I think so. At this point you had Sherman doing some amazing art (shame it was cut so short), and you had, i believe, the first real multi-issue storyline (as opposed to a two parter if i remember correctly) that carried over with consequences for more than just an issue or two.
Some folks may make an arguement for the death of Lightning Lad and the quest to restore him, but to me this is the first significant point.
Thoughts?
Posted by Ultra Jorge on :
So tell me when did Earth War start? Through what issues did it run through?
Posted by Jerry on :
Superboy and the Legion of Super-Heroes #241 through #245. Cover dates July trhough November 1978.
Posted by Lance's realm on :
I completely agree with rickshaw about Sherman's artwork. Very nice! I think this is one of the best story arcs in Legion history.
Posted by Sketch Lad on :
I thought the story was kind of schizophrenic, with the Khunds and Dominators and then Mordru. However, I suppose I'm overdue to re-read it.
Sherman's artwork was *unparalled* IMO, which made Joe Staton's work, along with his stable of terrible inkers, even worse. That took a LOT of the steam out if it for me. One redeeming detail is the excellent Galactic Coordinator appearance, though.
Posted by Omni Craig on :
I absolutely loved the Earthwar saga. I was new to the Legion, and didn't know anything about it's history at all when I read these as part of the whitman 3 packs. I didn't know a Legionniare from a Substitute from a Reversist (I used to misread Reservist as Reversists...). I didn't know Karate Kid had been in the 20th Century or who most of the team was that was showing up in all those giant test tubes the Dominators had them in, but I couldn't get enough of it all!!! And Sherman's artwork was brilliant!!!!
Posted by Malvolio on :
Oh, definitely a turning point. I came to the Legion a few years later, and they would refer to Earthwar all the time and I didn't know what it was. Then I finally found the back issues, and... wow! They really ought to release all five issues together in TPB form.
Posted by MLLASH on :
Those last 3 issues deserve to be re-inked if a trade is ever issued.
Sherman's artwork was indeed magnificent but the rush-job on the last 3 issues really did EARTHWAR in for me.
Like Dean, however, I'm overdue for a re-read.
Posted by Sir Tim Drake on :
Issue 242 was the high point of Sherman's career. I remember reading that he decided to leave the series because he felt underappreciated, but on his last issue, he did the best artwork he was capable of, in order to show his employers what they would be missing.
Posted by Ultra Jorge on :
I just read it! I've heard so many good things about it I decided to check it out finally.
Ok, I have to say this is probably an arc that was explosive/dynamic if you were a monthly reader back when it came out. I don't know what came before (trust me I will check that out as well) but this was pretty exciting even now.
I agree Sherman was a good artist. His big faces and close-ups rocked. I'm somewhat of a Staton fan as well and to tell the truth I didn't see much of a change. I credit Staton for using a similiar style? What's that inking called when the shadows are b&w dots? I miss that in comics.
I never really read any pre-Giffen comics. A handful at the most. Now I know what you guys mean about Levitz's first run. (is this considered part of his first?)
I admit I had to read it twice to really get everything. Maybe I read it quick the first time. Levitz did a good job recapping everything though each issue.
Things I liked? The interaction between characters. I always loved how the members bickered. It reminds you of a workplace doesn't it? It starts off with Mon-El complaining about Wildfire. The Element Lad/Sun Boy team. These two characters got lots of action time. Nice to see both of them cut loose. I liked Element Lad saving the day at the end. Why? Because I thought of that myself and his comment earlier about losing his world.
I love WEBER'S world. Maybe I'm a sucker for artifical small worlds like LW. I liked the politics. I liked the Dark Circle. (i've always loved them). I loved the mystery!!! I loved seeing the members being POWERFUL! No real cop outs.
What I didn't like? Mordu. I know it added to the mystery and it was a big reveal? But maybe if subplot had given us more clues. Like a magic bird showing up at Legion HQ instead of Officer Erin. Was this Erin's first appearance?
Basically this story had great action, mystery, character interaction and emotion. I rank it pretty high.
Posted by Longevity Lad on :
Interesting this arc being remembered at this transition time. Just a comparison between this month's first page and that opening full page of Earthwar speaks volumes. If I were a new reader then, that opening page would make me want to stay for the series; no way this current issue's first page would have a similar affect. Quite the opposite, actually. "The hope of the future can be found in the past."
Posted by Cobalt Kid on :
Jorg, yes this is the first appearance of Shvaughn, and the first time we really got to see Weber's World and the ambassadors. That added so much to the story IMO.
I love this story, its one of my favorites. I'd say the best non-Adventure story up until GDS. Tons of action, tons of dynamics b/t various Legionnnaires and just about every Legionnaire has a moment.
I like the Mordru reveal. IIRC, this is only the second time Mordru battles the Legion in the comics (re: not counting the 'untold tale' and not counting his flashback battle with Superboy in the Action backups). That makes it a pretty major reveal!
Mordru, the Khunds, the Dominators, the Dark Circle--so many great Legion enemies that captured so much of the Legion's past. This was the GDS before the GDS.
It had everything: Action! Adventure! Suspense! Internal tension in the Legion! Romance! Returns of old Legionnaires! Returns of great villain! Political cosmic drama! New characters and settings! Not many comics in 2007 can brag about the same.
Posted by Ultra Jorge on :
I didn't know this was only the second time they fight Mordu. That makes a difference and a big deal.
Posted by Eryk Davis Ester on :
There's also the pretty forgettable fake Cosmic Boy story in Superboy, but, yeah, this is pretty much Mordru's second major appearance.
Posted by He Who Wanders on :
I'll agree that "Earthwar" was a major turning point for the Legion, rick, but the first turning point? Probably not. My vote for that would go to the Bates/Cockrum era of new costumes, new members, and retiring old members in the early '70s.
In my opinion, the lasting legacy of "Earthwar" is that it proved that a Marvel-style multiple-issue story could work for the Legion. (Why no one had attempted to do this before remains a mystery to me.) It showed that writers such as Levitz could be amibitious in telling "large" Legion stories, instead of stories that utilized only a few characters and villains acting in petty ways.
Another legacy of "Earthwar," which I also mentioned in my "Great Darkness -- Revisited" thread, is that Levitz tried to show meaningful consequences of the war. Earth was plunged into a depression, and Brande was bankrupt (after the president stole his funds to feed the poor). The Legion had to fend for itself in rebuilding its headquarters (destroyed by Omega in # 251), and they also assisted Brande in rebuilding his fortune (which was understandable in a familial sort of way -- Brande was the Legion's "father" -- but it also showed the Legionnaires acting as mercernaries or as a commercial enterprise. I don't recall anyone questioning this portrayal at the time, but perhaps someone should have. It would have made the consequences of the Earthwar even more significant by showing how people's loyalties can be divided in times of crisis.)
I should go back and re-read those issues, too, before making further judgments. But, for right now, I believe "Earthwar" was a valuable stepping stone on the way to "GDS" and the more mature and meaningful stories that followed in the Levitz/Giffen and Giffen/Bierbaums eras.
Posted by Cobalt Kid on :
I had forgotten about that one Posted by Tromium on :
I love Earthwar and enjoy it more than the GDS. It was probably Element Lad's finest hour and the return of the married founders at the end made the Legion (almost) whole again. But I wouldn't necessarily call it a major "turning point" except in one sense -- it boosted the popularity of the already popular 70s Legion high enough they got to headline the series about a year later.
Levitz's first run was less cynical and beholden to faux "realism" than his second run. He brilliantly reinforced the developed mythos of the Legion in the 70s, whereas later he began dismantling it. Earthwar need to be collected in trade as one of the best examples of the LSH in its prime.
Posted by He Who Wanders on :
Funny, I never saw Levitz's second run as "cynical." Rather, I saw it as life affirming and holding true to the Legion's overall identity while allowing individual characters to grow and change. To me, this is a celebration of the Legion's mythos, not a dismantling of it.
Posted by Ultra Jorge on :
heh, nice defense of Levitz's 2nd run! To his credit I think all comics got the faux realism thing going in the 80's.
Posted by He Who Wanders on :
I'm not even sure what "faux realism" means. There was certainly an attempt to make super-heroes more believable by having them experience problems that ordinary humans undergo -- but this idea had been started by Marvel in the early '60s. DC was slow to catch up, but not by much. Certainly by the '80s, virtually every Marvel and DC hero was portrayed as a well-rounded character who underwent believable changes (as well as not-so-believable ones). So, I'm not sure what aspects of Levitz's Legion were "faux realism."
Posted by doublechinner on :
Thinking about Earthwar, in many ways it was the apotheosis of Shooter's Legion.
Shooter's first story introduced the Khunds. He also created the Dark Circle, Universo and Mordru, accounting for most of the Legion's serious bad guys up until the Great Darkness.
Shooter also moved to make the Legionnaires more 3-dimensional and distinctive, played up the relationships between members, told 2-part stories, etc. Bates, Cockrum, Grell and Shooter again took things to the next level in the early 1970s with very cool costumes and more grown up situations. All of this "Marvelized" the Legion, and the characterizations of Wildfire and Dawnstar were the icing on the cake. Earthwar crystalized those characterizations.
So, Levitz took all these elements and wove them into multi-layered, multi-part tale and introduced some of his own elements, notably Weber's World (who was it named after, anyway?). This was probably as good as the Dark Circle and Mordru ever got. (The Khunds were given a lot of nice development by Levitz in the 1980s.) All three levels of bad guy had tried to conquer Earth in the past, and failed, so how cool that they all end up working together (sort of), and come within a hair's breadth of succeeding. That's what I most remember from Earthwar--I think it was the most suspenseful story in Legion history. Right up to the end, I thought the Legion was toast.
Posted by Ultra Jorge on :
Oh I just remembered. I didn't like Khundia. There were people wearing head phones and skate boarding I think. It looked very earth-like.
And I don't where the name Weber's World comes from. It had to be in one of those Encyclopedia Galactica entries.
Posted by He Who Wanders on :
I've always thought of the Khunds as DC's version of the Klingons. Same warrior race idea, same convenient bad guy usage, same initial letter.
In addition to Weber's World, "Earthwar" also re-introduced us to the perpetual diplomat, Ambassador Relnic. Every time I see his name, I think its spelled backwards, or perhaps it's an anagram. Does anybody know its origin?
[ July 06, 2007, 12:31 PM: Message edited by: He Who Wanders ]
Posted by Cobalt Kid on :
quote:Originally posted by doublechinner: Thinking about Earthwar, in many ways it was the apotheosis of Shooter's Legion.
Shooter's first story introduced the Khunds. He also created the Dark Circle, Universo and Mordru, accounting for most of the Legion's serious bad guys up until the Great Darkness.
Shooter also moved to make the Legionnaires more 3-dimensional and distinctive, played up the relationships between members, told 2-part stories, etc. Bates, Cockrum, Grell and Shooter again took things to the next level in the early 1970s with very cool costumes and more grown up situations. All of this "Marvelized" the Legion, and the characterizations of Wildfire and Dawnstar were the icing on the cake. Earthwar crystalized those characterizations.
So, Levitz took all these elements and wove them into multi-layered, multi-part tale and introduced some of his own elements, notably Weber's World (who was it named after, anyway?). This was probably as good as the Dark Circle and Mordru ever got. (The Khunds were given a lot of nice development by Levitz in the 1980s.) All three levels of bad guy had tried to conquer Earth in the past, and failed, so how cool that they all end up working together (sort of), and come within a hair's breadth of succeeding. That's what I most remember from Earthwar--I think it was the most suspenseful story in Legion history. Right up to the end, I thought the Legion was toast.
Never thought of it like that, but I agree completely. Earthwar then stands as a culmination of 'phase #1' almost, or at lest a part of the culmination, the next I'd wager being Superboy's exit from the title.
I love Earthwar. I think I need to reread it, as its one of the few stories that I've only read one time. Pov was with me when I bought the whole thing for like five bucks!
Posted by Kent Shakespeare on :
Shooter's Khunds actually predate the Klingons, but not by much. But clearly 70s LSH was strongly influenced by Trek - they even had transporter beams briefly (during Earthwar, I think?)
Sherman's art was great, but IIRC, he left becuase he didn't like mixing Mordru into the story.
The story was kind of all over the place, and while it had its neat elements, the strongest part to me was the potwar implications - that was the real "turning point" for me: the aftermath, the political and economic fallout, and the need to rebuild.
Posted by He Who Wanders on :
quote:Originally posted by Kent Shakespeare: Shooter's Khunds actually predate the Klingons, but not by much.
You're right about that, Kent. Adventure # 346 was cover dated July 1966 (meaning it was probably on sale in March or April). The Klingons first appeared in Star Trek's "Errand of Mercy," which aired nearly a year later, on March 23, 1967 ... another example of the Legion anticipating some cultural phenomena (e.g., Timber Wolf/Wolverine, Karate Kid/martial arts, etc.)
Posted by Ultra Jorge on :
quote:Originally posted by He Who Wanders: I've always thought of the Khunds as DC's version of the Klingons. Same warrior race idea, same convenient bad guy usage, same initial letter.
In addition to Weber's World, "Earthwar" also introduced us to the perpetual diplomat, Ambassador Relnic. Every time I see his name, I think its spelled backwards, or perhaps it's an anagram. Does anybody know its origin?
can we get a Levitz interview? Ask him how he came up the names like Shvaughn Erin, Relnic, and Weber's World.
Weber's World? wikipedia lists a few Weber's that might be it? doubt it though.
There was a gravitational physicist called Joseph Weber.
Wilhelm Eduard Weber, physicist and inventor of the telegraph. The SI unit of magnetic flux, the weber (symbol: Wb) is named after him.
Posted by Ultra Jorge on :
I always loved the artifical constructs like Null-Port, Weber's World, Labrynth, and Legion World.
I think Weber's World and Legion World need to return asap! Destroy the moon again and have LW replace it. Posted by He Who Wanders on :
OK -- I spent a sleepless night last night re-reading the entire "Earthwar." It reminded me that, when this story first appeared, I really didn't like it at all.
First, let me say that I admire Paul Levitz's overall contribution to the Legion, and, when all is said and done, he made the most positive contributions of any of the Legion's long-term writers. But with "Earthwar," the 21-year-old Levitz was still feeling his way as a comic book writer. The plot is rather clever, in that you have villains using villains using villains, but its execution leaves much to be desired.
The early chapters feel rushed, which probably was intended to create a sense of urgency. Instead it conveys the impression that Levitz was trying to get through this story as quickly as possible. It's only after Lightning Lad and Saturn Girl appear that the pacing of the story slows down enough that the reader can reflect on what is happening and how dire the situation is. Perhaps Garth and Imra were Levitz's favorite characters and this entire story was engineered for their return. That is, after all, the most significant and immediate outcome of this story.
None of the other Legionnaires get much valuable screen time, and, when they do, they look bad. Element Lad seems vindictive for sending Brainy out in a ship all by himself to Weber's World, after Brainy has twice usurped Jan's role as deputy leader. (Ironically, E-Lad's team makes it to Weber's World in advance of Brainy, who never does arrive!) Brainy spends his time complaining and making fatalistic prognostications -- symptoms, we will later realize, of his mounting insanity. Wildfire is a reckless jerk who nearly causes a Science Police ship to crash and then accuses Ambassador Relnic and Ontiir of collusion with the enemy without any real evidence. Dawnstar feels it necessary to remind Drake that his powers can kill criminals (which may actually be a reasonable reaction on her part, given Drake's earlier impulsiveness). Most of the other Legionnaires just go through the motions of doing what they have to do.
As for the art: Jim Sherman has been praised for his early work on the Legion, but here, in his final two issues (# 241-242), he, too, seems to be rushing through his job as quickly as possible. Anatomy and faces look awkward and bland; action scenes are competent, but uninspiring (much of this cannot be blamed on the inker, which is often the case when appraising Sherman's work).
The art improves somewhat after Joe Staton takes over and is inked by Joe Giella (on # 244) and Murphy Anderson (on # 245).
Coloring is rarely discussed, but here it should be. Cory Adams' colors are also bland and he frequently uses different shades of the same colors in key scenes -- hardly the most appropriate choices for a space-faring epic with multiple characters and settings.
To me, "Earthwar" should be remembered for what it attempted to achieve, if not for what it fully realized. It was an ambitious undertaking that expanded the Legion's world by introducing more political tensions to complement the Imsk/UP tensions introduced earlier; by showing that a multi-part story could work in the Legion's setting; and by changing one of the fundamental rules of the Legion's Constitution (no married members), thereby paving the way for the characters to grow up.
The ending is also rather poignant and ironic in hindsight. With Garth and Imra rejoining, the Legion is whole again, just as they were in Adventure # 351, when other former members rejoined. Earth is safe and celebrates its heroes. The Dominators sign a 1,000-year peace treaty (on which they would apparently later renege.) The Legion would probably never again be this whole. As such, this ending takes on a fairy-tale quaility. It represents the apex of the Legion's idealized adolescence -- before everything changes.
[ July 06, 2007, 02:04 PM: Message edited by: He Who Wanders ]
Posted by Ultra Jorge on :
Levitz was 21?! That makes it even better! Posted by Eryk Davis Ester on :
One thing you should keep in mind when reading the Shooter stuff that he's only 13.
Posted by Ultra Jorge on :
quote:Originally posted by Eryk Davis Ester: One thing you should keep in mind when reading the Shooter stuff that he's only 13.
Oh trust me I do. Which also makes it cool. I guess we can't cut Levitz slack at 21 when Shooter started at 13. lol.
Posted by imskian78 on :
My second issue. I was 11...wow! My first was number 248 bought in a Whitman sampler 3 pack.lol. I'm with a few of you all I was blown away with all the members and couldnt tell who was who but that is why I was so excited. Next year will be my 30 year anniversary reading Legion of Super Heroes...what a ride! About Earthwar....Loved Sherman art, Element lad with long hair, Weber's World/Ontir, the Lost in space test tubes every one was held in, the story and it's multi parts. Disliked..rushed, sloppy art and color on last few issues, not enough screen time for Shrinking Violet. All in all better than the current crap...even for a ten year old! Long live the Legion!
Posted by Mystery Lad on :
I discovered I no longer have these issues when I saw HWW's thread and decided to reread the story before reading HWW's review!
*How'd* that happen?!!
Guess I'll have to bug my LCS next week...
I knew I had some holes before Levitz's second stint, but I thought they were later!
Part of me wants to wait on Archives... but at the rate DC's putting *those* out these days, I'll in a retirement home by the time they get to the Reflecto saga.
Posted by He Who Wanders on :
I'm glad that my reviews have made you want to re-read the old stories, Mystery Lad, but this isn't my thread. Rickshaw1 beat me to it. Posted by Kid Charlemagne on :
I think the name of Weber's World comes from the German sociologist Max Weber, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Max_Weber who wrote extensively on the sociology of religion and government, and pioneered the study of bureaucracy and the use of that word. Hence, it would be appropriate to name an artificial planetoid devoted to government functions after him.
Posted by Eryk Davis Ester on :
Yeah, I was thinking it was Max Weber as well, but couldn't remember why it would be him, but that makes a lot of sense.
Posted by Chemical King on :
I also have very fond memories of Earthwar - though I did not read it when it first came out in Germany, it was one of my favorites when I hunted down all of the German Legion appearances in the sooner 90s. They dedicated a whole small format paperback to Earthwar back in the 80s which I found later on and loved to read.
I really consider this the first "modern style" Legion story. It has the first longer story arc I can remember, though it was kind of incoherent because the villains kept on changing til Mordru came out as the Mastermind. But it still is a big story which I would recommend as a starting point for every new fan unfamiliar with the great old continuity...
I absolutely adored Shermans art (every of his too few issues) and also think that it is a shame that he did not do the whole arc. A real pity. I consider Sherman one of the best legion artists ever right up there with the young (and the 5YL) Giffen, Lightle and Pat Broderick. Better than Coipiel and Kitson.
So yes, I think Earthwar was a major turning point which lead into what later became the Great Darkness, LSV War, Universo Project and Conspiracy. If they really bring back the Cockrum legion for good, this might be a crucial reprint option...
Posted by tyrociscool on :
I think my favorite Earthwar memory is the introduction of Ontiir. I have always liked that it took 5 years to prove he was a plant.
Posted by Blockade Boy on :
quote:Originally posted by tyrociscool: Ontiir... it took 5 years to prove he was a plant.
Yeah, but whose? Good memories you bring up. Ontiir was as good a disposible character as Legion has had.
Posted by Insaniac5 on :
The first Legion comic I ever bought was the conclusion of Earthwar. Of course I went back and got the back issues soon thereafter. Earthwar was awesome. Political intrigue, mystery, the entire Legion (except Tyroc!) took part, multiple villains for the Legion to fight. It was like three wars in one. And of course the fact that Mordru was behind it all was great, and the way Saturn Girl, Brainy, and E-Lad teamed up to defeat him was awesome. To answer the OP, I think it was a turning point just because of the scope of the war, and the fact that earth put up that poly shield afterwards. Perhaps it was the beginning of a darker Levitz Legion, too.
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