At the end of each list, I've grouped the 'ayes' in green and the 'nays' in red.
GAZELLE
ATOM GIRL yes BRAINIAC 5 no CHAMELEON yes COLOSSAL BOY yes ELEMENT LAD no INVISIBLE KID yes LIGHT LASS no LIGHTNING LAD no PHANTOM GIRL yes SATURN GIRL no SHADOW LASS yes STAR BOY yes TIMBER WOLF no ULTRA BOY yes
ATOM GIRL, CHAMELEON, COLOSSAL BOY, INVISIBLE KID, PHANTOM GIRL, SHADOW LASS, STAR BOY, ULTRA BOY BRAINIAC 5, ELEMENT LAD, LIGHT LASS, LIGHTNING LAD, SATURN GIRL, TIMBER WOLF
TURTLE
ATOM GIRL no BRAINIAC 5 no CHAMELEON yes COLOSSAL BOY no ELEMENT LAD no INVISIBLE KID yes LIGHT LASS no LIGHTNING LAD no PHANTOM GIRL yes SATURN GIRL yes SHADOW LASS no STAR BOY yes TIMBER WOLF no ULTRA BOY no
CHAMELEON, INVISIBLE KID, PHANTOM GIRL, SATURN GIRL, STAR BOY ATOM GIRL, BRAINIAC 5, COLOSSAL BOY, ELEMENT LAD, LIGHT LASS, LIGHTNING LAD, SHADOW LASS, TIMBER WOLF, ULTRA BOY
SIZZLE
ATOM GIRL no BRAINIAC 5 yes CHAMELEON yes COLOSSAL BOY no ELEMENT LAD no INVISIBLE KID yes LIGHT LASS no LIGHTNING LAD yes PHANTOM GIRL yes SATURN GIRL no SHADOW LASS no STAR BOY yes TIMBER WOLF no ULTRA BOY no
BRAINIAC 5, CHAMELEON, INVISIBLE KID, LIGHTNING LAD, PHANTOM GIRL, STAR BOY ATOM GIRL, COLOSSAL BOY, ELEMENT LAD, LIGHT LASS, SATURN GIRL, SHADOW LASS, TIMBER WOLF, ULTRA BOY
NIGHT GIRL ATOM GIRL yes BRAINIAC 5 no CHAMELEON yes COLOSSAL BOY no ELEMENT LAD yes INVISIBLE KID no LIGHT LASS yes LIGHTNING LAD no PHANTOM GIRL yes SATURN GIRL no SHADOW LASS yes STAR BOY no TIMBER WOLF no ULTRA BOY no
ATOM GIRL, CHAMELEON, ELEMENT LAD, LIGHT LASS, PHANTOM GIRL, SHADOW LASS BRAINIAC 5, COLOSSAL BOY, INVISIBLE KID, LIGHTNING LAD, SATURN GIRL, STAR BOY, TIMBER WOLF, ULTRA BOY
Unfortunately, there weren't really any art clues in the depictions of the Legionnaires to pick up on during the tryouts.
Cham and Phantom Girl both voted for all candidates to join. Friendly to a fault. I think Cham'd let Eye-Fall-Out Ethel in.
Colossal Boy and Ultra Boy voted only for Gazelle. Huh. Surprising.
Invisible Kid and Star Boy both excluded only Night Girl. Threatened by big, almost bare breasts?
Atom Girl and Shadow Lass both voted for Gazelle and Night Girl, against the others. Adding to the ranks of aggressive grrrls is their priority?
Brainy and Lightning Lad only voted yes for Sizzle. Amazing to see these two thinking alike, for different reasons? Remember, Garth's been shown to be an exemplary *field* leader, if a scattered bureaucratic one.
Element Lad and Light Lass only voted yes for Night Girl. Was this a yes for bare flesh? Nudists gotta stick together. I find this to be the most puzzling of entries. I wouldn't have thought Ayla'd be so picky- but she has been shown to be thinking from a leadership perspective, lately. I'd like to hear her reasoning.
Jan voting against Sizzle, who has a complimentary power to his own, is, at first glance, very odd. Perhaps he thinks that anyone raised outside of Trom teachings would be too much of a risk to have such a power? Did he notice the fact that Sizzle was so unsure of her limits and vote accordingly? I'd hope that if there was any future for these new reserves involving hands-on Legionnaire participation , that it'd be him (in conjunction with Brainy) that'd handle Sizzle's training.
Saturn Girl's only yes was for Turtle.
Given the recent revelation that a different Saturn Girl mentally screened the candidates applying to *her* LSH, it makes me wonder what Imra saw in Turtle to get that yes from her. Or what she saw in the others that caused her to vote against them.
Nobody matches how I would vote, were I a Legionnaire- or were this selection made by fans- which is for Sizzle and Night Girl. I would've picked Turtle over Gazelle, I think. I just don't really like her.
Who would you have voted for?
Posted by MLLASH on :
Firstly, I *love* that Shooter showed who voted for who. Stuff like this is SO fun to debate on, something they ust have known back in the Silver Age too...
Honestly, I would have voted them ALL in WITH THE EXCEPTION OF Gazelle. I totally would have gone against what actually happened.
All four qualified to even BE there, according to M'rrisey, which is a big plus. However, what I know of Gazelle is that she's vindictive, bitter and maybe mentally unstable. ALso, her power limitations are right up there with Lydda's and Sizzle's. That she made it in over them mystifies me.
Anyhoo, as it went down, being rejected is about 92% as good as being accepted, so why not just eat the 8% difference and make it official? It's not like you're going to send Lightning Lad in to fight Lightning-Eater Lad, and you're not going to send in Lydda to fight The Human Sun. What's the diff?
Posted by Set on :
I would have voted for Sizzle and Turtle.
Ultra Boy has recently reminded up that Invulnerability combined with a Flight Ring equals 'human projectile,' so Turtle's power is *hardly* limited to defensive play.
Sizzle absorbs energy, on a team with multiple energy projectors, and in a universe where the vast majority of bad-guys use ray guns. Plus, how hard is it for her to carry a ray gun of her own and shoot herself with it when she needs a power-up? Brainy could probably show her how to draw power from her Flight Ring, as well!
I like Gazelle's attitude, but the Legion has enough of that, and she still pisses me off for appearing human when she was so much cooler looking as an alien.
I like Night Girl's attitude as well, but I decided to only vote for two (unlike Cham), and Sizzle and Turtle slightly won out for me.
Posted by Blockade Boy on :
Gazelle is a terrific looking character and really, IMO the only difference between her and any of the other legionnaires is that she admits that she "gets tired." Other than Supes who is powered by the sun and maybe a few others that redirect energy (Star Boy) but do not store it internally, they should all wear out.
For me she works as a member but I think interesting support characters are sometimes harder to come-by than even members. As a Legionnaire I would have voted for but as a reader I would vote against.
Sizzle: most definitely for. Extremely powerful. On the other hand, she might have made a great bitter rejected legionnaire. She seems young, a bit naive, easily manipulated. A baddy could have gotten hold of her wounded psyche and used her against Legion.
Night Girl: I still like the original story that she got her powers because of wanting to meet Cosmic Boy but this one is also her own person and a strong one at that. She is more like someone I think Cos would go for than the original. Powerful but not reliably so. Vote no.
Turtle. This is the original Ferro Lad, we agree on that? He's young but shown to be daring and listed as a top fighter. Those feeling Gazelle's powers are overly redundant would probably see the same here but I'd still take him. I like him both as a member and as a reader. He'll be a friend to Cham and probably Sizzle.
Posted by future king on :
Well Night Girl has a special place in my heart, given the decades of stories in her Legion past, so she definately gets my first choice vote. The limitations on her powers still do not detract from her heroism or experience and I think over time she would learn how to overcome the night-dependant nature of her otherwise Super-esque abilities. I also have to agree too that Sizzle would have made another excellent second addition to the team. Lots of raw potential there for sure.
I LOVE these kinds of posts! Thank you Set for starting it up and giving us a chance to express our thoughts on this topic.
Posted by future king on :
Sorry, make that Thank you Mystery Lad for starting this thread.
Posted by rickshaw1 on :
How i would have voted? Hmmm, okay.
Sizzle- yes. Reasons...her power is multi-tiered and highly adaptable. I have only one real problem with her and that is that she could easily become a deux ex machina. Need a specific frequency of Theta waves to close a door sealing gigantic doors to close off the Otherly Ones from entering out dimension? Zap Sizzle and let her rip.
Gazelle- no. Reasons- nothing unique or standalone about any of her powers. She merely duplicates.
Turtle-no. Reason- I like Ferro better. They essentially are the same thing.
Night Girl- no. Reason- as much as i hate to say it since i have liked the character since the first time i saw her...her power isn't unique. It duplicates Timber Wolf, Ultra Boy, Mon-el, Collosal Boy... I do think it a very good idea for someone to spend some time thinking of a new and interesting wrinkle to put on her powers, like the one attempted here, that would bring something unique to it. Just something...anything almost. Cause I really would like to see her in the legion.
Posted by Set on :
quote:Originally posted by rickshaw1: Night Girl- no. Reason- as much as i hate to say it since i have liked the character since the first time i saw her...her power isn't unique. It duplicates Timber Wolf, Ultra Boy, Mon-el, Collosal Boy... I do think it a very good idea for someone to spend some time thinking of a new and interesting wrinkle to put on her powers, like the one attempted here, that would bring something unique to it. Just something...anything almost. Cause I really would like to see her in the legion.
I wouldn't mind seeing her in a book that isn't the Legion, for that matter. Someone totally needs to write a Subs book that isn't a joke, that has them dealing with the sort of stuff that the Legion simply doesn't have time to deal with (it could even be noir-ish, with them helping out the SPs on mysterious cases, like DCs 31st century answer to how PAD's X-Factor run started out!).
On the other hand, a *total* revamp (pardon the pun) of the character could have her night-dependent powers be scarier, as in vampiric, in nature, with her becoming strong, nigh-unkillable, and able to move around by turning into mist or whatever. Night Girl meets Vampirella... But I'd save that for an elsewords where Chlorophyll Kid is the latest elemental of the Green and Infectious Lass is a sentient cloud of viral life that infects the bodies of the dead. Legion of Mystery!
Posted by Arm Fall Off Boy on :
I'm not a hundred percent sold on any of them, but here goes... Gazelle-No. Just something about her I just still do not trust. Sizzle-Yes. I think her power has the most potential. Turtle-No. Nice guy, but no. Just too young and inexperienced. Night Girl-No, and that hurts. I have always wanted to like her, but even in this incarnation, turn a bright light on and she's super-powerless
quote:Originally posted by Set: I wouldn't mind seeing her in a book that isn't the Legion, for that matter. Someone totally needs to write a Subs book that isn't a joke, that has them dealing with the sort of stuff that the Legion simply doesn't have time to deal with (it could even be noir-ish, with them helping out the SPs on mysterious cases, like DCs 31st century answer to how PAD's X-Factor run started out!).
Hmm... say a backup feature in Adventure Comics?
Posted by Silver Age Lad on :
I've always loved Lydda as a character but three things have always niggled me:
1 why would anyone not from Earth use an owl as a symbol
2 why 'Night Girl' which is broadcasting her source not her power. Yellow Sun Man doesn't quite have the same ring as Superman.
3 Surely if daddy had the technology to give Lydda super-strength he could have built her a uniform that blotted out the effects of sunlight. And if he couldn't Brainiac 5 certainly could.
[ December 08, 2008, 01:15 AM: Message edited by: Silver Age Lad ]
Posted by Owl Lad on :
Who would seriously be threatened by someone with the code name "Turtle"?
Villain X: "Run! It's Turtle!"
Posted by Set on :
quote:Originally posted by Silver Age Lad: 3 Surely if daddy had the technology to give Lydda super-strength he could have built her a uniform that blotted out the effects of sunlight. And if he couldn't Brainiac 5 certainly could.
And that's a valid point. Exactly how does light rob her of her powers? Does it rob her of her powers when it touches her skin (if so, full body suit with mask, like Sensor Girl!)?
She'd have a drawback that Mon-El and the Supercousins don't have, in that she would lose her strength if her costume is torn, but the Supercousins also lose their powers; 1) In the presence of kryptonite. 2) Under red solar radiation. 3) Against things that are magical.
She also is shown taking Ultra Boy's body-slam that puts a divot and cracks in the wall behind her, which means that this iteration of Night Girl isn't just super-strong, she's also at least kinda invulnerable.
Posted by Set on :
quote:Originally posted by Owl Lad: Who would seriously be threatened by someone with the code name "Turtle"?
Villain X: "Run! It's Turtle!"
Perhaps he should add 'The Great and Powerful' before 'Turtle,' for added effect. Posted by Blockade Boy on :
That would do it.
Posted by Candle on :
Or add 'Ninja'.
Sizzle would be a great addition, I think. Can she convert Tasmias shadow energy? Or is Shadys power really anti-energy? Anyway, I like her so I'd vote for her.
The two beasts? No. They seem to much like fodder, to me.
Lydda? Yes, yes and yes. She's certainly more powerful than Triplicate Girl (in some ways.)
I wouldn't worry about duplication of powers if I were a Legionnaire or if I was a writer. It's duplication on the mini-teams used in different stories that you have to really think about and sometimes you need them. How many times have were seen Lar and Jo teamed up?
But, definitely, Sizzle and NG, even if it's for very different reasons ~ bring on the new and honor the old.
Posted by cleome on :
Originally posted by Set:
quote:...Does it rob her of her powers when it touches her skin (if so, full body suit with mask, like Sensor Girl!)?...
I've been wondering about that forever, too.
It's right up there with "If Rogue wants to play spin-the-bottle with whomever, why doesn't she just take those inhibitor manacles that the Hellfire Club stuck everyone in once and make herself a couple of bracelets out of the SAME MATERIAL ?!"
Yeesh.
Posted by Matthew E on :
quote:Originally posted by Set:
quote:Originally posted by Owl Lad: Who would seriously be threatened by someone with the code name "Turtle"?
Villain X: "Run! It's Turtle!"
Perhaps he should add 'The Great and Powerful' before 'Turtle,' for added effect.
One of the all-time great superhero characters.
Posted by Candle on :
I was always under the impression that NG was given powers by the night. I never thought of the sun as actually taking them away,although that's obviouly correct, in a way, I guess.
But on the other hand, she HAS always lost her powers in ANY kind of light, right? Has that been shown consistantly?
Hum. What wavelenghts effect her? Does she have powers in space? Would blacklights change her abilities? I wonder why Brainy doesn't find her possible abilities and limitations interesting?
As to her invulnerability, I've always thought of her is at least partically invulnerable. I mean, I don't know how she could hit something like a cement wall and not have broken bones if there wasn't SOME special protection there.
Wolverine's is metal bones and almost instant healing, but NG's never had or shown either of those.
Posted by Set on :
quote:Originally posted by Candle: As to her invulnerability, I've always thought of her is at least partically invulnerable. I mean, I don't know how she could hit something like a cement wall and not have broken bones if there wasn't SOME special protection there.
It seems like 'super-strength' has turned into code for 'strong *and* tough' in the last decade or so of comic-dom. Spiderman, for instance, is often shown (in movies and comics) being shoved through walls or getting backhanded by people like The Hulk, which would turn him into spidersplat, since he's never had the smallest hint of 'super-toughness.' Same with Wonder Woman and Thor, both of whom used to have to block *bullets* (with bracer or spinning hammer), but both of which can suck up blasts of destructive force able to knock jetliners out of the sky and collapse buildings with only some soot-smudges and a determined expression to show for it.
On the one hand, I consider it sloppy creeping revisionism, for these characters to become more and more invulnerable / super-tough as the writers enjoy showing them get beat up more often. On the other hand, some of them (like Thor) probably should have been darn near invulnerable from the start.
Ultra Boy is an odd corner case. He'd almost have to retain at least a *smidge* of invulnerability when he's using his super-strength (and perhaps even his super-speed!), or else his fist would shatter like glass the first time he punched something with super-strength.
Posted by rickshaw1 on :
Or just using super strength to lift something. If there wasn't some latent use or protection of invulnerability, the first time the tried to use superstrength to life something they would literally rip their muscles apart. Has to be a certain amount for the body's self preservation.
Human's have varying degrees of this. Pinch yourself and you can do it with no problem...but use sharp fingernails to do it and you will most likely stop before cutting the skin with pressure. Same thing i would imagine.
Posted by Candle on :
quote:Originally posted by rickshaw1: Or just using super strength to lift something. If there wasn't some latent use or protection of invulnerability, the first time the tried to use superstrength to life something they would literally rip their muscles apart. Has to be a certain amount for the body's self preservation.
Human's have varying degrees of this. Pinch yourself and you can do it with no problem...but use sharp fingernails to do it and you will most likely stop before cutting the skin with pressure. Same thing i would imagine.
Seems like Marvel tried to deal with some of these issues way back when they introduced Guardian (I think that's his name). He's like Supes but he has things like TK that helps him hold buildings together when he lifts them and things like that.
DC seemed to want to build that kind of sensible physics stuff into Kon, too, with his TK (telekinesis) powerbase.
The problem with the idea of stopping before you get hurt is that would usually be based on pain levels, right? But there's a lot of athletes that get hurt, sometimes permanently, everyday just doing 'normal' levels of activity. So pain isn't really a very accurate guage.
That and NG couldn't even prevent her outfit from getting messed up when she fought Jo. He might have pulled his punches and resorted to ripping her clothes to make his point, but a 'bad-guy' wouldn't. She'd have to have super defensive moves to keep from getting hurt.
It would seem that her power might be based in magic rather then science.
Maybe that's why Brainy isn't more interested in her. He might suspect that he wouldn't like the answers.
Posted by Mystery Lad on :
The small sample of posters that replied here overwhelmingly would've voted Sizzle in. She received 8 'yes' votes.
Night Girl, surprisingly, received 4 votes. I wonder if the outcome would've been different if we hadn't seen that a Lydda had joined the ACTION LSH?
Turtle caught 3 voters' fancy. I hadn't thought of him as analgous to Ferro Lad, but he pretty much is.
Gazelle, the character that actually got full membership, didn't receive a vote (though Blockade Boy observed that he would've voted for her as a legionnaire, though not as a reader).
![[Smile]](smile.gif)