posted
I don't know. I thought he looked Spanish but I've been told he was at least partically, black. But India is a perfect place for him to come from, too.
I'm just pretty much fantisizing in that post about ethnicity. The principle issue is focus on cultural diversity more than racial differences but that those differences can be shown somewhat in physical ways.
Where's Sketch when we need him?!
-------------------- 'In the twinkling of an eye' I'll be dancing in the sky!
Come, join me!
From: Salem, Oregon USA | Registered: Aug 2003
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Set
There's not a word yet, for old friends who've just met.
posted
quote:Originally posted by Candle: Tinya - Mexican or Puerto Rican
In Superboy's Legion, she had a hint of (East) Indian, which was a nice look for her. Then again, trying to fill ethnic slots with aliens, like Bgtzlns or Carggites or Braalians, somewhat defeats the purpose, IMO.
"Oh sure, we're gonna totally neglect your millenia old culture, that represents like 20% of the Earth's population, but Tinya looks kinda Indian, is that good enough? Oh, and we had that dude who became Earth president, Gupta something, and sure, he was a dupe of a supervillain, but at least we didn't say that the entire population of India left Earth to go to a magical disappearing island..."
Anasazi, actually, so more Arizona-based Native American. Comic book native americans are always plains dwellers (Marvel's Black Crow) or desert dwellers (Marvel's mythical Kewazi tribe). It would be neat to see a Seminole, or a South American native, but given that the Legion doesn't even have token members of groups that outnumber caucasians (such as Asians or East Indians), I don't think I'll hold my breath for an Iroquois showing up.
quote: Salu - Mediterranian, Greek or Egyptian or French
Her name becomes a pun, if she's French, so go for it!
Imsk is one of those worlds that hurts my head. Shrinking is such a mind-boggling power. Imsk must exist on the periphery of a black hole or something... I must stop thinking about this, before another Legion Worlds fanfic results!
quote: Gim - middle American/Canadian
He's already Jewish, and grew up on Mars, so, for an Earth-human, he's less bland than, say, Dirk or Invisible Lyle.
[ January 19, 2010, 01:48 AM: Message edited by: Set ]
Registered: Aug 2006
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Silver Age Lad
Part-time member living in another century
posted
quote:Originally posted by Set: "Oh sure, we're gonna totally neglect your millenia old culture, that represents like 20% of the Earth's population, but Tinya looks kinda Indian, is that good enough? Oh, and we had that dude who became Earth president, Gupta something, and sure, he was a dupe of a supervillain, but at least we didn't say that the entire population of India left Earth to go to a magical disappearing island..."
The Earth in the 21st century is becoming much more ethnicly mixed and in a lot of places were there is diversification (France, the UK, Brazil for exampla), there is a high percentage of mixed marriages. Here in the UK it is estimated that very soon 45% of all Afro-Caribbeans will marry outside their population.
Extrapolate this for 1000 years/200 generations and there aren't going to be any caucasions, Indians or Africans just a whole lot of Beyonce Knowles
-------------------- "Our devotion to each other was unexplainable" "You were kids" "No Batman, we were Legion"
From: Ancient Kingdom of Northumbria, UK | Registered: Aug 2007
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posted
i realize that the Tornado Twins (Dawn Allen is her mom) are still alive in this Earth and same age as the legionnaires. i hope he touches on this.
They're one and the same. Dawn (from this Era/Earth) is Her mom. They relocated to Earth 247 (it was referred too in the Final Crisis: Legion of 3 worlds)
-------------------- Bring back the super-cousins
From: nyc | Registered: Jul 2003
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Set
There's not a word yet, for old friends who've just met.
posted
quote:Originally posted by Silver Age Lad: Extrapolate this for 1000 years/200 generations and there aren't going to be any caucasions, Indians or Africans just a whole lot of Beyonce Knowles
True, to a point. Blue eyes, for instance, are recessive, and something like 80% of the population doesn't even have the genes for them today. 1000 years from now, blue eyes are going to be a cosmetic choice, not something you are born with. Blonde hair (and redheads) are similarly on the way out, but that doesn't stop a truly staggering number of people from bleaching their hair blonde, or tinting it red (as a trip to pretty much any public venue outside of Scandinavia will highlight).
It's already happening pretty quickly in melting pot America. Perhaps in another 250 years or so we'll be pretty much the same color, and have one less reason to clutch our pearls in fear and walk over to the other side of the street when we see a cluster of 'scary' people.
Registered: Aug 2006
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quote:Originally posted by Blacula: ^^^ I always thought Jenni's Dad's origins stretched back to the Indian sub-contintent. She always looked more Indian than African to me anyway.
posted
Yildiray Cinar did some work on Jay Faerbers' Dynamo5 that was published by Image. While he didn't do a lot of work, what he did do was quite nice. I think he might be a nice fit for Legion.
From: PEI, Canada | Registered: Aug 2003
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posted
Being recessive doesn't mean that it disappears from the gene pool, it just means it doesn't show up until someone else with the recessive gene shows up. Coloring is extremely complicated anyway.
In my family, my Mom had blue eyes and my Dad had brown. Both of my brothers have blue eyes and mine are hazel green.
A friend of mine in high school came from parents with dark brown hair and brown eyes. All three of their daughters are carrot tops with blue eyes. Only the one boy in the family has brown hair and eyes.
And many cultures on Earth are NOT melting pots. Many of the scandinavians remain mostly scandinavian. Many of the Asian countries remain mostly Asian and etc..
A thousand years isn't going to erase ethnicity except maybe, in those countries that have high emigration.
And I had no idea that Gim was supposed to be Jewish! He certainly doesn't act or look Jewish. Anyway.
When I cast Tinya in my photo posters, I've usually used Jaslene, who's Hispanic. She just feels right to me, but maybe I'll explore a more Indian (India) look.
-------------------- 'In the twinkling of an eye' I'll be dancing in the sky!
Come, join me!
From: Salem, Oregon USA | Registered: Aug 2003
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cleome46
or you can do the confusion 'til your head falls off
posted
What would a character do to "act Jewish"?
Jews can also be of European (East or West), Middle Eastern, Hispanic or African extraction (for starters)-- so there's probably no one way to "look Jewish," either.
-------------------- Hey, Kids! My "Cranky and Kitschy" collage art is now viewable on flickr. Drop by and tell me that I sent you.
From: Vanity, OR | Registered: Dec 2008
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posted
I knew someone would say that when I wrote it. sigh
I meant 'classic' Jewish. Which is what we're talking about here, classic ethnic looks.
All of the different groups, red and yellow black and white (brown isn't in the song, but brown), have huge variations within them, so if the discussion is on Legionnaires representing different ethnic backgrounds, I think that we have to be addressing the stereo types for whichever group we're talking about.
For 'acting Jewish' I was thinking of someone who would identify themself as Jewish. That tends to mean strong family and religious connections. Gim has the family but not the religious background. I know Jewish people don't HAVE to have strong religious beliefs but again, we're talking about the Legion representing ethnic groups.
Make sense? I never know if I'm making sense to anyone else but myself.
posted
Outside of a few "phrases" and mentioning it once every great while, there was no way to know that Gim was Jewish. Only way I really found out was when Marte said something about he and Yera raising their kids Jewish.
From: Turn around... | Registered: Jul 2003
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cleome46
or you can do the confusion 'til your head falls off
posted
Eh. Gim Allon's Jewishness was a retcon, though. Levitz noted that "Allon" was the name of a famous Israeli general and a light went on in his head, so to speak. I presume that a wholesale change in the character's appearance just because of that wouldn't have made sense. Partially because it would disorient readers and partially because there are plenty of Jews who don't look like Mel Brooks or Richard Lewis. I have a slew of pale-skinned, freckled, red-headed cousins on Mom's side, for instance.
In a sense, Levitz sent a mixed signal, because I think the writers and editors in the 1980s didn't want to blatantly pour a whole lot of religious elements into the stories. At the time, I was a little disappointed at this, but nowadays I think they had the right idea. For those of us who aren't religious, it can feel very tiresome after a while when religion seems to intrude into everything.
-------------------- Hey, Kids! My "Cranky and Kitschy" collage art is now viewable on flickr. Drop by and tell me that I sent you.
From: Vanity, OR | Registered: Dec 2008
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quote:Originally posted by Set: . . . Then again, trying to fill ethnic slots with aliens, like Bgtzlns or Carggites or Braalians, somewhat defeats the purpose, IMO.
Originally, and during the pre and post Zero hour Valor seeding times, all of those aliens mentioned started out as Earth humans. I could see one genetic predispostion or another being in a specific geographical region or another. The Dominators would take most or all natives from that area and they would create the same powers in each group. Before Crisis, I could see that colonists for a planet would originally come from the same Earth areas due to compatability with the planet environment and for group dynamics.
In the Pern stories, the settlers came from 3 geographic regions on Earth and all of the 'founders' had a similar political ideology, which was the belief and desire for a low tech society based on guilds. Those groups were sent to Pern because the planet was low in metals and fossil fuels which would make a hightech society difficult if not impossible.
In all of the realities mentioned, ethnicity would survive, especially in isolated colony situations, I think.
quote: Dawnstar - Anasazi, actually, so more Arizona-based Native American. Comic book native americans are always plains dwellers It would be neat to see a Seminole, or a South American native,. . . but I don't think I'll hold my breath for an Iroquois showing up.
Dawnstar wasn't originally Anastazi. Her tribe wasn't named, if I remember correctly and her original 'look' was stereotypically plains indian. (Preboot Starhaven was a 700 year old colony made up of multiple 'Amerind' tribes.) In the retroboot, I assume TPTB will go with the Bedard version from .REBELS. I think that the showing there was also very 'Yellow Hand' rather than Puebloish, but that's just me, probably.
quote:Originally posted by cleome: Eh. Gim Allon's Jewishness was a retcon, though. Levitz noted that "Allon" was the name of a famous Israeli general and a light went on in his head, so to speak. I presume that a wholesale change in the character's appearance just because of that wouldn't have made sense. Partially because it would disorient readers and partially because there are plenty of Jews who don't look like Mel Brooks or Richard Lewis. I have a slew of pale-skinned, freckled, red-headed cousins on Mom's side, for instance.
In a sense, Levitz sent a mixed signal, because I think the writers and editors in the 1980s didn't want to blatantly pour a whole lot of religious elements into the stories. At the time, I was a little disappointed at this, but nowadays I think they had the right idea. For those of us who aren't religious, it can feel very tiresome after a while when religion seems to intrude into everything.
That's an interesting insight into Gim and Levitz and how things develope in a serial story. But I think that 'they' wouldn't have had to change Gim's looks from middle American/Canadian to Jewish nearly as much as they had to change Val's looks from Caucasian to Japanese. And they did it. (All Gim would have needed would have been a small beard and the idea would have gotten across, with a Star of David somewhere, of course! Ahhhh, stereotypes!
But seriously, in the long run, I agree that it shouldn't have been done. (Rokk makes much more sense as Jewish, .)
I prefer not to have too much Earth religion in comics, either. At least, living religions. But not because they intrude.
For me it's either too easy to offend people or that the writers usually don't get it correct, anyway, especially Christianity, imo.
I always liked how Star Trek dealt with God. They'd have a comment or an occasional glimpse or once, a story, but mostly it was about space and aliens. I particularly liked glimpses of Vulcan and Klingon beliefs.
I think though that having a whole group of people with NO beliefs in or versions of God would be just as unrealistic and intrusive as having EVERYONE with them. And that's my opinion.
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