Ultra Jorge’s recent post in “The Legend of Valor – Visited” pointed out that Mon-El and Captain America share something very significant: Both are “men out of time.” Mon-El, born sometime in the early 20th century, spent 1,000 years in the Phantom Zone after contracting lead poisoning. Captain American, born in 1917, spent somewhere between 19 and 50 years in suspended animation, due to a trap set by Baron Zemo.
But the similarities don’t stop there. Mon and Cap have a lot in common, as listed below. But there are also significant differences in their long journeys, and in how they adjusted to living in a world (or universe) far removed from the one they left behind.
Following a listing of these similarities and differences, I’ll present some conclusions about their shared experience of being men out of time. Please post your own thoughts, as well as any points of comparison I may have missed.
Posted by He Who Wanders on :
I. Life before entering stasis Captain America was a professional soldier. He had volunteered for service and had been given a super-soldier serum to turn him into a fighting machine.
Mon-El was a space traveler with no known, previous fighting experience. (In the TMK era, Mon-El, as Valor, led troops against in the Dominion War.) His powers were a surprise, the result of his exposure to a yellow sun.
Cap was 27 when he was frozen. [He was born July 4, 1917, and frozen in April 1945, according to various sources.]
Mon was said to be “over 18" in his origin story. We know that he must have been no more than 18 in order to qualify for Legion membership.
Cap’s best friend was his sidekick, Bucky Barnes.
Mon’s only known friend was Superboy, who became his “little brother.”
II. Life during stasis Captain America was unconscious the entire time.
Mon-El was awake the entire time.
III. Life after stasis Mon was freed by the Legion and then joined that group.
Cap was revived by the Avengers and then joined that group.
Mon’s friend, Superboy, was present when he emerged from the Phantom Zone.
Cap’s friend, Bucky, had died in Zemo’s trap. [Since retconned, of course.]
Mon had a long-term relationship with Shadow Lass, whom he eventually married.
Cap had troubled relationships with Peggy and Sharon Carter, and other women.
Mon served in the Legion continuously for many years.
Cap served in the Avengers on and off.
Mon served two terms as Legion leader.
Cap has been the Avengers’ primary leader throughout its history.
Mon was part of the Legion’s “Big Three,” with Ultra Boy and Superboy.
Cap was part of the Avengers’ “Big Three,” with Thor and Iron Man.
Mon rarely spoke of his time in the Phantom Zone or of feeling out of time, until a villain manipulated his mind to bring back painful memories.
Cap often suffered from identity crises, doubted his place in the world, and sometimes gave up his role as Captain America.
Posted by Ultra Jorge on :
Life before stasis? They were already living legends? That was the big deal of them appearing. (was mon-el a living legend?)
Posted by Quislet, Esq. on :
Before Ret-con, Mon-el would not have been considered a legend, living or otherwise. He was just a space traveler with amnesia and super-powers.
Another man out of time would be Sir Justin, the Shining Knight. He also seemed to make the adjustment to the future without too much difficulty.
Posted by He Who Wanders on :
Conclusion: Mon-El adapted to being “a man out of time” better than Cap, probably for several reasons:
1. Mon-El’s long-term relationship with Shadow Lass stabilized his moods in a way that Cap’s on-again-off-again relationships could not. Mon didn’t have much time to brood.
2. Cap was revived after less than half a century; much of the world he knew was still there, as were many of the people (albeit older, such as Peggy Carter). They reminded him constanty of how out of synch he was.
3. Mon-El entered a world far removed from the one he left behind. There was no hope of “going back” to the life he knew, so it was easier for him to separate from it.
4. As Cap was unconscious throughout his stasis, it must have been a total shock for him to wake up decades later. Mon watched time pass and was able to mentally adjust to change.
5. The Legion had a very stable membership, with very few people leaving during its first several years. The Avengers’ lineup changed constantly. It was therefore easier for Mon to build and maintain relationships than for Cap.
6. Whereas Mon didn’t have to bother with a life outside the Legion, Cap reestablished his secret identity and tried a variety of careers (including comic book artist!). Cap also had an extensive solo career as a hero, whereas Mon’s activities were mainly tied to the Legion.
7. The presence of Superboy as a link to Mon-El’s past no doubt aided his transition into the future, whereas Cap had no such link. (This may also explain why Mon wanted to kill the Time Trapper: Superboy’s death nmeant the loss of his brother as well as his last link to his past.)
For the sake of argument, it might be suggested that Cap had a healthier way of dealing with being out of time. He freely expressed his doubts, confided in his partner, The Falcon, and took action when appropriate (even if it meant stepping away from his identity for a time). Mon may have been keeping his feelings inside, which may explain his outbursts and brooding during LSH v. 3. Yet its striking that instability marked Cap’s post-stasis life and career, while Mon’s was very stable until Superboy’s passing.
Posted by Eryk Davis Ester on :
I'm not sure how this factors in, but it's important to remember that Mon had already been "removed from his time" even before he was put in the Phantom Zone. He'd already spent fifteen years or so in suspended animation.
Of course, he didn't realize that until moments before he was put in the Phantom Zone, but I wonder if that didn't have some effect on his ability to accept his situation.
Posted by He Who Wanders on :
quote:Originally posted by Quislet, Esq.: Another man out of time would be Sir Justin, the Shining Knight. He also seemed to make the adjustment to the future without too much difficulty.
Good point, Quis. Any idea how Justin might compare to Cap and Mon in other ways?
Posted by He Who Wanders on :
quote:Originally posted by Eryk Davis Ester: I'm not sure how this factors in, but it's important to remember that Mon had already been "removed from his time" even before he was put in the Phantom Zone. He'd already spent fifteen years or so in suspended animation.
Of course, he didn't realize that until moments before he was put in the Phantom Zone, but I wonder if that didn't have some effect on his ability to accept his situation.
Good point, Eryk. I suppose the first thing Mon might have done while in the Phantom Zone would be to check up on his family and friends back on Daxam. He must have wondered what had happened to them in the past 15 years.
Of course, I've often suspected that Mon didn't have close family ties or friends on Daxam. I've always wondered why he didn't go back there from Krypton, instead of heading to earth.
Posted by Matthew E on :
Another good comparison is Captain Atom, a military guy like Captain America, who timejumped from the '60s to the '80s in his DC title back in the '80s. (Highly recommended, by the way. Pat Broderick!)
Posted by He Who Wanders on :
I loved the CAPTAIN ATOM series, Matthew. One of the standout features was that Captain Atom's attitudes often reflected those of someone who was not privvy to all the social changes since the '60s. In one particular instance, he didn't know how to react when his grown daughter, started dating his best friend, a middle-aged black man. This does not mean that Captain Atom was racist, but it does reflect the reality that interracial (and intergenerational) dating was not widely accepted in the '60s.
Posted by Ultra Jorge on :
I think the fact that Mon-El was awake the entire time makes it very dramatic. He had major character development. Sure he was 18 physically but he was 1000 years old mentally.
Posted by Quislet, Esq. on :
quote:Originally posted by He Who Wanders:
quote:Originally posted by Quislet, Esq.: Another man out of time would be Sir Justin, the Shining Knight. He also seemed to make the adjustment to the future without too much difficulty.
Good point, Quis. Any idea how Justin might compare to Cap and Mon in other ways?
Well apparently Sir Justin was also trapped in ice as the reason for his being out of time, and thus unaware of the passage of time. He also had established a reputation for himself as a hero prior to his being frozen. (both similar to Cap) There was more of a time span between his own time and the time he found himself to be in (like Mon-el).
He was able to travel back to his own time, but returned to the future. Given the Legion's access to time travel, Mon-el would have been able to travel back to his own time, but seems to have choosen not to.
Sir Justin was given a kid sidekick (Sir Butch who was from our time) and I am sure he had the requisite love interest. Although a member of the Seven Soldiers of Victory aka the Law's Legionnaires, that group was not an organization like either the Avengers or the Legion. And Sir Justin was not brought out into the future by the Seven Soldiers, unlike Cap or Mon-el.
I don't think that there was ever a reason why Sir Justin adapted to our modern world so readily and choose to remain here.
Posted by He Who Wanders on :
Thanks for the info on Sir Justin, Quis. I must say, I'd quite forgotten about him.
I would assume that Mon-El never went back to his original time for the usual reason: It would change history. That doesn't explain Sir Justin's actions, however. Perhaps history doesn't apply to mythological knights.
Posted by He Who Wanders on :
quote:Originally posted by Ultra Jorge: I think the fact that Mon-El was awake the entire time makes it very dramatic. He had major character development. Sure he was 18 physically but he was 1000 years old mentally.
True, and in spite of having lived through so much of history, he seemed to be on the same level, emotionally and mentally, as his Legion peers.
This suggests that his experiences in the Phantom Zone didn't change him as much as one would expect. Perhaps having no physical presence or ability to interact with the "real world" had some bearing on this.
Posted by Vee on :
quote:Originally posted by He Who Wanders: This suggests that his experiences in the Phantom Zone didn't change him as much as one would expect. Perhaps having no physical presence or ability to interact with the "real world" had some bearing on this.
I would argue that after a short amount of time (perhaps a few decades) in the Phantom Zone, you would become disconnected from the real world and reality would take on a dream-like quality to a certain extent. When something critical occured to someone he cared about, Mon would have been attentive but other times he likely just drifted along, & probably spent lots of this time exploring the distant reaches of the universe.
Posted by He Who Wanders on :
Interesting hypothesis, Vee. This would make Mon's experiences similar to those of The Spectre and Dr. Manhattan, both of whom became disconnected from emotions after their bodies died.
Your explanation might also account for how Mon-El stayed sane in the Phantom Zone: intellectual curiosity kept his mind occupied and growing.
Posted by Eryk Davis Ester on :
As I recall, it's not clear how much of what goes on in the "real world" someone in the Phantom Zone would actually experience. One only gets occasional flashes of what happens "outside" the Zone.
The other interesting thing was he was in there with the Phantom Zone prisoners, who were his only company for those thousand years.
Posted by He Who Wanders on :
quote:Originally posted by Eryk Davis Ester: As I recall, it's not clear how much of what goes on in the "real world" someone in the Phantom Zone would actually experience. One only gets occasional flashes of what happens "outside" the Zone.
Hm. If this is the case, Mon may not have been fully aware of how much time had passed while he was in the Zone.
Posted by He Who Wanders on :
quote:Originally posted by Eryk Davis Ester: The other interesting thing was he was in there with the Phantom Zone prisoners, who were his only company for those thousand years.
Perhaps this also helped him maintain his sanity. It's better to have company that hates you than no company at all.