph Loeb or someone who mentioned "wait and you see, there is a reason Harbinger will play a role.......".
Monsier Mallah and the Brain were brought back alive due to unrevealed circumstances in issues of Young Justice around #50.
Posted by Quislet, Esq. on :
SLK,
Talia is Ra's Al Ghul's daughter.
Posted by Vee on :
Still think Monkingbird is the Joker, he also is an evil genius and could pull this off. But Sivana is an interesting possibility.
Cheshire needs to pay a price here. I hope it's painful.
Posted by Stealth on :
quote:Originally posted by MLLASH:
Stealth, Mallah's very much alive and appears on the last page double spread (complete with bandaged ear).
Thanks, Lash. I'll take another look at that page. I wasn't feeling well on Saturday night and I read those issues with a cloudy head.
Posted by SLK on :
quote:Originally posted by Quislet, Esq.: SLK,
Talia is Ra's Al Ghul's daughter.
Thanks, Quislet. I think I knew that but not being a regular Batman reader, forgot it. So what's her story? Is she picking up right where her dad left off? She doesn't strike me as the really evil villainess type.
Posted by legionadventureman on :
I think Talia is an example of a person who doesnt choose sides, but goes where the mood - or man - strikes her.
Posted by 235 - Andy S on :
Luthor's Recipe for HOW TO BUILD A BETTER WORLD (rather than a Finer one or WHY THE SSV?): To build a society, you tend to need recognition as a sovereign society, as well as negotiaters, procurement specialists, law enforcers, and laborers. #1) Talia - After proving herself stable and cunning as head of Lexcorp while Lex was President, she apparently took over Kobra & the HIVE, in addition to any part of her father's empire she may have inherited with her sister Nyssa. She is very familiar with Batman and skilled enough on her own to sneak into the JLA Watchtower. She provides much of the footsoldiers for the SSV, as well as an integral counter to the Bat.
#2) Black Adam - Ruler of his own country and as powerful as Superman, Black Adam provides some diplomatic and physical muscle to the SSV. His strength of character makes him far easier for Lex to handle than, say, Grodd or Bialyan's current ruler. As counter to the sheer power of Superman, Captain Marvel or Wonder Woman, Black Adam makes a vital general in Lex's army.
#3) Calculator - Connected to every part of the anti-establishment meta world, the Calculator's vast network keeps the SSV informed of their constituent's actions, needs and potential threats. An extraordinary intellect matched with a dull ambition, the Calculator plays a necessary second to Lex's analysis.
#4) Deathstroke - The perfect assassin, able to stand off against the Justice League alone for a credible amount of time. Luthor's enforcer, as well as a capable strategist in his own right, Deathstroke is the supervillain's uberman.
#5) Dr. Psycho - Every society has its healers; the SSV has him. Able to provide insight into the character and motivation of their consituents and enemies, Dr. Psycho has the added capacity to counter the mental might of the Martian.
For Luthor, these are useful (and manageable) tools in his quest for global domination (which is a restructuring of current society into one more akin to his). After all, the Scarecrow, Nyssa, Grodd, Prometheus, Brother Blood, Mordru or Shiva could all easily serve as alternates, but they are not as versatile or more difficult to keep in line than the ones he chose.
The Secret 6 could easily be Luthor's "boogey man" to keep the SSV in line (anyone else find the SSV's 'vote' a mite too staged). Alternately, Mockingbird could be a past ally of Luthor's who disagrees with his vision of the world (Ra's Al Ghul, Sivana, the Contessa, Lena Luthor and Joker being but a few ... the man has burned his fair share of bridges).
Anyways, just some thoughts as we approach THE FINAL ISSUE!?!?!
Posted by SLK on :
Great analysis, Andy! You give good reasoning and purpose to the presence of the main Society members. I'm still not completely sold on Psycho, though. I'm still having a very hard time seeing Black Adam working side by side with him.
Posted by superboymddjr on :
methinks about Cheshire.....something's funny going on around her....is she really a Mockingbird? or what? I dunno....I will wait til the final issue to find out the revelations.
Posted by Jorg-EM on :
Psycho just seems like the token Wonder Woman villain. I mean they brought him back for a good story recently and basically we should never see him again.
The Cheetah on the other hand I love.
Posted by 235 - Andy S on :
i think there's something really strange about the whole midget sex predator thing
Posted by Lightning Lad on :
If anyone gets the last issue today (I won't see mine for 3 weeks probably), spoil away the identity of Mockingbird. Either here or just a quick PM would be appreciated.
Posted by Stratum on :
Just picked it up.....wow. Just wow.
I'll PM you LL.
Jamie
Posted by Lightning Lad on :
Thanks to both Stratum and Tamper Lad who spoiled it for me. Very interesting. Posted by SLK on :
Wow!
I don't really know what to say about this except... wow!!
Best ending to a story I have read in a long time. I didn't even like this series for the first 3 issues or so. The bloodbath I predicted didn't quite occur, but came close. This was a very exciting comic, and I think actually outdid Infinite Crisis #1 which also came out this week.
The revelation of Mockingbird didn't come as a comnplete surprise to me. But it was still an interesting twist. This ended up as my favorite of all of the lead-ins to Infinite Crisis. It did its job. I'm very excited to see more!!
Posted by Invisible Brainiac on :
Anyone wanna spoil Mockingbird's identity for me too?
Posted by Invisible Brainiac on :
Thanks to ferroboy and Lightning Lad for spoiling it for me. Whoo, now I'm really interested.
Posted by CJ Taylor on :
This series was a wild ride, and this issue ended it quite well. And end it did, more so than any other Countdown mini. The big throwdown had some incredible moments, and we got to see each of our "heroes" really step up as an individual and show why they are badass.
Deadshot vs Deathstroke - I think that was the most expected confrontation and delivered a hell of a pay off.
Chesire turned traitor and got well rewarded for it. And Gail really made me like her as a villain.
The epilouge was good, and really gave us another POV to the JLA's mindwipe solution. And seeing who walks away... the best idea for a new series to come out of this IC business!
About the only letdown for me from all of this- Mockingbird's identity. AUGH! I hate keeping track of multiple versions of a character. Sort of like multiple Earths.
Posted by MLLASH on :
There's another Luthor? Since when? This is what I get for not reading SUPERMAN titles, isn't it?
VU was fantastic, easily the best of the 5 IC lead-ins (I count TRO Donna Troy).
As CJ stated, this mini-- unlike the others-- can stand completely alone as a story, something I greatly appreciated. Good for Gail.
I just ***KNEW*** something was up with Knockout during that torture issue previously. That was a nice surprise.
Cheshire, shot? I rather enjoyed that.
And Pariah's dead! YAY!!!!!!!!!
Posted by DrakeB3004 on :
quote:Originally posted by MLLASH: And Pariah's dead! YAY!!!!!!!!!
For some reason I doubt that poor bastard's troubles are over...
Cheshire biting it was a bit of a surprise and the battle royal was cool. I didn't quite buy the Deathstroke/ Deadshot duel though. Deathstroke's fighting ability should've totally put him over Deadshot (he's a marksman, but not a great fighter). You'd think Deashot would go for the head at least. Just a quibble though -- I probably enjoyed this mini more than the other pre-Crisis minis.
Posted by legionadventureman on :
Pariah's dead? really? No more crying spells for him...As for Cheshire, what will become of hers and Roy's daughter, Lian, if Arsenal can't take care of her?
Posted by Lightning Lad on :
Since we are spoiling here I adjusted the title. And since that cat is out of the bag, Luthor was Mockingbird.
But, I think it was our Luthor (the regular DCU Luthor) who was Mockingbird. The Luthor leading the Society is the Earth-1 version.
What I am unsure about is if Luthor E-1 has been around for awhile, even as the President or if he was just covering himself talking about how he appropriated the money for the spy satellites.
Posted by DrakeB3004 on :
(odd, I could've sworn I posted a response on this thread last night .... here it is again):
Since "Mockingbird Luthor" had the armor, I'm going with the notion that he was in "Batman/Superman" and his "there's a crisis coming" statement was the last real time we saw him until now. But that's just a working theory since I'm not totally up on Luthor's recent appearances.
Posted by Tamper Lad on :
That's the rub how do we know which Luthor was which in any post-crisis appearance? Obviously both Luthor's knew the other was around. They could have been sabotaging each other's schemes since Byrne's "Man of Steel" for all we know.
This looks like a job for Wolfman's Infinite Crisis: Secret Files to explain.
Posted by Reboot on :
Wouldn't it make more sense for the fridge-armour Luthor to not be the DCU one?
Posted by Tamper Lad on :
They've both been going after the fridge armour. There was an issue of Titans where two competing groups of villains were contracted to recover it. The Society Lex is Pre-crisis, he's the one that told Psycho Pirate to go reclaim his sanity in JSA:C.
So which Lex had the fridge armour to begin with? It was President Lex but that supports neither argument.
Posted by ferroboy on :
quote:Originally posted by Lightning Lad: But, I think it was our Luthor (the regular DCU Luthor) who was Mockingbird. The Luthor leading the Society is the Earth-1 version.
He pretty much said that was the case when Society Luthor revealed that he was the "other" Luthor.
Posted by Mystery Lad on :
This was a fun miniseries- with an actual ending!
I'm a *tad* disappointed that Mockingbird turned out to be Luthor. Mainly due to a bit of 'Luthor fatigue', similar to what I felt about the Joker a couple of years ago.
That's just a personal preferance, though. The story hangs together pretty well- though the multiple Luthor's requires more explanation. Coming in the INIFINTE series, I'm sure (guess it wasn't so complete an ending, after all).
Big surprises- Knockout (bet the fanboys won't be up in arms about her 'about face'-- imagine if it'd been Catman and Green Arrow who'd been secret lovers...), Cheshire's fate, poor Parademon, Ragdoll's unmasked face.
Can't wait to see what's in store for Catman and Deadshot-- 'saints or sinners', huh? Wonder if one or both of these guys will be featured players in the '52' series? When the 'year skip' plays out, it'll be interesting to see what roles these characters will be playing in the 'new' DCU.
I still haven't quite wrapped my head around the Scandal Savage revelation. Kind of doesn't make sense in regards to the most recent Vandal Savage stories I remember.
Did VS want to protect his daughter just to keep those valuable organs safe- or does he actually bear some affection for her?
And doesn't this make her related to Roy Harper and thus to Lian?
Posted by DrakeB3004 on :
Regarding the two Luthors, it's not definite that one of them is pre-crisis is it? We assume because of "Infinite Crisis." But what was the deal with Luthor being in a clone body? Isn't that when he lost weight and temporarily had hair? The Luthor with the armor has the pudge of the Byrne Luthor. I'm just musing, since I'm not really up on Superman lore...(or maybe the cover is an indicator that the fake Luthor is the one from "Smallville"! Now that's a crossover...)
Posted by ferroboy on :
quote:Originally posted by Mystery Lad: Did VS want to protect his daughter just to keep those valuable organs safe- or does he actually bear some affection for her?
And doesn't this make her related to Roy Harper and thus to Lian?
Weren't the others that Savage harvested his descendents? That's a bit different than an actual daughter.
Is Roy related to Vandal? I didn't know that.
Posted by CJ Taylor on :
In the Arsenal mini a few years ago, it was revealed that Vandal was a distant anscestor of Roy. With only a few panels this series, I've become more interested in Vandal's schemes than Luthor's
I've re-read all my books this week, and VU is right behind Hawkman for my favourite. CatMan and Deadshot are the new heroes for hire. Keep Scandal and Ragdoll in the mix; Gail wrote some fine work here.
Posted by Cobalt Kid on :
Loved this series, and I think it had the best ending of any of the minies.
I would so buy a Catman/Deadshot book! I hope they stay partners and have a series. They (and Cheshire) really stole the show in this mini.
I understood it as the Society Luthor is the Earth-1 Luthor and the armor one is the post-crisis Luthor (although Reboot's arguement makes sense even though it wasn't done that way). Loved the surprise and I was totally shocked.
So Luthor of Earth-1? Pure villainy. Just when Superman of Earth-2 shows up and we have 'the real greatest hero', we now have 'the real most evil villain'. Cool!
Posted by Mystery Lad on :
quote:Originally posted by CJ Taylor: In the Arsenal mini a few years ago, it was revealed that Vandal was a distant anscestor of Roy. With only a few panels this series, I've become more interested in Vandal's schemes than Luthor's
Me, too-- largely because Vandal Savage hasn't been used much in the last couple of years... after a period of many appearances.
Though the updated GA villains over in HAWKMAN and the regrouped SSOSV in JLA are *really* who I want to see menace the DCU for the next few years.
Posted by Povolero on :
And now, from the House of (Someone else's) Ideas--
LitG is reporting this tidbit:
"FANTASY JOB
Fred Van Lente, Marvel writer for "Amazing Fantasy," has announced on the Cindy Center podcast that he's relaunching "Super-Villain Team-Up" for Marvel this summer…
I suppose the pitch meeting went like this:
"Gee, DC sure is having alot of success dusting off their 70's villain stuff... why don't WE try it???"
From the great minds that brought you IDENTITY DISC and yet another X-Men alt-Earth story.... jeesh...
Posted by CJ Taylor on :
Anyone else get the special?
Posted by superboymddjr on :
not pleased.....too many dead villains coming back alive without explanations - Capt Nazi, Amos Fortune, Bolt, and many others. i wish somebody keeps a track of every villains who s dead and who s alive. argh! Posted by Stratum on :
At first I liked it but upon further reading, realized that this whole special could have been told in a few panels of the main IC book.
DC had it's revenge on us. VU was the only prequel series that had an actual ending. So far, this is the only one of those specials that did not have an actual ending.
I did like seeing a lot of villains and heroes come out of the woodwork. El Diablo?
Loose Cannon actually makes his second appearance in IC....whodathunkit?
Jamie
Posted by Matthew E on :
I could really use some annotations for the VU special. I don't know who a great deal of those people were.
(But look! Halo! How've you been?)
Posted by Stratum on :
I got to say that I immediately thought of Titans East when I saw that panel.
I know a lot of obscure characters but there were some that even I didn't know/remember.
Jamie
Posted by Cobalt Kid on :
I loved it. There was a genuine tension in this issue that just built and built. What a damn well written comic! I can't wait for the battle! The scene were J'Onn gives Oracle the list of missing heroes was as intense as it gets.
Reading comics from age 7 and having access to all DCs and Marvels since 1958 has given me the benefit of knowing all of them (well, almost all). I'll do the heroes to let you know who was who (some will be obvious):
pg. 16 - Oracle and Robin pg. 17 - Black Canary, Black Lightning, Huntress pg. 18 - Detective Marcus Driver of Gotham Central (shooting Croc) pg. 21 - Vixen and Argus (Bloodlines hero introduced in Flash annual) pg. 24 - Martian Manhunter pg. 25 - El Diablo (not in costume yet), Geist (not in costume yet - Bloodlines hero), Manhunter, Skyrocket (of the Power Company) pg. 26 panel 1- Halo, Arsenal, Joto (Titan), Flamebird, Sparxx (of 'Superboy and the Ravers', also Superboy's bloodlines hero when he was 'Superman'), Tin (Metal Men), purple bird (this one I don't know) page 26 panel 2 - Crimson Avenger, Agent Liberty, Plastic Man, Black Canary, Black Lightning and Time Masters? (this one not sure of. At first I thought it was the Challengers of the Unknown) page 27 - Green Arrow, El Diablo (now in costume), Looker (of original Outsiders), Loose Cannon (his 2nd appearance in IC!) pg. 30 - clockwise:Hawk & Dove, former Rocket Reds, Cinnamen? (gun-slinging girl?), someone I do not know (Global Guardian?), Judomaster, Question, Nightshade, Geo-Force, Rising Sun, Fire, Martian Manhunter pg. 31 - Lionheart (bloodlines JLE hero), Hawk & Dove, gun-slinging girl again, Black Adam pg. 33 - Rocket Reds (now armored), Thunder & Lightning pg. 39 - Black Alice pg. 42 panel 1 - Black Lightning, Vixen, Fire, Odd Man (1960's Ditko creation), Flamebird, Dr. Midnight, Green Arrow, Grace, the Creeper, Steel (John Henry Iron's niece), Geist (now in costume) pg. 42 panel 2 - Detective Turpin of Metropolis (Kirby creation), Head of Metropolis special unit recently introduced in Adv. of Superman (not sure what her name is), Razorsharp (Bloodlines hero from Robin), Arsenal, Martian Manhunter, Joto, Guardian (7 Soldiers version), Gunfire (Bloodlines hero who had own comic in 90's), Black Canary, Sparxx, Black Lightning pg. 42 panel 3 - Mr. Terrific, Manhunter, Empress (from Young Justice), Hourman III, Faith, Question, Tin (Metal Men), Nightshade, Ragman, Metamorpho
Yes, this comic wins for having the most obscure heroes in it. Awesome.
The villains someone else could do Posted by Stratum on :
quote:Originally posted by Cobalt Kid: page 26 panel 2 - Crimson Avenger, Agent Liberty, Plastic Man, Black Canary, Black Lightning and Time Masters? (this one not sure of. At first I thought it was the Challengers of the Unknown)
The villains someone else could do [/QB]
Cobie, I thought that was the Challengers, as well. Sure looked like them. Most of the heroes I knew but there are some really obscure villains in there.
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