I mean, couldn't Char Burrane just have come up with another name? It's not like Starfinger was really a big name villain, or that the name was so intrinsically cool that it by its nature it struck fear into the heart of the Legionnaires.
Yet you get this whole war between rival gangs over the name! What gives?
Posted by MLLASH on :
One of the BLAH-er storylines of the Baxter era.
Me? I prefer the name "Spacefinger"!
Posted by Eryk Davis Ester on :
I mean, if I were going to kill a villain and steal his name, I think I'd pick someone like the Persuader.
I mean, compare:
"Look that's the new Persuader!"
"The guy who killed the old Persuader?"
"Yeah! He's one badnass!"
versus:
"Look that's the new Starfinger!"
"Who?"
"The guy who killed the old Starfinger!"
"Who?"
"You know, that guy who once kidnapped half of Duo Damsel!"
Posted by Eryk Davis Ester on :
I suppose it could be worse. I mean... he could have thought to himself, "I, Char Burrane, will adopt the villainous identity of Vibrex II!"
[ July 06, 2004, 10:01 PM: Message edited by: Eryk Davis Ester ]
Posted by MLLASH on :
Where's the Vibrex smiley...? The all-VIBREX thread...? Posted by Pov on :
Vi-Brek? Now that might be interesting...
If she had his powers also, and was stuck at 6 inches or less, she could use the codename SNOWFLAKE!
....MAAAAYbe not... Posted by Kent Shakespeare on :
I'd give the originators of all these names the finger.
Posted by Future on :
For the sake of argument, shouldn't the original be called Starfingers, seeing as how he used all four and his thumb with his powers?
-finger does seem like an overplayed suffix for a 60s villain. But Starhand or Stardigit sound incredibly silly, I suppose.
More people should have fought over the powers and equipment/weapons than the name.
Posted by Pov on :
I blame Bill Finger... even though I'm sure he had nothing to do with ANY of them... Posted by Super Lad Kid on :
Perhaps he should be updated for the new millenium and be called Starmember?
Maybe not.
Posted by Eryk Davis Ester on :
quote:Originally posted by Super Lad Kid: Perhaps he should be updated for the new millenium and be called Starmember?
I can distort your powers with various rays from my... Posted by rickshaw1 on :
Could have been worse, he could have been "Pullmyfinger".
Posted by Pov on :
That was Gas Girl's original codename. Posted by rickshaw1 on :
Posted by He Who Wanders on :
This is a good example of why you shouldn't tamper with an original creation. I didn't even remember that there had ever been a second Starfinger until recently, when I was going through some back issues.
It makes no sense that a new villain would want to use an old villain's name. But that's comic book logic for you.
Posted by Nightcrawler on :
quote:Originally posted by MLLASH: Where's the Vibrex smiley...? The all-VIBREX thread...?
Posted by Leap Year Lass on :
No.
Posted by Flannel Lass on :
quote:Originally posted by He Who Wanders: It makes no sense that a new villain would want to use an old villain's name. But that's comic book logic for you.
Comic books are always reusing names. Nightwing was originally Superman's alias when fighting crime with Jimmy Olsen in the bottle city of Karnak. Jimmy was known as Flamebird, which is now the name of a blonde bombshell tennis player from L.A. who wanted to be a superhero so she could meet Robin because she'd had a crush on him since before she was rewritten, back when she was the niece of Batwoman aka Kathy Kane!
Ow, my freakin' head...
[ July 26, 2004, 08:59 PM: Message edited by: Flannel Lass ]
Posted by He Who Wanders on :
quote:Originally posted by Flannel Lass:
quote:
Comic books are always reusing names.
True. But it still makes no sense.
At least Marvel's heroic Black Knight was related to the villainous Black Knight. And the name "Power Man" was generic enough that Luke Cage probably didn't realize that Erik Josten had it first. A case could even be made that since Dick Grayson knew and admired Superman, he wanted to use one of his cast-off identities (I don't recall if that was the rationale or not).
But for an unrelated villain to appropriate the name of the first Starfinger just makes no sense to me. It would be like someone calling himself Unabomber II.
Posted by Eryk Davis Ester on :
quote:Originally posted by He Who Wanders: But for an unrelated villain to appropriate the name of the first Starfinger just makes no sense to me.
And especially to kill the previous villain with the name, just so he could have it.
Posted by Jorge Martinez on :
I am in the middle in this. Starfinger (both versions) were pretty bad. Like the topic suggests did we really need an attempt at a 2nd or 3rd Starfinger? Luckily many of the loser villains in Legion lore aren't used again.
I think it's cool reusing parts of the mythology as long as it doesn't get too complicated. I rather have a new character reuse a codename than the villain be ressurrected 10 times.
When it comes to the Legion and their vast history...it's fun to use some of the past but ultimately we have learned it can get very complicated...and may not be worth it...especially when it revolves around any "starfinger".
Jorge
Posted by Flannel Lass on :
quote:Originally posted by He Who Wanders: A case could even be made that since Dick Grayson knew and admired Superman, he wanted to use one of his cast-off identities (I don't recall if that was the rationale or not).
Actually, Superman told Dick "an old Kryptonian story" about a hero who was known only as Nightwing.
quote: But for an unrelated villain to appropriate the name of the first Starfinger just makes no sense to me. It would be like someone calling himself Unabomber II.
Meh. People are strange that way. Maybe they just couldn't think of one themself, or wanted to be known as all badnass for killing someone to take his name...
Posted by Cobalt Kid on :
I think each appearance of Starfinger should include an all-new bad guy with the name. Like a run-on joke, with each Starfinger getting harder to beat, although the occasionally crappy one gives for good comedy.
Imagine: Starfinger VII is a major baddie, yet Starfinger VIII is a quick four page beat-down by Timberworlf. Starfinger IX is a girl, Starfinger X is some weird alien creature that actually leads into a major alien invasion a la Earth War...
Why, this joke could go on well into the 22nd Century if the Legion is still being written then!
Posted by Eryk Davis Ester on :
Jeepers, Cobie! With ideas like that you may get that co-plotting job on MEL:TS yet!
Posted by Cobalt Kid on :
Thanks EDE! My brain has been secreting extra creative juices lately!
(However, my spelling remains unaffected. Who knows if I spelt secrete right?! )
I really like that Starfinder idea! Co-plotting MEL:TS would be an honor beyond honors!
Posted by matlock on :
Yeah, it could be a legacy name just like Starman/boy/girl etc. Get James Robinson on the phone, somebody. Let's retcon in a Golden Age Starfinger to get the ball rolling.
Posted by Jorge Martinez on :
I gotta agree Cobalt Kid that's a great idea! Have Starfinger as a running joke...every few years a new loser shows up and the Legion beat him in a few panels and then make fun of him.
Jorge
Posted by Cad Lad on :
I don't know if the Starfinger name was worth fighting for, but wasn't the idea that the Hanscoms and the Buranes were like two feuding hillbilly tribes from the space Ozarks? They're the Mcoys and the Hatsfields (?) of the stars.
Posted by Eryk Davis Ester on :
Yeah, but I think the origins of the feud are with Burrane killing Hanscom. If he hadn't been so gung-ho on the name, there'd be no feud!
Posted by matlock on :
Still, it could only have improved Char Burrane if there'd been some weird alien hillbilly playing "Dueling Space-Banjoes" behind him at all times.
Posted by Cobalt Kid on :
Chuck made sure Tenzil and Cos promised to never speak about that trip!
Posted by Kid Quislet on :
If memory serves, Burrane found a star ring during an escape from prison on Mars. With the ring worn on his finger, the name "Starfinger" was an obvious choice. Now, your average citizen might say "Shucks, too bad the Starfinger name is already taken. I'll have to go with Ring Guy..." but Char was a nasty SOB and choose to kill the original owner, lay claim to all the rights to the Starfinger name, steal his internet address, etc. Was it right to do? No, but there's bad guys for you. It makes perfect sense to me.
Posted by Eryk Davis Ester on :
I don't know. He could just have easily named himself "Starro the Conqueror!" I mean... that guy's probably already dead, and was really a much bigger villain in his day.
Posted by rickshaw1 on :
Well, here's the thing. It's like the old west, when some young whippersnapper would come along and try to take down the fastest draw, the best shot...etc...
Taking down a known name gave them a certain amount of respect. So, if you are the new starfinger, and people know you got rid of the old one, you are automatically tougher. True or not, that is how a lot of people see things.
This would give you a base you might not have had to begin to grow your own rep, even using the old name.
Or, they could just be nuts.
Posted by Eryk Davis Ester on :
Yeah, but then my point is that Starfinger wasn't exactly a big time villain... I mean, his most successful scheme required hypnotising Lightning Lad to do his bidding...
Posted by Cobalt Kid on :
I still like the idea of there being many Starfingers through the years. Some being major villians, some throwaway one-issue ones.
This way, each new Legion writer that is going to stay for a long run can have his own 'Starfinger' story!
(Just a quick plug for my idea on the previous page )
Posted by matlock on :
Maybe we're overlooking something. Maybe the total lameness of the name Starfinger is sort of a stab at reverse psychology. Anyone who is crazy enough to try to be a big time crime lord with the dopey name Starfinger must really have something up his sleeve.
Posted by Eryk Davis Ester on :
So, after thinking about this subject more, what would've made the whole fight over the Starfinger name story worthwhile would have been if Lars Hanscom came back from the dead and eliminated the pretender. After all, the guy *was* obsessed with achieving immortality. If any Legion villain could've come back, it would've been him.
Maybe Garth could've had some sort of post-hypnotic suggestion to revive him if anything ever happened to him?
Posted by Language Arts Kid on :
or... Proty VIII could take his place and Saturn Girl could use her mental powers to help "convince" everyone he's the real Lars Hanscom
Posted by Kid Quislet on :
Well, I think Starfinger (both versions) was a cool character. As ruthless gang leaders, they were both able to give the Legion a handful of trouble in each of their original appearances.
I discount the S&LOSH #200 story because Starfinger really didn't have his gang with him, under the minimalist writing style of Cary Bates. A more appropriate villian in that story would have been Nemesis Kid - an alchemist looking for a way to overcome his weakness of defeat by numerous opponents by creating multiple versions of himself would have made more sense!
Posted by Korbal on :
Actually--Levitz had Burrane starting his criminal career when Gim first joined the Legion--that's at least a few years before Hanscomb kidnapped Garth. Perhaps Burrane had the name first and merely was punishing a pretender...
Posted by Eryk Davis Ester on :
quote:Waid commented his first time writing Legion did not go so well because they were too beholden to the old stories. One post-reboot thing he particularly disliked was that they used a silly villain with a retarded name (Starfinger) just because they felt like they had to because the old Legion fought him around then.
Posted by Eryk Davis Ester on :
For the record, Starfinger II was totally redeemed by his animated appearance!
Posted by Invisible Brainiac on :
Maybe the villains fighting over the name just couldn't think of any code name that was more sinister.
Posted by Eryk Davis Ester on :
Hmm... I don't think "Staropussy" would've worked as well, so maybe you're right... Posted by Invisible Brainiac on :
It's still loads better than, oh I don't know, "Fingeropussy"... Posted by He Who Wanders on :
Fighting over villain names must be like fighting over band names. There must be some criminal super-lawyer somewhere who makes sure each villain has a(n il)legal right to the name. But when a villain abandons the name (by dying or going to prison, perhaps), the name is up for grabs. So some newcomer grabs it. And then--what do you know?--the original owner comes back to life or gets out of prison and a fight ensues.
Hey, if names like The Byrds, Jefferson Starship, and The Guess Who are worth fighting over, then Starfinger surely is.
Posted by Eryk Davis Ester on :
So, I've had this vision for a really cool version of Starfinger the past couple of days. It's kind of Tony Stark combined with the Moriarty from the BBC Sherlock series.
It's like this really well-dressed, flamboyantly gay criminal mastermind with tons of little gadgets at his disposal, from a powerglove and genie-summoning ring to a full-blown suit of armor that he can don when necessary, and who runs his criminal empire from a groovy base in one of the domed cities of Mars.
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