Why not just publish a Legion of Earth-One with all of it's history intact and keep it as far away from the modern day DCU as possible.
From: San Diego, CA | Registered: Jul 2003
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quote:Originally posted by Pariscub: Well, we can't have the "original legion" back anyway, as their story has been changed both by Crisis on Infinite Earths and in completely unknown ways by Infinite Crisis, so i don't mind an "updated" origin story as, after all, we didn't know how Superman met the Legion in the New Earth continuity.
You see... I don't understand this at all. Why exactly can't we have the original Legion back? It seems to me DC could just say, "Oh yeah, we're going to start publishing the original Legion again, and all their continuity up to point X is intact", and there you go. What exactly is stopping them?
What we can't have is the original Legion back and have it's continuity square with the mess that DC has made of the rest of their universe. But I could care less about that. We've done the "something resembling the original Legion but with their history changed to fit with our current version of the present DCU" thing repeatedly since Crisis. Why should I think this is any different?
Isn't funny that they brought back a multiverse and seemingly revived every major pre-crisis world in more or less their original form except for Earth 1 which they now insist was reborn in New Earth. Thus New Earth is as mishmashed and convoluted as it was in 1987.
They brought back Earth 2 complete with missing Kryptonians and even brought back the Captain Carrot funny animals with everything intact and picked up the story years later. That's different from the Legion where what they're doing is no different that what divided the LSH fanbase in the first place.
Legion in Action may turn out to be a neat story but the fact is their focus is rewriting the past instead of giving us new stuff.
From: Canada | Registered: Apr 2005
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quote:Originally posted by Blockade Boy: Not knowing the "current" run all that well, is it possible that this is some "past" of the current Legion?
No, it wouldn't work. For instance: the Lightning Saga Legion's Star Boy is a white guy who is currently a member of the JSA who calls himself Starman. But the threeboot Legion's Star Boy is a black kid. They're both Thom Kallor of Xanthu. (For that matter, the threeboot Legion is generally younger than the Lightning Saga Legion.)
Set
There's not a word yet, for old friends who've just met.
posted
quote:Originally posted by Matthew E: They could absolutely do that if they wanted to. As long as, you know, they didn't use the word 'Superboy'. That would be the only problem.
They're supposed to be his friends, they can get away with calling him Clark, or Kal, and even have worked with him at some point before his public outing as 'Superman' in the 20th century, thanks to the wonders of time travel and telepathy.
It wouldn't grossly violate the *theme* of the Legion of Super-Heroes to have them be inspired by Superman's legacy, and have teamed with him a time or two, or pulled him into the future (and then, at his insistence, removed his memories of that future, rather than risk messing up history) even with the 'no Superboy' dictat from Mrs. Siegel. It would basically be housekeeping, shuffling a few minor details around to accomodate both the past continuity and the current legal nincompoopery going on.
Registered: Aug 2006
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Alright just to throw this out there... if, hypothetically someone brings back the legion excatly as it was before the First Crisis... then what... either you keep telling the same stories again (in which case you may as well go back and re-read those stories), or go ahead and advance the story - in which case there will inevitably be someone who says well that's not my legion, that's not what they will do. The point is, its impossible to have the legion be what it was. The only way for that is to copy the old stories verbatum...
I'm not trying to defend DC, they've screwed up their fair share. All I'm saying is there's no such thing as a static comic book. You look back to pre-crisis comics, look at superman, etc... its all different. It's all changed over time... The legion has not had the opportunity to grow nearly as organically, because of the re-boots, but nonetheless... you can't expect the same things...
My point is that when all is said on done people shouldn't stress this much over continuity. It all comes down to how a good a story is. It should be judged first and foremost for its inate worth... Is it a good story?
-rant over-
-Alex
-------------------- Currently getting caught up on my Legion history by reading the Post-Zero Hour Legion.
From: Arlington, VA | Registered: Dec 2006
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Well, sorry but...how about picking up after the Crisis and then telling all new stories that don't involve -
1. Changing people's backstory (this includes Superboy, just don't write about him until you can use his name again. Show him in flashbacks, etc. Just don't say the name. Plus, Wildfire in Red Tornado's body?, "Sensor Girl" + Karate Kid?, sexually ambiguous Dawnstar?, etc.)
2. Changing everyone's costume. Start with the Perez/Giffen/Lightle costumes (and then, if you want, change them over time...).
3. Make the future totally and completely change since the last time we saw anything around LSH vol. 3 #18 or so.
Evolve and tell good stories from there (or pick another spot in the past). Simple, easy.
Why must everyone re-invent the wheel and change everything so drastically? The problem I'm having the most with all of these 'boots, except possibly the Reboot era and the Cartoon (First Season) is that the future of 1000 years from now has to be bleak and ultimately (for me) uninteresting.
When you read ADVENTURE COMICS #247, you want to join Superboy and his adventures in THAT future. When I read the current writers visions of the future, I want to stay home cause I'm bored with it all. Been there done that and there's nothing there to snag my imagination.
Writers who mine the past never want to take us (and the characters we love) along on new directions. They want to see just how much they can change and warp everything we knew about them and then tell us the same old story, over and over, and over again.
[ November 01, 2007, 09:18 PM: Message edited by: Nightcrawler ]
From: San Diego, CA | Registered: Jul 2003
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-------------------- "My dance card was getting fuller than a contestant's at a Jandan shurg-off." - Exnihil, The Lost Klordny
From: Frederick, MD | Registered: Aug 2003
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I agree with Nightcrawler generally - particularly on the bleak future angle, but I don't feel this Legion, at least the little I've seen of it, is so "drastically" changed compared to the original.
C'mon guys, how long has it been since the origin of the Legion was this close to the original? I say it's been too long and this origin is pretty close. 3 kids from the future go back in time and make Clark Kent a Legionnaire. So, the kid is not Superboy. We can't have Superboy. That fact alone, name or no name, means there's no way we can have the original "origin" back intact.
How drastically altered is the 3boot Legion compared to this or the "classic" one? Way too drastically I'd say. And no, I'm not down on the 3boot (except a few parts of it), I actually like it. But admittedly it's the most far removed from any Legion version of the past, even the Archie Legion.
I don't know what Saturn Girl's characterization is in this issue, haven't read it yet, but I feel it's something minor.
As for me, I'll say it once again, nothing would make me happier than have the 3 boot, and an "adult" Legion book starring the Lightning Saga Legion and the cartoon based comic.
From: Somewhere in the Multiverse | Registered: Apr 2006
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Seeing the old Legion logo on the cover made me smile.
I wonder if the red s-shield-looking doohickey in space had anything to do with the sun being red. Looks like whatever was "discovered" in the arctic turned Superman into a non-alien with Smallville as his "birthplace." Hope Juun came to his senses before pulling the trigger.
It did strike me as odd that Clark didn't recognize Brainy more quickly, but I could see time travel + a post-hypnotic suggestion being easier to overcome when you are dealing with someone in person. And it helped introduce the Legion idea. Their first meeting was good too. I easily got the vibe that each of the Legionnaires were really excited to see Clark (and not just so they could flirt). Clark's reaction was pretty endearing, as was much of his depiction. It's nice to see someone depict him as he should be.
It seemed something made Brainy's time bubble programming go off course. I hope the whole arc isn't about finding where he is, though. Looks like the Cosmic Boy Death League got into the old HQ. Good to see they're still around.
I was glad to see Colossal Boy in the first set of Legionnaires. And he even had a few lines. His new costume was nice and functional (Dawnstar's too). I'm glad it didn't have that extra head thing. Wildfire's though, I don't know. He looked naked.
Can't wait to see who's in the next issue--maybe we could even have separate threads for these issues
From: Portland, Oregon | Registered: Jul 2003
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As was said, I didn't get why Clark did not recognize Brainy, since he just spent time with some Legionnaires during Lightning Saga. He spoke with such pride as having been a Legionnaire, and what they all meant to him. I could also see him wonder if the figure inside the robot was Vril Dox of L.E.G.I.O.N. for a moment...
Also it was wierd how Perry berated Clark for not having more friends at the Planet... Helllooooo!!! He's married to your other star reporter????!!! Not that Clark bothered to even call or see Lois before taking off to the future.
Lightning Saga really conveyed Clark's appreciation for what the Legion was to him, a place to belong, since he truly was "different" as a kid. That scene in LS where he says simply "We were Legion" made me want to stand up and say "YEAHHHH" with my fist in the air! But this first meeting with the founders really seemed to make Clark seem extra needy, begging to come along. They bent the laws of space and time to say "Hi" to their hero and then turn around and leave??? Why didn't they at least ask him for an autograph?
It also didn't make sense that Clark remembered visiting the future "between classes" and non-school days. Duh people, time travel here... you can always set the coordinates a few minutes here or there so that's not a problem (even Marty McFly figured that one out in the first Back to the Future movie). Seemed like an unnecessary explanation to me.
So this issue takes place a month after LS for Superman, but it's been almost 7 months since anyone in 3008 has seen Brainiac 5 (based on the time references made by Dawnstar and Colossal Boy).
And Awkward has it right, Wildfire did look naked. Funny thing to say about an energy being, but it seemed like his uniform had a "peek-a-boo" aspect to it.
Gary Frank's art is great, unless we're getting extreme closeups on faces. Dawnstar did look to be in her 40s and teenaged Imra had big ol' bugs eyes.
Despite my minor compliants, I'm really pumped about this story arc!!!!! It may not be the pre-Crisis Legion, but it'll do until something better comes along. LLL!!
-------------------- Craig C.
- Time travel stories are told in chronillogical order.
From: Santa Ana, CA | Registered: Jul 2003
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quote:That scene in LS where he says simply "We were Legion" made me want to stand up and say "YEAHHHH" with my fist in the air!
Amen!!
A poster over at the DC Boards said that this Superman in Action and the Superman in Lightning Saga aren't one and the same, since there are several "Supermen" around what with 52 Universes and all. I haven't followed Supes' titles recently, but was under the impression that it was the same Superman in Action and JLA.
From: Somewhere in the Multiverse | Registered: Apr 2006
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quote:Originally posted by jimgallagher: Man! There is NO pleasing some people. And I thought I was a harsh critic.
I don't get it. There seem to be so many people hating the artwork and writing on this story (which, overall, I quite liked) and raving about the same on the SLSH #35 story, which doesn't appeal to me at all. I have to go read them both again to see what everyone loves/hates so much.
Oh I prefer by far the Action Comiss story to the very disappointing Bedard run. I'm not a big fan of Gary Frank, but I prefer by far his clean pencil to Calero's confusing artwork.
-------------------- Ze Frainch Legion fan
From: Edinburgh, Scotland | Registered: Oct 2004
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Mike Grell's cover (uncolored) for Action #861 is up at the Catskill Comics site (link posted by CC over at comicboards.com/superboy). Legion vs the "Justice League" of the 31st century.
Nice cover but have I ever said how much I loathe this neo-Nazi stuff? Well, I'm saying it now.
From: Reimagined Trom | Registered: Jul 2003
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