quote:Originally posted by LardLad: I should clarify a bit that I'm not necessarily a Kendra hater, really. I just prefer Shayera in that role and feel Kendra was really unnecessary with the other character still around, especially as she was a favorite of mine. I guess they created Kendra because she was a lot different in her nature than Hawkman would be as they eventually reintroduced him. If it was Shayera, the two really would've been more alike than different.
Thank you for clarifying that. And I apologize if my last post seemed a bit curt. I didn't mean it that way. It's so hard to get across a clear "tone of voice" on a message board.
posted
Didio said the DCU catches up to FC in March. So sometime this month, they will be missing.
It wasn't the most obvious, seeing as how Supes wished for a happy ending. But apparently they are gone, and Mr Terrific is on another Earth.
From: Denver, CO | Registered: May 2004
| IP: Logged |
quote:Originally posted by CJ Taylor: I think most folks, myself included, enjoyed Shay as much if not more than Katar. When they brought Carter back, they could have paired him with Shay. That would have been a great mix of both couples.
Shay was the best part of Hawkworld in many ways. Having Kendra in JSA # 1 raised a big red flag for Hawkworld lovers and signalled a change was in the wind. I think Goyer had a clear idea from the beginning what was in store for Hawkman and planted Kendra in there as the seed. They saved the actual storyline for a couple of years later to put some separation between Katar and the new version.
I'm still amazed (but not sad) that it hasn't been ret-conned out like Byrne's Man of Steel and countless other elements from early post-Crisis.
quote:Originally posted by Stealth: Thank you for clarifying that. And I apologize if my last post seemed a bit curt. I didn't mean it that way. It's so hard to get across a clear "tone of voice" on a message board.
I actually didn't take it that way, especially as you used the words "politely disagree " in your response. I can respect that 100%! But I did still felt the need to clarify my views on Kendra, especially as I came across feeling she was a total train wreck. And that wasn't exactly how I feel about her.
-------------------- "Suck it, depressos!"--M. Lash
From: The Underbelly of Society | Registered: Jul 2003
| IP: Logged |
quote:Originally posted by CJ Taylor: Didio said the DCU catches up to FC in March. So sometime this month, they will be missing.
It wasn't the most obvious, seeing as how Supes wished for a happy ending. But apparently they are gone, and Mr Terrific is on another Earth.
The same Wikipedia stuff I read quoted Johns as saying the Hawks will still be alive at the beginning of Blackest Night. What that mean, I have no clue. But killing the Hawks is not what I want at all. I'd rather they continue with Carter and Kendra than kill them off & make them Black Lanterns or do another effin' ret-con on them!!!
-------------------- "Suck it, depressos!"--M. Lash
From: The Underbelly of Society | Registered: Jul 2003
| IP: Logged |
posted
It just occured to me -- Peter David would write a great Kendra, especially given how his take on Siryn has more than a little in common with Kendra. Damn that Marvel-exclusive contract. And damn DiDio for making PAD feel unwelcome at DC.
posted
I really liked the Hawkman series a few years ago. I loved that the Golden Age version of a fairly major character was considered the version in the DCU. Unfortunately, it really tanked after Johns left it.
I also liked how the Hawks and Dr. Fate were handled at the same time in JSA. There was always the tension of "In another life, we were a family". The relationship between Hector and Kendra, who were cousins biologically, but really mother and son, really should have been explored more fully. Hector Hall is one of my favorite characters and I always felt his death toward the end of the JSA run was one of the most pointless deaths in all of comics. They essentially killed him off to make way for a "new" version of Dr. Fate and when was the last time we saw him? And this was right after he and Lyta were reunited and seemed to be happy, for once.
Oh well. It's not the first time Hector has been killed. Actually, I think it's the third.
-------------------- The only character in all of literature who has been described as "badnass" while using the phrase "vile miscreant."
From: The Pyngwyn Colonies of Planet Hyustyn | Registered: Aug 2005
| IP: Logged |
quote:Originally posted by Stealth: It just occured to me -- Peter David would write a great Kendra, especially given how his take on Siryn has more than a little in common with Kendra. Damn that Marvel-exclusive contract. And damn DiDio for making PAD feel unwelcome at DC.
Yeah, he could. But I wouldn't blame PAD for staying away (even after his exclusive ends) after what was done to his Supergirl and Fallen Angel series.
-------------------- "Suck it, depressos!"--M. Lash
From: The Underbelly of Society | Registered: Jul 2003
| IP: Logged |
quote:Originally posted by Rockhopper Lad: I also liked how the Hawks and Dr. Fate were handled at the same time in JSA. There was always the tension of "In another life, we were a family". The relationship between Hector and Kendra, who were cousins biologically, but really mother and son, really should have been explored more fully. Hector Hall is one of my favorite characters and I always felt his death toward the end of the JSA run was one of the most pointless deaths in all of comics. They essentially killed him off to make way for a "new" version of Dr. Fate and when was the last time we saw him? And this was right after he and Lyta were reunited and seemed to be happy, for once.
Oh well. It's not the first time Hector has been killed. Actually, I think it's the third.
I like Hector as Fate as well, Rocky, even though I was never a reader of Infinity Inc. It seemed like a great fit. Maybe this is all a part of a grand plan to reboot Hawkman again somehow by tying up all his loose ends. Or maybe not, since Hector as Silver Scarab is part of Justice Society Infinity.
-------------------- "Suck it, depressos!"--M. Lash
From: The Underbelly of Society | Registered: Jul 2003
| IP: Logged |
quote:Originally posted by Rockhopper Lad: I really liked the Hawkman series a few years ago. I loved that the Golden Age version of a fairly major character was considered the version in the DCU. Unfortunately, it really tanked after Johns left it.
I also liked how the Hawks and Dr. Fate were handled at the same time in JSA. There was always the tension of "In another life, we were a family". The relationship between Hector and Kendra, who were cousins biologically, but really mother and son, really should have been explored more fully. Hector Hall is one of my favorite characters and I always felt his death toward the end of the JSA run was one of the most pointless deaths in all of comics. They essentially killed him off to make way for a "new" version of Dr. Fate and when was the last time we saw him? And this was right after he and Lyta were reunited and seemed to be happy, for once.
Oh well. It's not the first time Hector has been killed. Actually, I think it's the third.
Although I said a moment ago that I thought JSA was good until Identity Crisis, I feel that the true jump-the-shark moment was what happened to Hector and Lyta. There's just NO WAY that Johns couldn't have had long-term plans for them which got scuttled for God knows what lame reason.
posted
I think Hector's shining moment was in JSA #50. That was the issue where he defeats Mordru and shows him that someday the Legion is going to kick his @$$ too. On the other hand, that was Obsidian's absolute worst moment. But then the JSA's kids have had some of the worst treatment of any characters in comicdom.
-------------------- The only character in all of literature who has been described as "badnass" while using the phrase "vile miscreant."
From: The Pyngwyn Colonies of Planet Hyustyn | Registered: Aug 2005
| IP: Logged |
posted
For me, JSA died back when Goyer left the FIRST time (back in JSA #25 - actually, was that Sadowski's last issue too, come to think of it?). The issues afterward degenerated rapidly, and when Goyer apparently returned for Stealing Thunder (link to a post I made at the time), it got worse rather than better.
For some bizarre reason, I hung on to #53 in the hope it would get better again, but it never did. That cured me of doing that forever - when a title gets bad these days, I drop it quickly.
posted
I love JSA, although "Thy Kingdom Come" storyline nearly did it in (I dropped it for that) and I'm kinda wanting to pass judgment on the current arc to see how the Marvels are treated (huge fan, but HATE the current direction and want DC to correct themselves asap, but not sure if that is happening here or not and my enjoyment of the story depends a lot on where Mary is at the end).
Anyways, there is some confusion as to when this issue takes place. In issue #24 (the most recent one) Billy mentions that Mary disappeared after the war with Darkseid and still has Black Adam's powers in her. Then she shows up in the horribly designed outfit from Final Crisis (not the black one she wore in Countdown or on the cover of #25). So some confusion there.
but the dialogue indicated this actually takes place after Final Crisis.
As for the Hawks, I only read them in JSA and one arc of the Hawkman book. They aren't my favorites but I do like seeing them around (and I don't know why Kendra is in JLA, she never struck me as someone who really made that "next step" but maybe I missed something).
I don't want them to mess with the Hawks anymore because the poor Hawks have been messed up too much already.
As for Hector, yeah, I miss him. The death of Hector was really pointless as his relationship with the others added to the character of Dr. Fate IMO. Still, the way I choose to read his "death" is simply that he and Lyta are taken to another dimension by their son and get to spend the rest of their lives there. Happy and safe and with the son I don't think they ever knew.
-------------------- Long Live the Legion!
Registered: Mar 2007
| IP: Logged |
posted
DC Editorial's a mess right now. In FC the Hawks definitely bite it, Mr. Terrific vanishes and Mary Marvel is cured of DeSaad's possession (Super Young Team, btw, survive).
In JSA, which specifically mentions it's after the war with Darkseid, the Hawks and Terrific are around and Mary's still in her "Black Mary" persona. sigh.
For the record, Silver Age Katar the space-cop was always my favourite Hawkman (Loved those World's Finest back-ups), but I didn't mind Carter's resurrection in JSA. Until he became Conan the Hawkbarian, that is. Then I was more than ready for Katar to come back.
Anyone else read the "Legend of Hawkman" mini, that was a great depiction of Katar and Shiera that I'd love to see come back.
From: Moncton, New Brunswick, Canada | Registered: Sep 2004
| IP: Logged |
posted
Yeah, it sounds like DC continuity is more messed up than ever, Rouge.
But back to JSA, they have gotten a lot of things very, very right since the revival began. A few examples:
1) Bringing back Rick Tyler as Hourman and finding a way to bring back Rex as well! This is an example of a JSA child being treated well after Keith Giffen tried to kill him off as a stunt in that Eclipso series (along with several others). And bringing back Rex righted one of the worst wrongs of Zero Hour.
2) Mr. Terrific. I'm so glad someone was paying attention to what Ostrander did with this imaginative take on a new Terrific. As great as it was, Johns and Goyer elevated an obscure character to great heights and produced not just one of the great black characters, but one of the best new characters PERIOD to emerge in the last decade or so! (That stuff in FC better not f*** that up!)
3) The continued survival and central roles of Alan Scott, Ted Grant and Jay Garrick. These three (along with Carter Hall) continue to be strong flag-bearers of the JSA and for DC history.
4) The sense of a huge extended family. It distinguishes the JSA from any other title out there. The JSA look out for each other and the generations of legacy heroes. That's one thing Geoff's early issues of the current series underlined very well. And it's a big reason why I won't be dropping the title when Geoff leaves.
Those are just a few off the top of my head. I'm sure there're many more if I sit down and think about it.
Your thoughts?
-------------------- "Suck it, depressos!"--M. Lash
From: The Underbelly of Society | Registered: Jul 2003
| IP: Logged |
Hyperpath: Email this page to someone!
Printer-friendly view of this topic | Subscribe To Topic
![[No]](graemlins/shake.gif)
![[sigh]](graemlins/sigh.gif)
![[shrug]](graemlins/shrug.gif)
