And Shooter got a couple of knuckle-raps from Amazing Heroes back in the mid 1980s for some nasty stereotyping of gays in some of his other work.
-------------------- Hey, Kids! My "Cranky and Kitschy" collage art is now viewable on flickr. Drop by and tell me that I sent you.
From: Vanity, OR | Registered: Dec 2008
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posted
Ah. That's the same one.
Registered: Apr 2010
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future king
Excuse me but can you please direct me to the La Brea Tar Pits in Los Angeles?
posted
quote:Originally posted by cleome: Ken, I was referring to the excerpts here.
And Shooter got a couple of knuckle-raps from Amazing Heroes back in the mid 1980s for some nasty stereotyping of gays in some of his other work.
Wow. I have never read these creator descriptions about our Legionnaires before. I found some of it quite disturbing and dissapointing, on both Shooter and the Bierbaums' assessments of each character. To think these are the people writing the stories for these heroes and having such a low regard for too many of them, well let me tell you it is a huge downer to read for this fan.
Damn! I honestly don't know what more to say.
From: ontario | Registered: Feb 2007
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posted
I've heard some people say much of the Silver Age DC, including the Legion, was created by 'conservative white males'. And while they were mostly white and male, the conservative part is not true!
Otto Binder, Ed Hamilton, Jerry Siegel (and for that matter John Broome and Robert Kanigher, who didn't write the Legion) were all liberal writers! Their sci-fi stories (and in Kanigher's case, his war stories) show this time and time again. Simply put, they were liberal for the 1950's and early 1960's.
Saying their outlook was biased or something is just plain wrong; it was a product of the times. Times have changed and its time to include more diversity in the Legion. Otto Binder would be proud to see it as such.
I think we at last have an opportunity for the Legion to grow where characters can be introduced with real staying power. Hopefully that happens!
From: If you don't want my peaches, honey... | Registered: Sep 2003
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posted
(Some may compare them to the super-liberal Silver Age Marvel of Stan & Jack, but that's not totally fair either as that firm liberalism in Marvel's stories happened more towards the mid-late 60's when Hamliton & Binder were no longer at DC).
From: If you don't want my peaches, honey... | Registered: Sep 2003
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Set
There's not a word yet, for old friends who've just met.
posted
If my post above made it sound like the Legion was *created* by 'conservative white males,' that's my bad.
I meant that the Legion itself was heavily loaded with clean-cut preppy looking white faces, with only Shady, Brainy, Cham (the *aliens*) being non-white. This was a team where a woman had to cheat to become leader, and where it was 'too soon' to introduce a black Ferro Lad. (And when a black Legionnaire, Tyroc, did join, yowza! Hardly a shining beacon of enlightened inclusion...)
Future Shock, the classic Legion stories ain't.
I have no idea about the writers. I mean, I vaguely know that a bunch of the 'old school' are Italian and / or Jewish, based on their names, but I never really thought much about the ethnicity or politics of the writers.
They lived when they lived, they wrote the stories that worked for that time period. I throw no stones at them for that.
Registered: Aug 2006
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quote:Cleome said: If it's anything like the interview posted on this board, I prefer to ignore anything Shooter says about the characters', uh, social lives. Seriously, the guy should've taken a cold shower before giving that interview. That was WAY more insight into his mind than I wanted, Thanks.
I had never read that before, and my feelings about it are very similar to yours. Whereas I don't necessarily agree with the Bierbaums' assessments, I can respect them. But Shooter's... they just feel dirty and unrespectful in addition to plain wrong (see for example Dream Girl, Brainiac 5, just about every female in the team). I fully agree with you, Cleome, that was way more insight into Shooter's mind than I ever wanted. I think I need a shower now. Yuck.
From: Vancouver, BC, Canada | Registered: Jul 2003
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posted
To be fair to Shooter, I think those were from the late 1970's and he was actually embarrassed by them years later.
From: If you don't want my peaches, honey... | Registered: Sep 2003
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posted
I'm serious. There was a fan in Klordny APA who liked to slash Lightning Lord and Nemesis Kid. I believe that is where the idea of making Mekt gay in V4 came from.
Registered: Apr 2010
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quote:Originally posted by Cobalt Kid: To be fair to Shooter, I think those were from the late 1970's and he was actually embarrassed by them years later.
Really? I thought he repeated many of them in one of Glen Cadigan's recent compendiums.
From: Vancouver, BC, Canada | Registered: Dec 2003
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posted
hart druiter? in the parlance of your time: gross.
jimgallagher, on the other hand...why don't you come up to the 31st century sometime and see me?
From: out & about | Registered: Jul 2003
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posted
As soon as my time bubble gets out of the shop.
-------------------- Buy my new graphic novel! http://www.dodeka12.com
From: Champaign, IL | Registered: Jul 2003
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cleome46
or you can do the confusion 'til your head falls off
posted
[young folks around the world faint, upon being informed that people their parents' age know what "slash" means]
-------------------- Hey, Kids! My "Cranky and Kitschy" collage art is now viewable on flickr. Drop by and tell me that I sent you.
From: Vanity, OR | Registered: Dec 2008
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