in various legion eras, we've caught glimpses of the legacies of various DCU characters - Superman, Green Lantern, Flash, Luthor, Starman, L.E.G.I.O.N., Brainiac, Shazam, HERO...
which were your favorite and/or which DCU legacy has been oddly missing for you?
Posted by Yellow Kid on :
pt.1 - I got a huge kick out of the future Superman stories (the one allergic to seawater) those were pure comic book fun.
pt.2 - What happens to Firestorm? He disappears after the 21stC. as far as I know. Shouldn't he be some kind of energy being with an indefinite lifespan?
Posted by Sketch Lad on :
I actually have two opinions about this. On one hand, I wish the stories of what will happen 1000 years in the future had more direct ties to what's happening now. Like what will become of the 31st century descendants of the JLA? We kinda got that preboot, but only in minor appearances. This was cleverly shown in the "Who Shot Laurel Kent?" story. I really liked all that. I really liked Laurel Kent, though I must admit her visuals had a lot to do with it.
My other opinion is that the Legion should be made up of characters that have no direct ties to the past. Therefore, there is plenty of creative freedom as far as what can be done with them. This is largely how it is (or has been), with obvious complications like the whole Superman family. These complications have led to the reboot(s).
Sorry, 235-AndyS, not really a short answer, but it is how I feel.
Posted by 235 - Andy S on :
quote:Originally posted by Sketch Lad: I actually have two opinions about this. ......... Sorry, 235-AndyS, not really a short answer, but it is how I feel.
That's actually very similar to where I land - seeing & waffling between "too much continuity" vs. "richly textured".
That's why I wanted to see how others thought. Helps me see sides I never thought of (or story ideas that are brilliant & exciting).
Posted by Blue Battler on :
My favorite Legionnaire was always the pre-Crisis Superboy, so the Legion isn't the Legion to me without him ...
Posted by Yellow Kid on :
I feel the same way BB but the ownership squabble has ruined any chances of getting a young Kal-el back in the Legion. I know it bites but we have to have a Legion that can live and entertain without mini-blue. Kon-el just doesn't fill his boots, y'know?
Posted by ferroboy on :
We never saw much of a Batman legacy. Sure, there was that guy who was killed during the Levitz era (a detective, I think), but he hardly counts.
I would definitely like to see the Superman lineage revisited in some manner, even if it's a lower-powered character. In fact, I'd prefer a Supergirl-style character in this role.
The other possibility is a Green Lantern of some sort, but that might make the team too powerful.
Sketch Lad - I think Laurel Kent was vague enough. It always seemed to be that Laurel claimed to be descended from Superman but that there was no proof. (Though I guess the kryptonite bullet would be proof enough - but then, she ended up being a Manhunter anyway.)
Yellow Kid - I kind of see your point, and that's why I'd prefer a new, future version of someone from the Superman Family (a descendent, or alleged descendent). Hmm...a little tweaking of Kristen Wells, maybe?
Posted by 235 - Andy S on :
quote:Originally posted by ferroboy: We never saw much of a Batman legacy. Sure, there was that guy who was killed during the Levitz era (a detective, I think), but he hardly counts.
i always thought that was kind of a rip-off the Bat is SO huge in DC that it would be weird to not see any trace of the legacy in a 'heroic' age or even anywhere on DC Earth 1000 years isn't that far from now i mean, if the Angkor Wat can remain so amazingly preserved in cambodia for 1000 years (and i've been and they are amazing), wouldn't the batcave, atlantis, the fortress of solitude, the rock of eternity, paradise island (or whatever it's called now)? i mean, the Flash Museum still exists!
Posted by Re-AniMiner on :
Well, they did visit the Batcave during the first Computo story.
Braniac 5 was considered to be an expert on Batman (something that I think cropped up in a story ot two, as well as his Who's Who entry).
That, and an excavation of the Batcave hosted by Tenzil during TMK are the only Bat-references I recall.
Posted by TenzilKem3004 on :
I don't think that EVERY character from our era should have a corresponding version in the 31st century, but all the basics SHOULD. Especially with the new Legion series focusing on the characters taking great inspiration from the past, there should be a few members on the team that have taken the Legacy. More reason why Waid/Kitson should bring back XS... snazz her costume up, call her Kid Flash and you'll be good to go.
Of course I wouldn't mind a descendant of John Constantine in the future. Anyone who reads Hellblazer (or Sandman) knows that his family is ages old... So why not a thousand more years? Wishful thinking....
Posted by Yellow Kid on :
I've got a perfect idea for dragging a Kryptonian legacy into the Legion. The Phantom Zone still has people sentenced to punishment by a long dead civilization floating around y'know. I'd like to see Mark do something with that.
Posted by ferroboy on :
Not a bad idea, Yellow Kid. Why couldn't a Kryptonian villain be reformed after all that time? That way we'd have a Kryptonian, maybe even one trying to live up to Superman's legacy, but we don't have to worry about whether or not Superman has children.
Posted by EuroMutt on :
Well, according to the Phantom Zone Logic YK & fb, you have Mon-El... I mean Valor, still in the Phantom Zone. He doesn't even have to reform.
I think a balance between legacy and inovation is imporant. I loved XS in the Legion. I thought she was a great addition that paid homage to the Flash mythos, but wasn't totally derivitive to every other speedster charater.
As for Batman, I've always felt that he shouldn't have a connection in the Legion's time. He's just human for one thing, and for another he has never had a lot of attention on himself, by design. So while the bright super-heroes are known well, Bats kind of slipped through the cracks and is only really known as a curiosity. Think of him as Scipio (the Roman general who fought Hannibal) - historians know who he is and what he did, but does anyone else in the world?
Posted by EuroMutt on :
Oh, forgot to mention that I think that some great current day connections could be added by showing some of the immortal characters are around. the only problem with this is that most are supernatural, and the Legion usually is at odds with magical things. But to see Jason Blood, The Phantom Stranger, Vandal Savage, etc. would be kinda cool.
Posted by Yellow Kid on :
I'd like to see Vandal Savage pop up sometime, that might be pretty cool. I thought DnA really had to stretch to use Ras al Ghul as a Legion badguy but if I never see Darkseid again it'll be too soon. We saw descendants of Atlanteans in Legionnaires but as far as I can remember offhand we haven't seen any of them since. I wonder if a descendant of Oliver Queen would pick a different archaic weapon and go by the name of the Green Bullet?
Posted by STU Cat on :
Loved seeing the legacy of Shazam in the future... I didn't even mind Thunder all that much, although I do think the character wasn't used well at all.
Posted by doublechinner on :
I like the notion that the (now) 21st century heroes represent a lost heroic age to the Legion's time, like Homer's Ilead and Odyssey. This way, most tangible evidence is gone or hidden, but hints occasionally surface. That way you don't have to deal with Themiscyra or Atlantis in the Legion's time.
Posted by SiliconDream on :
The Flash legacy always seemed oddly stunted to me in the Legionverse, given that almost every future era has a Flash and, thanks to running the timestream every week or so, they practically all know each other by name! To me the Flash dynasty is the leading Earth-based superhero lineage of the DC universe. Not to mention that Barry Allen & kids lived in the Legion's recent past and present.
That said, on literary grounds I prefer to have most legacies initially dormant. The Legion should be by far the most important good guys in the 30th century, and should be the first heralds of a new heroic age.
So I also thought XS was a great compromise--clearly part of the Flash dynasty, but not knowing much about it and needing the Legion's help to find her way as a heroine. I think one of the Legion's functions should be to inspire heirs of the various legacies in that manner, even if they don't actually end up joining.
One of the better ideas I saw for a future legacy was in Starman, where Ted Knight's cosmic energy technology became the main power source for human spacecraft. I thought that was a great way to have a hero leave a lasting effect on the future, instead of just having "Starman 3000" around to remind everybody.
Unfortunately, they simultaneously decided to also have a Starman 3000 in the form of Thom Kallor, which was just plain silly.
Posted by ferroboy on :
quote:Originally posted by doublechinner: I like the notion that the (now) 21st century heroes represent a lost heroic age to the Legion's time, like Homer's Ilead and Odyssey. This way, most tangible evidence is gone or hidden, but hints occasionally surface. That way you don't have to deal with Themiscyra or Atlantis in the Legion's time.
I'm not sure that Themiscyra and Atlantis present a problem in this respect. Diana could be dead, off-planet, or simply retired. The Amazons themselves could even be closed off in another dimension (maybe with the gods). And preboot Atlantis was more or less a vacation resort rather than a mythological city associated with heroes. That depiction could still work out.
Posted by PolarBoy on :
A thing that makes the Legion so exciting is also that it is about a whole galaxy full of Alien worlds so I think it would bog it down to much to have a team full of earth based legacies. Admitedly they had XS from another planet (Which I never quiet understood) But I did like how Thunder was a hero of the far Future of Fawsett World there was a lot of potential there. It might be interesting to have a member who is the latest incarnation of a long line of Xanthu heros but I guess that was sort of done with Shadow lass.
Posted by Jorg-El on :
I would like the Flash to have a legacy in the Legion like XS personally and a Green Lantern.
As far as Superman? Eh. I saw Superboy, Dev-Em, Supergirl, and Mon-El all as legacies sort of. Now I rather just have Mon-El even as a Daxam but still as Superman legacy.
It would be fun to do a bunch more but I just think it would get complicated.
Jorge
Posted by Director Lad on :
I'm not generally a fan of legacy characters popping up in Legion. Someone said above that 1000 years isn't that long, but think about it: how many historical figures from 1000 years ago still have family legacies in the 21st century? Can we name any of William the Conquerer's descendants?
I far prefer the idea of the Legion looking back on a distant age of heroes and taking inspiration from their example, rather than the descendants of today's heroes, 50 generations removed, carrying on their ancestor's heroics.
Posted by 235 - Andy S on :
quote:Originally posted by Director Lad: I'm not generally a fan of legacy characters popping up in Legion. Someone said above that 1000 years isn't that long, but think about it: how many historical figures from 1000 years ago still have family legacies in the 21st century? Can we name any of William the Conquerer's descendants?
I agree about history. I laugh sometimes at US Presidents who are worried about how history will remember them. Who remembers the names of Presidents even 40 years after their term?
as for heroes, i like what Silicon Dream said - that it would make sense for the Legion to be the forefront of heroes for their age
Posted by Jorg-El on :
Andy on a history standpoint with presidents? Look at the Kennedy's? People are still interested in them today. He was president 40 years ago. Both Roosevelt's are pretty popular...Teddy almost mythic.
Director Lad makes a good point though. We remember Richard the Lionheart but his kids aren't running around today are they? (ok all of euro royalty are cousins 3 times over but whatever)
Honoring the past but no actualy legacy characters make sense. I like it.
Posted by DrakeB3004 on :
I have no interest in seeing any descendents of 21st century heroes (how about 23rd or 26th century heroes while we're at it?). What would interest me is seeing how certain concepts have developed in a thousand years. I wouldn't mind seeing what the Guardians are up to - if there are any GL's around in space or maybe they started a new organization? Same with the Amazons and Atlanteans - have they integrated into 31st century earth civilization or still have their own domains? etc...
Posted by Belinda Hill on :
I'm not really interested about how this incarnation fits into DCU history, the Legion should be a seperate entity IMO, but if pushed I would like to see the Amazons mostly, and the Vegans, and possibly the Green Lanterns, oh and definitely Gorilla City descendants, and also the Phantom Stranger and.. Posted by Blacula on :
Personally I'd like to keep the 21st Century heroes/villains/cultures/etc as far away from the Legion-verse as possible.
If I want to read about the Guardians I'll read Green Lantern, if I want to read about Batman villains I'll read Batman, if I want to read about how those characters are in the future then I'll just wait for one of those 'alternative future' storylines that roll around every couple of years or so.
I read the Legion for the elements that only the Legion can provide.
And I *hate* it when changes to the present day DCU characters ripple out and f*ck up the nice orderly status quo of the Legion-verse. See Superboy (Kal-El) for the most obvious example of this.
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